The Truth about "New Agers"

Originally posted by artistpoet
New Age refers to the New Age of Aquarius - bye bye fish hello water bearer or Angel in some myths.
At it's best it seems like a renaissance of many ancient ideas and new ways of thinking and expressing those ideas.
I really hope it is the dawn of a Golden Age
But I am keeping my feet on the ground connected as I can be to Earth and to Nature

The Hippies back in the 60's who were so excited about "The Dawning of the Age of Aquarius" were misinformed.
The prediction they were using was based on the wrong zodiac.

I put more stock in Sri Yukteswar's "The Holy Science" -- the Age of Aquarius is more than 2,000 years away.

Things are NOT going to get better in the present Dwapara Yuga. Yes, there are enormous advances in science & technology, but much of it will be used badly -- to enslave & control the masses further.

During the present age the numbers of the Children of Light and the Children of Darkness are equal or 50/50. This means there's no resolution to the conflict, but continuous turmoil.

Two thousand years from now when the Age of Aquarius dawns (Treta Yuga), the numbers change: 75% of the Earth's humans will be Children of Light and 25 % will Children of Darkness. Then the Children of Light have the numbers needed to begin to overpower the Children of Darkness.

What I am afraid of is that things are getting so bad here that humans may not be around 2,000 years from now.

* I want to add here: the reason it seems that many more people are waking up now is because they are. Let me explain.

We are still at the beginning of Dwapara Yuga (take a look at the year 1789 -- a pivotal year), so many are carrying on the values of Kali Yuga when the Children of Darkness were 75% of the population and only 25% were the Children of Light. The Children of Light were really persecuted during Kali Yuga -- many burned at the stake, etc. -- had to go underground.

The full 50% of the Children of Light have yet to wake up from Kali Yuga. That's why it seems like more & more people are waking up. Because they are. But it won't be enough in this Age to take over the planet.

Originally posted by Xaphan

Originally posted by smarterthanyou
You are a joke, but I am glad you reared your ugly head into this thread because it is ignorant morons like you that are an example to others of why they should keep an open mind. If you were to be given a choice at the start of a new "golden" age to evolve into a higher consciousness I'm sure you will choose to stay where you are. Good for you.

C'mon man, is that really necessary? I'm not a new ager, but I am fairly spiritual, and if you were spiritual at all you'd realize that insulting people isn't an effective way to get your point across. Behaving like that won't make anybody listen, it will do the exact opposite and drive them away.

I have nothing against you. I'm just saying that the demeaning "I'm more advanced that you!" attitude doesn't really accomplish anything. Isn't that what has caused humanity so many problems in the past and present?

Well said, Xaphan. I would give you several stars if I could.

Originally posted by DJW001
reply to post by b3l13v3

 

A lot of what we feel and believe is in synchronicity with Buddhism.

No, it's not. In fact, much of the New Age movement is diametrically opposed to Buddhist teachings. Buddhism seeks to end suffering by renouncing desire, including the desire for enlightenment itself. Its practices are rigorous, disciplined and austere. The ultimate goal is the direct experience of reality through penetrating delusion. This results in the realization that the "self" does not exist. On the contrary, the New Age movement panders to to ego by introducing ever more attractive delusions. Its methods are not disciplined or rigorous, and generally the opposite of austere.

The New Age movement is largely a marketing scheme; it is used to sell crystals, videos, "holistic health" products and other material goods. It reinforces the ego's desires and causes the ego to become more firmly entrenched. For further arguments, see Chogyam Trungpa's "Cutting Through Spiritual Materialism." Choggie wasn't a very good Buddhist, but that book is a good introduction to the difference between spirituality and the New Age movement.

Excellent, DJ. You cut thru the bs quickly -- "the New Age movement panders to to ego by introducing ever more attractive delusions."

Originally posted by sylvie

You're hitting the nail on the head. I'm a "recovering New Ager," having decided to want nothing to do with this stuff about ten years ago, and to find my own way. What cured me was that I lived in Sedona, AZ, the New Age Mecca, for 2.5 years and got to see the real truth underneath the thin New Age patina.

At first I was totally smitten by those nonjudgmental, lovely people who would be so outgoing and wonderful, loving everyone, caring about everyone, proclaiming unity with all living beings, and so forth. It didn't take long, though, to find out that the majority of them were only good at talking the talk, but not walking the walk. For most that I met, New Age philosophy was a form of escapism from harsh realities they didn't want to deal with. And the love & light attitude only went as far as arm's length, really. I didn't meet one person who would actually be willing to help someone in need if it at all inconvenienced them, or assist a downtrodden person by listening to their problems. More likely, if you had a real-world problem, your New Age buddies would stay away from you so they wouldn't be "contaminated" by your negativity. Most couldn't even be trusted to be anywhere on time for an appointment.

