The "Divided" States of America

I have been thinking about this for awhile and I have a lot of mixed feelings. I am not sure where this post should go so if I put it in the wrong place, Mods please correct.

How did Our “United States” become the “Divided Citizens”? I look at all the turmoil and people fighting and arguing over philosophies and it breaks my heart. I guess what hurts me the most is the intuitive knowledge that we are this way because someone made us this way…it was on purpose.

The oldest trick in Warfare is to “divide and conquer” and boy…it sure does seem easy to to get the “divide” part done. We will argue and bicker and fight over some pretty mundane things….and when the fox is in the henhouse…we get even worse.

It’s not a secret to some on the political boards that I am a Libertarian and though I do not agree with some of Ron Paul’s platform, the underlying message…the part “I hear” anyway…is very important.

We are a Constitutional Republic and we should behave as such…the new laws being quietly passed and new ways of restricting Liberty is…quite frankly…alarming to me…
What is more alarming is the amount of people that are complacent about it…think it’s ok or maybe even a “good thing”…and I totally disagree…if it’s not “in” the Constitution or an Amendment to the Constitution…then it does not apply.

I saw in another thread where someone thought that the idea of empowering the states was a bad idea…that it would be a return to times past and slavery would return, women’s rights would diminish and civility would suffer. I totally disagree. I think the states should be allowed to do what is best for their citizens with the Federal Constituion….aka…the protection of ALL citizens… being the spine….no state can make a law that conflicts with the Bill of Rights…pretty simple.

Then I started thinking….where did this weapon of division come from? I personally think it began back in the 30’s, when we were coming out of the depression…when companies were doing anything and everything to get people to spend their hard earned money…they gave us reasons to want to ‘express ourselves”…to “one up your neighbor”…etc. It’s pretty sad but it seems about right.

You know, the idea of what a real Republic is started in ancient Greece…in those days…folks had food and a place to stay…that was a given…beyond that…you were on your own. If you wanted social status…you better fight well, breed animals well, grow great crops or compete in the Olympics…. notoriety was NOT a given…. but life was.

What happened? When did we decide that every aspect of life was a competition? When did we decide that in order to feed your family you must be willing to kill (figuratively or literally)? When did we choose to embrace the animal and let go of the human? It is an animal instinct we persue when we compete…and that is ok…but the parameters must be adjusted…the Greeks created the “Olympics” to deal with this “need” to compete. Why do we make it life or death?

It’s sad folks…it is sad. This division has been engineered….going back nearly a century….to a time of the Robber Barons that were so upset at Theodore Roosevelt that they set into motion the grandest coupe ever plotted…they knew eventually they could break us down…and apparently…they were right. We are cannon fodder for the new age of Robber Barons…just look around you. If you don’t get it…well…I am not here to argue. I am just worried and concerned…I completely and whole-heartedly belive that those that do not remember history are doomed to repeat it…and here we are…about a hundred years later…perilously in the grasp of a new age of Robber Barons….and we are so split and divided….no one seems to notice.

I don't want us to head into a civil war...I don't necessarily want a full on revolution...I want common sense and civility. How can we re-unite when there is so much implanted division....and trust me...it was created and implanted....a century ago. I love this country, I love the grand experiment it represents that was...till recently....extremely successful....will you vocalize and say "No, we are one nation"....or will you allow the dividing powers to continue?

Division is easy to accomplish in a "melting pot" society. We are not homogenous by any stretch of the imagination, and were never encouraged to be "one nation". Throw a bunch of immigrants from all over the world together, encourage them to keep their culture and language, kow-tow to them in their native languages in government paperwork and school, and you have an already-divided population which can be whipped into a frenzy against each other at a moment's notice.

When they weren't immigrants, they were divided by skin color and encouraged to have their own cultures that are exclusionary towards others.

The only way we will pull together as one is if the S hits the F, a bunch of people die, and there is a common enemy. Without that common enemy, it will be as if a bunch of wild tribes sprung up, and petty squabbles and turf warfare will be commonplace.

It is the nature of the beast. Our government does its best to make sure that we see each other as the enemy, rather than itself. Every time people start to pay attention to the corruption and crimes, something stupid and divisive like the Trayvon fiasco gets pumped up and thrown in our faces 24/7.

there is a few treads here that explain why usa is not a country,the people were tricked into believing it is.the state were you were born is your country,each state is a country,and when they made the international agreement to unite for a greater good but that unity has been compromized and empowered a portion of people over the people of all 52 countrys.here is one link ,read on, he does a good explanation on the subject.www.abovetopsecret.com... ,sometimes lumping all up is also a bad idea.unity.

I once watched a documentary, I don't even remember what it was about exactly, I only had certain parts of it echo in my mind with impact.
There was a woman speaking at one point, she was explaining that during the Cold War, in our extreme concern about Communism, we considered how to best defend our people, especially our younger generations, from being influenced and indoctrinated into Communist philosophy.

