Police Stop, Handcuff Every Adult at Intersection in Search for Bank Robber

I'm sorry, I don't think the theory that they could have actually called in enough backup to tail all those cars without endangering anyone holds any water. They either would have just let him drive away, or did what they did. They pointed a shotgun in people's faces? Could you please point to the source that said this happened? I missed that bit. Or are you exaggerating to make it sound worse than it was? Which is common in these sorts of threads. Was handcuffing them necessary? Not sure.. I wasn't there, I'll wait for the full story before jumping to conclusions - like all these cops were simply on a power trip.

So in this modern age, in your opinion, there is NO precedence to do something out of the ordinary to apprehend a possibly dangerous criminal, if it means it at all impedes on someone's rights? I guess we'll have to differ there. I think Americans as a whole are pretty damned whiny personally. Spoiled and arrogant. We have the right to do ANYTHING. We should revolt immediately if our rights are in ANY way obstructed. Even if the intentions were good. But it won't matter, you like many, assume without knowing the individuals involved, without even knowing the full story, that they were tripping out their testosterone / juice induced need to be bullies, and were putting guns in people's faces simply because they could. Assuming the worst - because it's the in thing to do for all poor, abused, downtrodden Americans who have it oh so rough.

You act as if this will set a precedence, and we'll start seeing intersection blockades where everyone is handcuffed. I don't think we'll see this sort of thing again for a long while, unless another unique situation like this happens again.

reply to post by TsukiLunar

Right... so the process of elimination is pulling over and searching each vehicle? I guess that about ends this discussion.

This isn't the first time you threatened to "end" the discussion. Your advocacy of violating peoples rights just so cops can play Dirty Harry is alarmingly heartless and cruel. Your insistence that the only way the police could have possibly caught these bank robbers was by shoving guns in several innocent peoples faces, handcuffing them and then placing them in extreme danger while they looked for a bank robber would be amusing if it weren't so dangerous.

I have a question. What are the odds that the perp was in the very last car? You know what that sounds like to me? They a: never found him and came embarrassed at the melee they were causing so fabricated an arrest. Or b: they initiated a checkpoint there and detained everyone that came along, including the bandit (eventually). Since they didn't know who they were looking for, they just kept detaining everyone that came along (sort it out later).

Good thing they didn't receive another reliable tip down the block . And the next, and the next.

"Yourall under arrest. Everybody is going down town."

We should see more of these bizarre type events now that anyone can be detained for any length of time for no reason. It's just more efficient as far as they are concerned. Besides, who knows? they may come up with something else like a traffic warrant or tiny bit of weed. Either way they are Justifying their budget and staying busy. Training rookies and whatnot.

reply to post by intrptr

What are the odds that the perp was in the very last car?

The exact same odds as if the perp was in any other car.

reply to post by mysterioustranger


Jon badelk vs the state of indiana, the US supreme court ruled " a citizen has the rite to resist unlawful arrest up to and including taking an oficers life."

Now why can I kill a cop to stop him arresting me for no reason, but it is ok to arrest 40 people on no information of any kind?

That makes no sense at all, I for one would have resisted, which is my right, and yes I would have eventually gone down, but not before I took 3 or 4 of these punks to the hospital with me. Not to mention, that they would have never gotten consent to look through my car, and when they tried, handcuffs or not, we would be going back to square one.

If anyone with any balls would have been there, the headline would read.

Police shoot man for not allowing illegal search for unknown assailants on tip he was in unknown car, of unknown make, model and year, suspect was wearing? Suspect was a ? Wearing? In possesion of?

That is in no way probable cause of any type, what's next? We know a suspect was hiding inthis city, we had no description, but we got a reliable tip he is in this city, so we are going to arrest everyone, until we find sombody that fitsour description so we can blame thison them, because doing our jobs with millions of dollars and thousands of oficers is to hard the old fashioned way.

reply to post by reddwhite

That makes no sense at all, I for one would have resisted, which is my right, and yes I would have eventually gone down, but not before I took 3 or 4 of these punks to the hospital with me. Not to mention, that they would have never gotten consent to look through my car, and when they tried, handcuffs or not, we would be going back to square one.