Also, the most mentally and emotionally disturbed people I've met were all New Agers. Now I'm starting to understand why. I just recently read the unbelievably great book "Words to the Wise" by adept Manly P. Hall. Written in the 1960s, it is just as timely today -- if not more -- than it was when it was written. Every New Ager and budding occultist should read this. Amazon link

In this book, he explains that in the ancient mystery schools, new students wouldn't even be accepted until they had perfected themselves as much as possible in the everyday world, having learned temperance in all things, patience, charity, having achieved emotional and mental balance, and studied mathematics, astrology, and so forth. He really blasts the New Age movement and points out that New Agers, unlike the mystery students of old, believe they can take all kinds of shortcuts to the highest goal. "Enlightenment in 15 Lessons," so to speak. It's really a wake-up call, but a very, very necessary one.

So true. You have laid out what is wrong with the "New Age" movement -- it's rife with fraud -- phoney "spiritual" teachers who are trying to make as money as they can from the credulous, the ignorant, and the desperate.

So much of what they teach is just wrong -- I could do a whole thread on Reiki as it is taught in the US.

Because I'm an occultist, some would call me a "New Ager"

I've thought of doing a thread on the "New Age", but the outline alone would go for pages. I really don't have the time to monitor it either.

Originally posted by InfoKartel
reply to post by 1littlewolf

 

Wow. Feel better after your tanty? I know nothing makes me feel better than an enormous rant full of nothing but unsubstantiated opinion

Unsubstantiated?

Yeah, you know, kinda like those who give a one word reply to another's statement with an smiley face emoticon but then don’t have any facts to back up their statement

Many old scriptures contain valuable messages at their core, but are applicable to a time period very different from our own. Hence it is necessary to pt a slightly different spin on them.

There you go. That's how you create propaganda. It's simple really; do not alter the message, instead, try to understand it.

There’s always the risk that unscrupulous folk will do this – such as what many of the early churches did with Jesus’ teachings which then became the New Testament. But then propaganda is just as easily created with no ancient scriptures at all.

As for destroying history, well that is just laughable.

Laughable? Do you know how many times I've corrected new agers with their nonsense about Zoroastrianism and Zartosht? It's laughable that you, who are ignorant of history is telling me there is no destroying of history at the hands of you new agers.

I work in the field of science, and I often correct people who think they know something about it but have fallen way short of the mark. I do not believe that this is a reflection on the science itself, nor do I believe that through their ignorance they are ‘destroying’ science. I find this is merely a reflection on the people themselves

Destroying reason?

Yes, reason. If you cannot comprehend this then it's too late for you. If you see reason in the new age teachings about indigo kids, channeling, aliens and whatnot, be my guest. Live your life like that. Tell us how you do. I know people who are in their 40s, 50s, 60s who were disconnected in their youth due to many kinds of trauma or lack of trauma even, then went on to believe all kinds of nonsense new age bullcrap(by buying books, putting money in charlatan pockets), and now, their kids are suffering. Worst thing of all, they think they are teaching their kids the proper way of life. Are you a witness to these things? No. But you sure love to speak in defense of these lunatics.

I do not deny there are many people within the realm of what we are calling the ‘New Age’ that are far gone with their orgone negative energy converters and their instant chakra realignment crystals, but these sort of people would be long lost anyway. If due to their traumatic experiences they hadn’t become fixated on New Age Theory then no doubt they would have become fixated on something else. You see it all around you – extremist Christians, those who live only for money, those who are obsessed with beauty, crazy cat ladies; the list is endless. And yes I feel very sorry for the children of any of these people.

But there is more to this universe than that which can be measured by today’s science, or that which can be picked up by our senses, which themselves are only tools with limitations. Science and spirituality are edging ever closer, and the world is heading toward a point where it must change else the results will be cataclysmic. Sensible New Age Theory imho will have an important role to play in this ‘New age’.

If you would like to know more about my view on the matter see my original post in this thread.

reply to post by smarterthanyou

If you were to be given a choice at the start of a new "golden" age to evolve into a higher consciousness I'm sure you will choose to stay where you are.

Straw man argument. But then again, new agers are usually not that intelligent to understand how to form proper arguments since your heads are stuck in the clouds and your feet are not grounded in reality.

The thing about us, is, we can use science to our benefit along with the other knowledge we have.

So you are saying, that only you new agers, can use science in accordance with other knowledge that you may have read on the internet? That's a bad joke dude.

Most scientists use only science, however folks like Richard Hoagland are becoming wise to the greater existence that is here on this planet and he is all the wiser from it. you will be eating your words eventually so none of this matters.

I'll be eating my words? I'll pen down your avatar name and come 2013 I'll make sure to send you a PM to ask if you've ascended or not.