The solution, they thought (again, I am fuzzy on who "they" were) was to put emphasis in education and culture upon individuality. To put great focus on the rejection of social conscience, of collectivity, or following any authority other than oneself. Children were taught not to trust anyone else, not to be concerned about anyone else- pay attention to what you are doing only- do not look at your neighbor! If everyone else was jumping off a cliff, would you do the same???)

Developing egocentric thought was the defense system or vaccination against Communism.

Unfortunately, this caused a breakdown of shared cultural values which normally act as the bonding glue between a peoples- each man to himself and no shared values or norms makes them disintegrate as a group. This weakened the nation as a whole. The only shared value was "do not stick together".

She said, by the time they realized their mistake, that they had destroyed the nation they were trying to preserve, it was too late.

Then a generation later the Culture Wars began, in which people, unable to rid themselves completely of the natural social animal instincts, and need to belong to a pack of some sort, began forming smaller subcultures.

Eventually, with the threat that became clear after 9/11, those subcultures pulled together somewhat, with a common enemy, into two factions... two extremes.

I have absolutely no hope for the nation now and believe it is doomed to fall, as houses divided tend to do.

Originally posted by FissionSurplus
Division is easy to accomplish in a "melting pot" society. We are not homogenous by any stretch of the imagination, and were never encouraged to be "one nation". Throw a bunch of immigrants from all over the world together, encourage them to keep their culture and language, kow-tow to them in their native languages in government paperwork and school, and you have an already-divided population which can be whipped into a frenzy against each other at a moment's notice.

When they weren't immigrants, they were divided by skin color and encouraged to have their own cultures that are exclusionary towards others.

The only way we will pull together as one is if the S hits the F, a bunch of people die, and there is a common enemy. Without that common enemy, it will be as if a bunch of wild tribes sprung up, and petty squabbles and turf warfare will be commonplace.

It is the nature of the beast. Our government does its best to make sure that we see each other as the enemy, rather than itself. Every time people start to pay attention to the corruption and crimes, something stupid and divisive like the Trayvon fiasco gets pumped up and thrown in our faces 24/7.

You are right, we are a victim of the information we have available to us. The Trevon Martin case....a tragedy...is a good example. The MSM...knew full well it was a polarizing topic...and they have milked and bled the people and divided them accordingly.

How is it that people cannot see this? i saw it within the first couple of days of endless BS....I knew it was another stab at a Rodney King riot....and speaking of that...isn't it clever he just "happens" to show up with a book and a lecture at this point in time?

it is not coincidence folks...it is a planned attack on our collective community..."they" want us to be divided....we are easy to beat into submission that way....

reply to post by Bluesma


Wonderfully stated. I would like to rise up and argue out of hope...but I cannot...much of what you said appears to be dead on accurate.

Consider this...there is this new commercial on msnbc where looney tune Chris Mathews talks about our infrastructure....wanna know a secret?...he is absolutely telling the truth...but ...like any political interest...has twisted the facts to make a point.

Our roads and bridges are a seriously sad state of affairs and if Americans knew the truth about it...they would be up in arms and crying foul...but they don't....why? because the truth has been turned into a political statement rather than just a statement of facts.

I work in Construction Engineering...it is what I do and have done for 28 years. We have problems...both great and small.

Here is a clue. Most public engineering works are designed with a 50 year lifespan....I will stop there...just start looking at your local infrastructure and when it was built....that will tell you all you need to know. One thing that the Chris Mathew commercial says is correct is 'the corporations are not going to hire people to fix these things, we the people must do it"...well that is correct.

I am just curious as to where we do these things. Do we wait till a bridge has been downgraded structually multiple times or do we wait till it fails and kills 1, 2 or 20 people? It WILL happen if we don't address it. So...what is more important? Protecting the future and maintaining our infrastructure?...or...squinching a dime and waiting till it fails and someone dies? I don't get what people want here....

Democrats and republicans are not really divided. They are basically the same. They just use controlled opposition as a front to maintain central power.

Under a system of seemingly opposing values and party loyalty, the political pendulum swings back and forth, but the fundamental direction in which we move never varies by more than a degree or two. In this manner, people are polarized into opposing groups that offset each other and the status quo is maintained.

Democrats, Republicans and almost all Americans are very simply authoritarians. It makes little difference if they are a red or a blue one. They may disagree among themselves about the minor details, but authoritarians of one sort or another constitute an overwhelming majority on both "sides".

They are the same. Both ideologies possess the conceit inherent in the desire to plan the lives of others and endorse an institution of force necessary to impose these plans on unwilling subjects.

Our choice is the Authoritarian party 2012.

yea and after debating with people in the various martin/zimmerman threads, i have come to a realization that environment and location help to mold ones thoughts/feelings.

the u.s is made up of different atmospheres, urban/rural/suburban democrat/republican rich/poor black/white/hispanic/mixed so depending on where you are from or grew up you may have different views on life. now that the economy is tanking i feel that the differences are being pointed out more, we are literally at each others throats.

i find it sad because when the tough gets going we should stand united in order to fix the present and future but instead we are divided more than ever.