And it would have been completely and utterly pointless. Not only would you be dead, but you would be defamed for killing cops and possibly some civilians via stray bullets.

At least you weren't searched. Congratulations, I guess.

reply to post by fleabit

I'm sorry, I don't think the theory that they could have actually called in enough backup to tail all those cars without endangering anyone holds any water. They either would have just let him drive away, or did what they did.

You're not making police officers and police departments look any better with that insistence. The only way police can do their work is through the willful violation of peoples rights and profound disregard for the Constitution they swore an oath to protect and defend is your theory, is it?

hey pointed a shotgun in people's faces? Could you please point to the source that said this happened? I missed that bit

Why don't you just be honest and admit that you didn't bother to look for that bit. Had you bothered you would have found that "bit" here:

"Cops came in from every direction and just threw their car in front of my car," said Sonya Romero, who was one of the drivers handcuffed. "We all got cuffed until they figured out who did what." Ben Barker watched the ordeal and told 7NEWS police were armed with shot guns and rifles. "We didn't know if we were in the line of fire or what the hell was happening," Romero said.

Here:

Nearly two dozen cars were detained at the intersection of Iliff Avenue and Buckley Road Saturday afternoon as police—with guns drawn—searched each vehicle for a man who had just robbed the Wells Fargo bank at 15301 E. Hampden Ave. According to witnesses, the adult occupants of the vehicles were handcuffed and led away from their cars after reports the suspect might have taken hostages. “Cops came from every direction and just literally threw their cars in front of my car. They pinned them off there, they pinned them off in the parking lot, they pinned off here so literally nobody could go anywhere,” said Sonya Romero, who was detained. “We had to throw our hands in the air.” Pictures from the scene show police officers armed with shields and weapons as they made contact with each car. Adults were handcuffed and led away. Children that were present followed.

You could have found that "bit" here, and here, but I guess you were too busy analyzing "theories" to bothered in checking for facts.

You might want to consider becoming an Aurora police officer, from what I hear they're not real big on facts either.

"Cops came in from every direction and just threw their car in front of my car," said Sonya Romero, who was one of the drivers handcuffed. "We all got cuffed until they figured out who did what." Ben Barker watched the ordeal and told 7NEWS police were armed with shot guns and rifles. "We didn't know if we were in the line of fire or what the hell was happening," Romero said

Wow, that's awful. I hope all the cops get fired for violating the oath they were sworn in by.

Originally posted by TsukiLunar
Your the type of person who at a road block will sit there for ten minutes and lecture the cops. Your the type of person who when pulled over during a search for robber, will pointlessly assert your rights even when its counterproductive and makes no sense to do so.

Really, you know this about me how? I understand being upset because I pointed out that you failed to read the US case law provided for you but resorting to a personal attack is childish.

I never pointlessly assert my rights - I use my judgment. The judgment of a trained and tested combat veteran of Special Forces. I use the judgment gained in just under 6 years of combat time spent out of the last 15 to determine when and how to react to any given situation. I'll just roll with what I have in that regard - thanks. I would likely be dead had I been at that intersection as I would have been armed. I bet they'd have shot first and figured out their story latter.

Originally posted by TsukiLunar
No one wants to be searched, however I would give consent for it because i am willing to put up with it for public safety and because otherwise it makes no practical or logical sense to refuse.

Your rights are there to protect you, that does not mean that you have to mindlessly assert them every chance we get.

Am I to understand that you are of the "if you have nothing to hide" crowd - good for you... I hope your trust in the police works out for you. As for me until my rights are finally eroded because of the willingness of you and people like you to cede yours for the convenience of the police - I will assert them.

Let me ask you a question – had these individuals gotten away what could possibly be worse than 19+ innocents dying in a firefight?

Rights assertion aside the problem here is just poor judgment for one thing, poor leadership and poor decision making.