I especially loved this post of yours:

if you've been listening to david wilcock lately, he is the epitomy of how we should all seek greater knowledge, and do it while being loving to one another and having a true interest in the great mystery. hes also unlocked some amazing secrets lately and is on to something big. 2012 is going to be a very important year for humanity.

Which is of course, nothing but horse manure. Keep idolizing known charlatans, I mean, it's not like you could research their history and see they've been repeating the same stuff year in, year out. No way you could apply a scientific research into their claims and see they are wrong. No way...! I mean, it was only you who could use science in accordance with other knowledge correct?

Grow up kid.

reply to post by 1littlewolf

Yeah, you know, kinda like those who give a one word reply to another's statement with an smiley face emoticon but then don’t have any facts to back up their statement

It was implied that substance is all around the argument. The argument comes forth from experience. That's why it is funny you ask me to substantiate it, because, it has already been substantiated by the experiences I've had.

Facts? Which facts do you want? Which charlatan of the new age do you want me to take of the pedestal so that you may have your facts?

There’s always the risk that unscrupulous folk will do this – such as what many of the early churches did with Jesus’ teachings which then became the New Testament.

If you read Jesus' teachings in the new testament and apply the teachings in your life, then you would have a right to say what you just did, because then, you would have experienced the truth and power in those teachings.

But then propaganda is just as easily created with no ancient scriptures at all.

That's where most new age stuff comes from, the realm of imagination.

I work in the field of science, and I often correct people who think they know something about it but have fallen way short of the mark. I do not believe that this is a reflection on the science itself, nor do I believe that through their ignorance they are ‘destroying’ science. I find this is merely a reflection on the people themselves

Not only a reflection upon the person, but also on the field of research and on science as a whole. But those are matters far too complex for this time.

but these sort of people would be long lost anyway.

Isn't the point to have as few lost people as possible? Then why propel these new age ideologies?

If due to their traumatic experiences they hadn’t become fixated on New Age Theory then no doubt they would have become fixated on something else.

And there is your disbelief.

You see it all around you – extremist Christians

Only those who have not read the Bible.

those who live only for money

Only those who disregard the teachings of the Bible.

those who are obsessed with beauty

Also those who disregard the teachings of the Bible.

crazy cat ladies

What did they ever do to you or others?

And yes I feel very sorry for the children of any of these people.

You should feel sorry for yourself.

But there is more to this universe than that which can be measured by today’s science, or that which can be picked up by our senses, which themselves are only tools with limitations.

Faith has no limitations.

Science and spirituality are edging ever closer, and the world is heading toward a point where it must change else the results will be cataclysmic.

No they are not. Science is actively keeping spirituality at bay. Or did you think wireless internet is good for your body? Try using a laptop every day while placing it on your lap, you'll have great difficulties reproducing. Try using a mobile phone every day, speaking while keeping it to your ear all the time, I've heard that not so great results will be begotten after some time.

Sensible New Age Theory imho will have an important role to play in this ‘New age’.

For anything to be sensible the root must be known. You try and get to the root of the "sensible" new age theories then tell me where you ended up at.

Originally posted by AuranVector

Originally posted by artistpoet
New Age refers to the New Age of Aquarius - bye bye fish hello water bearer or Angel in some myths.
At it's best it seems like a renaissance of many ancient ideas and new ways of thinking and expressing those ideas.
I really hope it is the dawn of a Golden Age
But I am keeping my feet on the ground connected as I can be to Earth and to Nature

The Hippies back in the 60's who were so excited about "The Dawning of the Age of Aquarius" were misinformed.
The prediction they were using was based on the wrong zodiac.

I put more stock in Sri Yukteswar's "The Holy Science" -- the Age of Aquarius is more than 2,000 years away.

Things are NOT going to get better in the present Dwapara Yuga. Yes, there are enormous advances in science & technology, but much of it will be used badly -- to enslave & control the masses further.

During the present age the numbers of the Children of Light and the Children of Darkness are equal or 50/50. This means there's no resolution to the conflict, but continuous turmoil.

Two thousand years from now when the Age of Aquarius dawns (Treta Yuga), the numbers change: 75% of the Earth's humans will be Children of Light and 25 % will Children of Darkness. Then the Children of Light have the numbers needed to begin to overpower the Children of Darkness.

What I am afraid of is that things are getting so bad here that humans may not be around 2,000 years from now.

* I want to add here: the reason it seems that many more people are waking up now is because they are. Let me explain.

We are still at the beginning of Dwapara Yuga (take a look at the year 1789 -- a pivotal year), so many are carrying on the values of Kali Yuga when the Children of Darkness were 75% of the population and only 25% were the Children of Light. The Children of Light were really persecuted during Kali Yuga -- many burned at the stake, etc. -- had to go underground.