Originally posted by conspiracy nut
yea and after debating with people in the various martin/zimmerman threads, i have come to a realization that environment and location help to mold ones thoughts/feelings.

the u.s is made up of different atmospheres, urban/rural/suburban democrat/republican rich/poor black/white/hispanic/mixed so depending on where you are from or grew up you may have different views on life. now that the economy is tanking i feel that the differences are being pointed out more, we are literally at each others throats.

i find it sad because when the tough gets going we should stand united in order to fix the present and future but instead we are divided more than ever.

Thank you so much for contributing.

I don't know how to get people's attention. I think...if they think...they will realize we are living in a gigantic and grand illusion...but no one wants to look and learn....so much easier to ignore....

Thank you for popping us back on the new threads board. I think we have a lot to say here and not many people will talk....I am afraid fear is a dominating factor....

but what is fear if you know what the outcome is?....If we fail, we will be imprisoned and the masses whipped into regulation....just live and be prepared to die....I am...I m not scared of the grey cloak....I welcome it....

Originally posted by Damrod
I don't know how to get people's attention.

People don't want to get too real, man. They just want to play the game.

reply to post by Bluesma


I never thought about it, but that documentary you watched is correct. Rampant individualism was the "cure" for a communistic ideal of being part of a greater whole.

Back in the late 80s they were having a book sale to get rid of all the old books clogging up the library at the University I was attending. Being a book fanatic, I picked up some old items. One was a "Scholastic Teaching Guide" titled "What You Should Know About Communism and Why", dated 1962.

Here is a quote from the introduction:

"As a historical phenomenon, as a political movement, or as an economic system, communism can be taught objectively through analysis and comparisons. But as an ideology, communism must be viewed as a system of human values. This is precisely the point the teacher should take a stand, for it is in the realm of human values, human freedoms, that communism poses its greatest threat. Students armed with the facts about communism must see how Communist methods undermine the dignity of the individual."

Copyright 1962 by Scholastic Magazine, Inc.

So we went 180 degrees in the opposite direction. Extremes never seem to work out in the long run.

reply to post by FissionSurplus


My comprehension of pure Communism is "the mob rules". There isn't a foundation of law as in a Republic where the few or even the one is given equal and fair rights. I know there are some folks out there that wonder why communism is such a feared and hated thing...well ...this is why. On the surface it sounds like Utopia...but it is not. Kinda like the Zeitgeist movement. I actually joined their mailing list to learn more about them....it is Communism with a twist. Sure, it sounds great and all...but once you get past the rose colored glasses view...you begin to realize that if you are a minority...either by race, religion or personal philosophy...you have no rights and you will be walked on.

I'm still really concerned about our future. I have thought and pondered and wondered about how to reach people, get them to engage their grey matter and actually think about the problems we face and the possible solutions...But it is as a poster above stated....it seems the vast majority of citizens would prefer to tuck their head in the sand and sing 'la-la-la-la" and not look around at what is happening. I suppose I understand to a point...it is a scary picture and can be downright depressing.

It's odd that the only thing that seems to temporarily unite us is disaster...isn't that freaking sad? Why can't we unite for something like...oh I don't know...food, shelter and energy? Well....there is a reason for that...it's called profit.

The new age Robber Barons do not want us uniting to solve problems...there is no profit in it for them....

I only hope that there is a little something to this supposed "awakening" that the fringes are saying is coming...maybe...if it does come...people will open their eyes and realize there is just some things we have to do for the good of us all...not just for a buck or two....it's a hope I have...

Originally posted by FissionSurplus

The only way we will pull together as one is if the S hits the F, a bunch of people die, and there is a common enemy. Without that common enemy,

Wow, by my take what you are hoping for is game over.

It is when nations are squeezed so tightly that ultimately find a common enemy and start culling
within. Somehow that "Common Enemy" is everywhere and this is used to further control, destroy
dissent and often times kill those who are not lock step with the common enemy idea.

The Soviet Union, Nazi Germany, many Middle Eastern and central American nations all
went through this process. America did for a spell and it was called the war on terror, if you recall

WITH US OR AGAINST US

That is the archetype of "common enemy" and it was used as an excuse to do horrible things,
it was the first and most vital attack on American liberty and it was all achieve exactly because
of a common enemy. It was text book and it follow a very proven psychological model, for
"what kind of patriot questions our war against our common enemy?" Usually a dead one or an
imprisoned one...

In this case a vast majority of people defer to the opinions of a few (the leaders and strategists)
which means those people are essentially disseminating and orchestrating struggle. Common
enemies are the best way to consolidate power, ask any military dictator..

reply to post by braindeadconservatives


Thank you for contributing...that was well stated. had hoped this thread would garner more passionate input but I guess....since I am a live and let live kinda guy and don't create volatility...it's too tame to get attention...thanks again....