Placing all those civilians at risk was not worth letting them go and with good police work catching them in a more isolated location. Hell even in Afghanistan we didn’t round up whole intersections to find one target. The indignation of the people would have made more enemies than the benifit of taking down the one or two HVT’s ever would have.

They endangered everyone at that intersection, civilians, men, women and children by placing them in the potential line of fire for an engagement with armed criminals. I’ve seen enough needless death in my lifetime to know which is which – the risk was not worth the reward here.

You want to cede your rights, you go ahead – me I’ll keep mine.

Originally posted by TsukiLunar
reply to post by intrptr

 

What are the odds that the perp was in the very last car?

The exact same odds as if the perp was in any other car.

"Yes officer. Thankyou sir. No, of course I don't mind at all. Right away. I see. Okay. Thankyou. You too."

I done that dance so many times when I was homeless. Yes sir. Yes thank you. Oh, go right ahead."

Try differing with the slightest "suggestion" Bang! Resisting (if not physical harassment). When they are good and done searching you, running you and inspecting every aspect of your business then and only then might they "let you go" for now, with a warning.

Keep it clean.
Be careful.
Have a nice day.

Yah, see ya (thank god thats over).

My experience is that sometimes they are just bored out their minds and need some distraction or training practice. Who better than live targets? I can't tell you how many times I seen that.

Ya know, if one of those citizens had been robbed at an intersection, you'd be lucky if they showed to take a report. One unit. And twenty minutes to a half hour wait.

But a BANK gets an angry hornet response and then everybody is stung for miles around. Even we, right here. Thats why they do these things. The ripples of the horror of it all spread far and wide and that is by design.

Good police work. Now... everyone is more afraid than ever.

It would be a cold day in hell before I would have allowed them to "detain" me and search my vehicle. They damn sure would not have placed me in handcuffs either and if they did it wouldn't have been because I was being detained while they searched me and my car. No it would have been for disobeying a lawful (yeah....okay) order or resisting.

My statement may sound extreme but when we are faced with extreme violations of our rights then our only recourse is extreme action in return. Someone has to stand up for what they believe in at some point and the sooner we all start doing it the sooner we will start to show them that we are not going to allow ourselves to be subjects to their tyranny.

Frankly I don't give 2 #s if DHS or any other alphabet agency is monitoring this site or any other that I visit, we are entitled to voice our disgust at our corrupted tyrannical government. Unless of course our first amendment has been repealed.

The right of the people to be free in their possessions and to be free from illegal searches and seizures of their property without due process of law or probable cause is the cornerstone of our individual freedoms. The polices "reliable tip" that provides no description of the suspect or get away vehicle in no way supports probable cause. The USSC has repeatedly ruled that probable cause must be supported by factual evidence and not merely a hunch.

"Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our will within limits drawn around the rights of others. I do not add 'within the limit of the law' because law is often the tyrants will and is always so when it violates the rights of the individual."~Thomas Jefferson

"......That all men are created equal and endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights. Among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness......and that governments have been formed among men to secure those rights"~United States Constitution

So our government that was formed to secure our rights persistently violate these rights in the name of serving the law. The police and government serve the bankers and international corporations at the expense of therights of the people whom they are sworn by oath to serve.

This story is just more proof of the tyrannical police state that we live in.

Originally posted by RealSpoke

"Cops came in from every direction and just threw their car in front of my car," said Sonya Romero, who was one of the drivers handcuffed. "We all got cuffed until they figured out who did what." Ben Barker watched the ordeal and told 7NEWS police were armed with shot guns and rifles. "We didn't know if we were in the line of fire or what the hell was happening," Romero said

Wow, that's awful. I hope all the cops get fired for violating the oath they were sworn in by.

Don't take this personally, as this isn't in any way directed at you, but I absolutely laughed out loud when I saw that!
I do know what you were saying, but there will be no firings. No inquiry. A bunch of limited invitation press briefings where the police justify what they did. There won't even be any 'administrative leave' levied. We will be told that there will be "an official inquiry." That means that they will do absolutely nothing at all.