The full 50% of the Children of Light have yet to wake up from Kali Yuga. That's why it seems like more & more people are waking up. Because they are. But it won't be enough in this Age to take over the planet.

edit on 15-5-2012 by AuranVector because: to add comment

Lol - I was not referring to the Hippies and that annoying song Aquarius
I was stating what the new age is.
I did not state specific dates
The New is the Age of Aquarius
Age as in processional cycle of ages
I do not know the calender you quote or it's doctrine

EDIT TO ADD - I do hope it will be a golden age

reply to post by InfoKartel

Yeah, you know, kinda like those who give a one word reply to another's statement with an smiley face emoticon but then don’t have any facts to back up their statement

It was implied that substance is all around the argument. The argument comes forth from experience. That's why it is funny you ask me to substantiate it, because, it has already been substantiated by the experiences I've had.

Hmmm…..I take it by your answers further down that you yourself are Christian. Well in my experience I have found many Christians to be the most snooty, judgmental people I’ve ever had the displeasure of associating with. But then you wouldn’t accept my experiences as fact now would you….

Facts? Which facts do you want? Which charlatan of the new age do you want me to take of the pedestal so that you may have your facts?

You have either totally misunderstood my point or you are purposefully trying to be slippery. Either way it doesn’t surprise me.

What I meant is where are your hard facts that the New Age belief system is “seeking to destroy history and seeking to destroy reason". Your claims are nothing but a collection of ridulous extremism, stereotyping and bigotry

There’s always the risk that unscrupulous folk will do this – such as what many of the early churches did with Jesus’ teachings which then became the New Testament.

If you read Jesus' teachings in the new testament and apply the teachings in your life, then you would have a right to say what you just did, because then, you would have experienced the truth and power in those teachings.

I have read most of the Bible and all of the New Testament. I have the utmost respect for Jesus as a very enlightened man for his time and I do apply many of his teachings in my day to day life. Matthew 7:1 - Judge not lest ye be judged - seems especially applicable to everything you’ve said throughout this entire thread.

However very few if any of the books of the New Testament were written by the disciples themselves. Most of them were written centuries after the fact by the early churches of the time in effort to big note themselves, and therefore can only be relied upon as a mere an ‘indication’ of what Jesus may have taught. Kinda like your claims about New Age Theory and ancient scriptures
Source

But then propaganda is just as easily created with no ancient scriptures at all.

That's where most new age stuff comes from, the realm of imagination.

Sorta like Christianity you mean? Just because it came from the imaginations of men who lived a few millennia ago does not make it any more legitimate. Besides at least by combining the imaginings of many different belief systems you have a greater chance of hitting the mark of what may be the ultimate truth. Besides, if it wasn’t for human imagination we would still be living in hunter/gatherer tribes picking berries and eating raw animal flesh.

I work in the field of science, and I often correct people who think they know something about it but have fallen way short of the mark. I do not believe that this is a reflection on the science itself, nor do I believe that through their ignorance they are ‘destroying’ science. I find this is merely a reflection on the people themselves

Not only a reflection upon the person, but also on the field of research and on science as a whole. But those are matters far too complex for this time.

This again is merely your unsubstantiated opinion

but these sort of people would be long lost anyway.

Isn't the point to have as few lost people as possible? Then why propel these new age ideologies?

Another attempt at sidestepping the point instead of addressing it.

The point is to figure out the true nature of the universe we live in on both a physical and metaphysical level.

If due to their traumatic experiences they hadn’t become fixated on New Age Theory then no doubt they would have become fixated on something else.

And there is your disbelief.

Have no idea what you’re talking about here

You see it all around you – extremist Christians

Only those who have not read the Bible.

In my experience the extremists are the ones who can quote the entire Bible verbatim

those who live only for money

Only those who disregard the teachings of the Bible.

2 words – Catholic Church

those who are obsessed with beauty

Also those who disregard the teachings of the Bible.

Except on Sundays

crazy cat ladies

What did they ever do to you or others?

If you are attempting to be humorous to make up for your complete inability to carry on a serious debate then you have sorely failed

And yes I feel very sorry for the children of any of these people.

You should feel sorry for yourself.

This is interesting; and it would be nice to actually get a straight answer though I won’t be holding my breath.

Why on Earth should I feel sorry for myself?

But there is more to this universe than that which can be measured by today’s science, or that which can be picked up by our senses, which themselves are only tools with limitations.

Faith has no limitations.

Agreed

Science and spirituality are edging ever closer, and the world is heading toward a point where it must change else the results will be cataclysmic.

No they are not. Science is actively keeping spirituality at bay. Or did you think wireless internet is good for your body? Try using a laptop every day while placing it on your lap, you'll have great difficulties reproducing. Try using a mobile phone every day, speaking while keeping it to your ear all the time, I've heard that not so great results will be begotten after some time.

You seem to be confusing science and technology. In any case you’re still wrong as humans in societies where such medical technologies are available are living longer than we ever have at any given time in history despite our unhealthy life styles.

Sensible New Age Theory imho will have an important role to play in this ‘New age’.

For anything to be sensible the root must be known. You try and get to the root of the "sensible" new age theories then tell me where you ended up at.

The onus is on you for making the claim. So tell me, where do we end up?

reply to post by 1littlewolf

Hmmm…..I take it by your answers further down that you yourself are Christian. Well in my experience I have found many Christians to be the most snooty, judgmental people I’ve ever had the displeasure of associating with. But then you wouldn’t accept my experiences as fact now would you….

Which experiences would that be?

Would they include the fact that these new age books and crap have been around for quite some time? Promising the same things over and over? Because that's an experience I'm talking about. It's not mine, but it's evident to me.

What I meant is where are your hard facts that the New Age belief system is “seeking to destroy history and seeking to destroy reason". Your claims are nothing but a collection of ridulous extremism, stereotyping and bigotry

I already brought in the fact about Zartosht but that went over your head. Believing in invisible galactic federations? Altered versions of history? Not enough to constitute destroying history or reason? Then just wait a couple of years until you experience it yourself.

Sorta like Christianity you mean?

Matthew 7:1 - Judge not lest ye be judged - seems especially applicable to everything you’ve said throughout this entire thread.

If judging your phony baloney galactic federations and versions of history as one should, and telling people outright that its root is in marketing, moneymaking and downright enslavement - to prevent the spread of disinformation and misinformation...is bad...then I'll gladly be the devil.

Remember that you have already judged the idea of a Christian and placed that image onto me

Sorta like Christianity you mean? Just because it came from the imaginations of men who lived a few millennia ago does not make it any more legitimate.

Look, if you truly want to believe what Wilcock and the like are shoveling, then be my guest.

Besides, if it wasn’t for human imagination we would still be living in hunter/gatherer tribes picking berries and eating raw animal flesh.

Yeh yeh generic bullcrap. Here's a little thing that people have imagined up and you're a victim to: Marketing.

This again is merely your unsubstantiated opinion

Er, no, you're simply too immature of mind to understand certain implications.

Another attempt at sidestepping the point instead of addressing it.

The point is to figure out the true nature of the universe we live in on both a physical and metaphysical level.

Don't make me laugh. You twist history then claim you're searching for truth!

In my experience the extremists are the ones who can quote the entire Bible verbatim

And those who follow its teachings are what to you?

2 words – Catholic Church

Yes, catholic church...you will find they have a lot in common with the bullcrap new age beliefs. Both of whom I dislike.

Except on Sundays

You're not talking about me are you? I dislike the charade people put up on Sunday for church as well. That's why I don't attend any of those that you are talking about.

If you are attempting to be humorous to make up for your complete inability to carry on a serious debate then you have sorely failed

You bring in the crazy cat lady and you claim to carry on a serious debate? A SERIOUS DEBATE? What a joke...

This is interesting; and it would be nice to actually get a straight answer though I won’t be holding my breath.

Why on Earth should I feel sorry for myself?

To feel sorry for another person(pity) takes away the strengths of the person you're feeling sorry(pity) for.

You seem to be confusing science and technology. In any case you’re still wrong as humans in societies where such medical technologies are available are living longer than we ever have at any given time in history despite our unhealthy life styles.

Oh yes they do live longer. Tell me more about how there is a cure for cancer. Or the common cold.

The onus is on you for making the claim. So tell me, where do we end up?

You're obviously hungry for answers, do the searching yourself and you'll be a lot more satisfied with your meal.

reply to post by b3l13v3

For me, the "New Age" is a hope, for just that a NEW AGE, because we all know the one we're still mired in, the materialist, self-centered one, to put it succinctly, sucks.

For me it's an age of spirit AND reason, of logic AND intuition, of left and right brain re-joined. It's something both very old and very new. It's the kingdom of heaven close at hand, even still.

The OP says that the "New Age" belief system is rooted in Buddhism, but it really includes all the traditions. Personally I approach the "enlightenment" from the perspective of what might be called a mystical, evolutionary Christianity.

But there's nothing wrong with seeking a new age, and wanting humanity to pass into the next phase in our evoluton as a species, which is and will be of a psychological and spiritual nature.

Is there a "hippy-ish" quality to much of new age thinking and philosophy? Sure there is, and in my books there's nothing wrong with that either. Hippies are interesting, down to earth people, with big open hearts, and we need more people like that.

Best Regards,

NewAgeMan

Hmmm…..I take it by your answers further down that you yourself are Christian. Well in my experience I have found many Christians to be the most snooty, judgmental people I’ve ever had the displeasure of associating with. But then you wouldn’t accept my experiences as fact now would you….