If you really look at the story (and I'm not directing this at RealSpoke, but to ATS in general), there's an 'anonymous tip' and then the police search everybody without warrant.
"Somebody" said "something" about "something" - according to the police - so they acted. Someone said something, apparently.
Okay then. That seems to be in order. /sarcasm
Or is it? The public were not assisting the police in any way, they were just in the way. Treating them as guilty until proven innocent is a violation of human rights. That this was done with impunity by the PD is beyond shocking. They are there to serve the public good. They did no good to the public (the public were not harmed by the robbery).

People were detained against their will with no probable cause (other than that the police were looking for "someone in a car"). That's hardly a lead. However, the police will all go to bed tonight with a smile on their face because they caught the bad guy... They simply don't understand how their actions were terrifying to the general public. It doesn't occur to them.

Law enforcement is about enforcing laws, not breaking them. No amount of flowery language will convince me otherwise. Either the law is not to be broken, or it is. If it is, the LEOs have no right to pick up a wage. Sure it's a dirty job sometimes, but in the general scheme of things (like living in a society), it's no more important than my job or your job. If I break the law in the course of doing my job I will be arrested. If the police do it, they get some time off on full pay until the shouting stops. There are lots of amazing cops out there. They are the ones who don't let the dirty cops get away with anything. The guilty party here is way up the food chain.

BREAKING NEWS:

New York city police have sequestered an entire city block of a heavily populated
section of downtown New York in a dragnet operation aimed at apprehending a bank
robbery and murder suspect.

Police are going door to door and searching homes and businesses for an adult male
between the ages of 25 and 40 years old with a "black widow" tattoo on his left hand.

Captain J. Randolph said in a statement earlier today,

"I am personally sorry for the inconvenience to my fellow New Yorkers. But this
police action is absolutely necessary to apprehend this dangerous suspect."

He further stated that all cell phones (which had originally been confiscated) had
been returned to their rightful owners...and that the continuing door-to-door search
would be over by no later than 11pm est.

And this story coming on the heels of a similar incident in Aurora Colorado yesterday,
where police officers detained 19 vehicles and their passengers for nearly two hours
while they they successfully apprehend yet another bank robbery suspect.

It is reported that all parties detained in both police actions willfully agreed to allow
police to search and/or detain them until the accused robbery or murder suspect could
be arrested.

Originally posted by mysterioustranger
Nope. Legal detention and public safety preceeds individual rights. They were released right? Then there was no offense on the part of legal detention.

Bull#, this is the propaganda that they want you to believe. You can not be searched and your property cannot be seized without a warrant and probable cause issued on affidavit and just cause.

They continue to overstep the bounds of their authority and we continue to let them. This has to stop, and unfortunately it is becoming increasingly clear that it is not likely to stop without blood shed...

Jaden

You know what, you guys are right.

Here is a new headline for how it should have happened.

Police Watch Silently As Armed Suspect Drives Away

reply to post by intrptr

What are the odds that the perp was in the very last car?

I see what you did there....

Very good.

reply to post by Thunderheart

From the outside this story reads like: Cops were too busy (read: lazy) to follow the silly law of the land.
That old piece of paper (barely worth mentioning really) called your "Constitution" was simply inconvenient at the moment, so of course the protectors of law ignored it.

I'm not sure, but since the right to bear arms equals and ensures freedom in the U.S. (I learned this here on ATS) maybe the disenfranchised citizens didn't carry enough guns at the time?
Maybe those citizens looked like disarmed euopeans and thus instantly lost all their rights... just saying.

Originally posted by TsukiLunar
You know what, you guys are right.

Here is a new headline for how it should have happened.

Police Watch Silently As Armed Suspect Drives Away

That's right, because the news agencies would have easily picked up on that. They would have somehow known that the police received a tip from a "reliable source" that the bank robbers were at a traffic light where 18 other cars were and then they would have swarmed to the scene to witness the bank robbers of unknown gender and race, not even clear which car they were in, drive away, and then the news agencies would rush to their offices where editors would come up with the headline you propose.

You're a real piece of work.

reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux

You're a real piece of work.

Thank you, I try. Glad you liked it.