Which experiences would that be?

The experiences I and others I know have had at being looked down upon and excluded or gossiped about in a demeaning fashion because I am not a Christian

Would they include the fact that these new age books and crap have been around for quite some time? Promising the same things over and over? Because that's an experience I'm talking about. It's not mine, but it's evident to me.

I have never denied that there is a hell of a lot of New Age crap out there as can be seen in my earlier replies. But then take a stroll through a Christian book shop sometime and you’ll find just as much crap written in the name of your religion

What I meant is where are your hard facts that the New Age belief system is “seeking to destroy history and seeking to destroy reason". Your claims are nothing but a collection of ridiculous extremism, stereotyping and bigotry

I already brought in the fact about Zartosht but that went over your head. Believing in invisible galactic federations? Altered versions of history? Not enough to constitute destroying history or reason? Then just wait a couple of years until you experience it yourself.

No it did not go over my head and I addressed your point in my remarks about science. You can’t destroy history for it has already happened. Reason…? It is up to the individual to demonstrate his own reason and pick and choose that which seems reasonable and logical. A lack of such reason is not exclusively demonstrated by some of those within the New Age school of thought but is evidenced through every aspect of humanity. Christianity provides a very good turn out when it comes to those displaying a lack reason.

As for invisible Galactic Federations, I don’t recall mentioning that anywhere in my posts but it seems slightly more likely than a talking snake, a man who can turn water into wine or a god who creates men out of clay.

Sorta like Christianity you mean?

Matthew 7:1 - Judge not lest ye be judged - seems especially applicable to everything you’ve said throughout this entire thread.

If judging your phony baloney galactic federations and versions of history as one should, and telling people outright that its root is in marketing, moneymaking and downright enslavement - to prevent the spread of disinformation and misinformation...is bad...then I'll gladly be the devil.

Remember that you have already judged the idea of a Christian and placed that image onto me

As a non-Christian I am under no obligation to follow the words of the Bible verbatim. You are. But I have as mentioned above never mentioned a Galactic Federation and the fact that you are making this up and then attributing it to me only goes to show how tenuous your argument really is.
As for marketing, I have never denied there are those out there who only wish to make a fast buck on the gullibility of others. This again is evidenced in all aspects of humanity and is certainly not limited to the New Age school of thought.

Sorta like Christianity you mean? Just because it came from the imaginations of men who lived a few millennia ago does not make it any more legitimate.

Look, if you truly want to believe what Wilcock and the like are shoveling, then be my guest.

I have no idea who you are talking about but attributing every New Age charlatan to me is like me linking you to the Westboro Baptist Church

Besides, if it wasn’t for human imagination we would still be living in hunter/gatherer tribes picking berries and eating raw animal flesh.

Yeh yeh generic bullcrap. Here's a little thing that people have imagined up and you're a victim to: Marketing.

I have very few New Age books and have never donated any cash to some random wannabe New Age website with a paypal account. Again another sweeping generalisation in an attempt to try and score points in your very sad counter argument

This again is merely your unsubstantiated opinion

Er, no, you're simply too immature of mind to understand certain implications.

Your words were ‘Not only a reflection upon the person, but also on the field of research and on science as a whole. But those are matters far too complex for this time.’ This is clearly an opinion and name calling in my opinion is itself something that immature people resort to when they have nothing substantial to say.

Another attempt at sidestepping the point instead of addressing it.

The point is to figure out the true nature of the universe we live in on both a physical and metaphysical level.

Don't make me laugh. You twist history then claim you're searching for truth!

Please explain how I have in anyway twisted history. Aren’t you getting tired of making up lies and trying to attribute them to me in what can only be described as a very sad attempt to win points?

In my experience the extremists are the ones who can quote the entire Bible verbatim

And those who follow its teachings are what to you?

It really depends on which teachings you and your ilk choose to cherry pick at any given moment

2 words – Catholic Church

Yes, catholic church...you will find they have a lot in common with the bullcrap new age beliefs. Both of whom I dislike.

I believe you will find the beliefs of the Catholic Church are far closer to those of Christianity as a whole than New Age beliefs, you know, with them being Christian and all.

Except on Sundays

You're not talking about me are you? I dislike the charade people put up on Sunday for church as well. That's why I don't attend any of those that you are talking about.

Well its good to know that despite the fact that you’re quite willing to ignore the Bibles teachings on judging others but you will happily dress down for Sunday Service to demonstrate what a good little Christian you really are

If you are attempting to be humorous to make up for your complete inability to carry on a serious debate then you have sorely failed

You bring in the crazy cat lady and you claim to carry on a serious debate? A SERIOUS DEBATE?

What a joke...

I brought up crazy cat ladies along with a number of other examples to demonstrate my point about unhealthy obsessions which are evidenced throughout humanity. Though yeah, through your complete inability to actually address my points without resorting to name calling or making up lies and then attributing them to me I do not consider this a serious debate anymore.

This is interesting; and it would be nice to actually get a straight answer though I won’t be holding my breath.

Why on Earth should I feel sorry for myself?

To feel sorry for another person(pity) takes away the strengths of the person you're feeling sorry(pity) for.

This makes no sense at all

You seem to be confusing science and technology. In any case you’re still wrong as humans in societies where such medical technologies are available are living longer than we ever have at any given time in history despite our unhealthy life styles.

Oh yes they do live longer. Tell me more about how there is a cure for cancer. Or the common cold.

Why bother. The point I made about people living longer due to advancements in medical technology is fact. There’s nothing you can say which will disprove this.

The onus is on you for making the claim. So tell me, where do we end up?

You're obviously hungry for answers, do the searching yourself and you'll be a lot more satisfied with your meal.

So in other words you’ve got nothing.

reply to post by 1littlewolf

The experiences I and others I know have had at being looked down upon and excluded or gossiped about in a demeaning fashion because I am not a Christian

Then I am sorry that you had to experience that at the hand of people pretending to be Christians. I've been lucky enough to meet some very lovely Christian people who, when I questioned matters that I thought were not okay or when I questioned and researched history, they didn't take offense, no, in fact they went into dialogue with me in which I learned from them and they learned from me, both growing wiser. I did not sense anyone looking down on me, rather, I sensed an insane amount of caring for and even some looking up to me, while I regarded myself as the small person.

I have never denied that there is a hell of a lot of New Age crap out there as can be seen in my earlier replies. But then take a stroll through a Christian book shop sometime and you’ll find just as much crap written in the name of your religion

I don't subscribe to a religion, I rather call it faith. And that faith of mine has kept me from those fake Christians, it has shown me to the smallest detail how Christian bashers work, it has shown me how certain religions take advantage of Christ's teachings. All of that, those books they sell for money...is not Christianity. I can't count the number of books that I have gotten, for free mind you, from those who I am honored to call Christians.

As for invisible Galactic Federations, I don’t recall mentioning that anywhere in my posts but it seems slightly more likely than a talking snake, a man who can turn water into wine or a god who creates men out of clay.

Parables. Metaphors. Things that go over your head.

As a non-Christian I am under no obligation to follow the words of the Bible verbatim. You are.

False.

This again is evidenced in all aspects of humanity and is certainly not limited to the New Age school of thought.

But then again, you haven't looked at the root of your new age bullcrap, which has charlatans and delusional with god complex characters rewriting stories of the Bible and presenting it as "new age". Twisting parts of history to make it seem that their writings are of earlier origin.

I have no idea who you are talking about but attributing every New Age charlatan to me is like me linking you to the Westboro Baptist Church

You can't link me to them because they are not Christians! However, all those new age charlatans are in on it together so they CAN be linked to you.

Again another sweeping generalisation in an attempt to try and score points in your very sad counter argument

Root.

This is clearly an opinion and name calling in my opinion is itself something that immature people resort to when they have nothing substantial to say.

Your failure to comprehend it is your own mistake, not mine. Name calling? That's weird how you get that from a piece that's innocent in nature and only explains that, let me use a metaphor, "ripples in water at the shore could be there because you threw a rock in the water."

It really depends on which teachings you and your ilk choose to cherry pick at any given moment

Obviously, you have never met people like me before so for you to talk about "my ilk" is tedious at best.

I believe you will find the beliefs of the Catholic Church are far closer to those of Christianity as a whole than New Age beliefs, you know, with them being Christian and all.

And so your ignorance shows itself. The Catholic church couldn't be further away from Christian ideals, what with money laundering for criminal organizations, pandering to the mafia, saying condoms increase the spread of STDs etc.

Well its good to know that despite the fact that you’re quite willing to ignore the Bibles teachings on judging others but you will happily dress down for Sunday Service to demonstrate what a good little Christian you really are

I know your brain is fried from all that new age nonsense, but I specifically stated that I do not dress down, nor do I attend sunday service, nor do I have any intention to prove how much of a better christian I would be(since I'm not baptized) compared to the next person. I just know that there are Christians and there are those who pretend to be Christians.

This makes no sense at all

That is because your mind is still young. Maybe at age 50 or above you'll understand.

Why bother. .....will disprove this.

The sky is blue. There is nothing you can say to disprove this.

So in other words you’ve got nothing.

Here's where I stop casting my pearls to the swines.

Originally posted by AuranVector

Originally posted by sylvie

So true. You have laid out what is wrong with the "New Age" movement -- it's rife with fraud -- phoney "spiritual" teachers who are trying to make as money as they can from the credulous, the ignorant, and the desperate.

hooooray i agree totally it is so easy to con people with it all easy .

they make a mountain out of a mole hill a freind who is not a friend anymore told me how easy it was to slate the government and twist something that makes sense when it is all a lie ... he said and i cannot mention a name said
these people are all sheeple and told me how to make plenty of ze money by picking anything at all from food to tablets just about anything . he basically finds a ingredient or substance and spoon feeds lies around it i am not going into it but basically a ten year old can do it..he said most of the time he just distorts the truth and just spices the story up adds things.he said nibiru made him thousands elenin chemtrails etc after he told me he got a nasty trip to the hospital if you catch my drift. von danniken liar hoagland liar icke plays around with the facts twists things when you are hooked in i am ITK the ones you have to watch out for are your basic terrorists child molesters rapists and your fellow man who has no morales walking on our beloved planet earth forcing the hand of the government to censor the internet spice up the big brother situation etc. whoever follows these charlatans are sheeple FACT! wake up people you are being fed BS for money attension etc. yes the government lies yes i know . lets all just get hippyfied act like the ELOI and let everything turn to dust after your REVOULTION which will be pandemonium looters thieves think . yes life sucks under the government but it would suck even more when all thses wronguns are on the loose like madmax book of eli times when the hippies would rather sit suck back on a spliff and hug a tree. wanna know what i think lets take the bible just for a second here, it is said a good 80 or 90 % of us will be decieved yes well lets just say we all go new age start a revoloution what if just what if it is a way of ushering in the devil to make an appearence as maybe a leader of the resistance because he needs the majority then of course he would have all these followers . WHO HAS EVER THOUGHT OF IT LIKE THAT??. It would be the perfect plan perfect.. excuse spelling i am still at work and i just needed to post this fast.

Interesting thread. Two things that come to mind though are:

1. I always thought the term New Age represented the goal of the adherents- to bring a new age of spirituality to the world. I thought of it as a contrast to the dark age that we seem to be in.

2. I think it's a bit presumptuous to state that all new age people feel one way or another. I get what you are saying, and I like it, but I know of some people who wouldn't necessarily agree with it all, but who classify themselves as new agers as well. When there isn't a doctrine there tends to be diversity of belief- so I think your thoughts are part of the new age paradigm, but not necessarily the totality of it.

Still, all in all I like the thread. It is important to not let the nay-sayers be the only ones to define a group- as is often the case with the New Age movement. People only know what they here, so your efforts are of great value. Happy day to you, and keep the faith.

reply to post by woodwytch


You are a witch? Do your spells work? Can you prove that you actually help people achieve knowledge of their past lives? Have any of them pointed out things from their past life that unearthed tangible proof for your successful "regression" claim? If so, there's a million of James Randi's bucks waiting for you.

By the way, is there any evidence to your claims or is it more on the grounds of role playing/wishful thinking woo?

reply to post by denver22


You criticize new agers and gullible fools for taking information at face value without evidence. Ok good and agreed, but suddenly at the end of your rant you paraphrase some biblical prophecy stating 80-90% of people will be deceived.

What the HELL, man? You just put yourself in a worse category within the gullible, face-value fools; the HYPOCRITICAL gullible, face-value fool.

reply to post by InfoKartel


Hey InfoKartel,

I won’t deny that I too have met some Christians who are genuinely beautiful people. But it not for you to say who is and isn’t Christian, just like I cannot exclude every hippy with an Orgonite negative energy converter from the New Age movement. If it wasn’t for the Roman Catholic Church the fact is Christianity would not be as widespread as it is now, and may very well have perished in its early days.

People within the RC Church or the Westboro Baptist Church may well represent the very worst of Christianity, but the fact is they are following their interpretation of Christ’s teachings which by definition makes them Christians, no matter how warped those interpretations may be.

It is my belief that the New age Movement itself is something very positive for the world as its lack of structure allow us to take the very best spiritual teachings from a number of different belief systems and integrate them in a way with which then allows us to get closer to the ultimate Truth. This lack of structure allows us to leave behind a lot of the negative baggage associated with many belief systems whose origins lie in a time and place very different form our own, but I fully agree that it also allows many con artist and charlatans to take advantage of those who are not of a sound mind.

I am not surprised that most of the people whom who claim to be representing the New Agers are a little loopy, but then you yourself shouldn’t be surprised that most of the Christians I have met have been quite judgemental – especially towards those from a non-traditional spiritual background. We are all humans, and we all have our flaws.

Hopefully though you can see some potential within the movement if it were to be championed by those who are of sound mind and use a bit of logical discernment. Because ultimately I believe we all want the same thing – a peaceful happy world and some measure of understanding as to what lies beyond the physical realms.