What happens when the paper trail ends ?

First of all apologies to the moderators and forum users if this subject has been covered before but i felt the need to have your views on the matter.

It seems to me from all of the research done by many respected ufologists that documents (in paper form) had pretty much ended by the early to mid 1980's. We must presume that by then the U.S. (and other major governments) had switched to an electronic exchange of UFO related information.

This is where the problem starts. We find that we spend all of our time arguing over the same documents and cases that we have for the last 20+ years and the subject is stagnating.

New subject matter cannot emerge without documents so the endless bickering about the authenticity of files means the UFO community is fractured.

So what is the answer ? The tireless work of researchers such as Stanton Friedman is a method that cannot apply to cutting edge UFO research today. Obviously there has to be a way to reach the information through the legal system as nobody should have to suffer the fate of Gary Mckinnon in the search for the truth.

We need to have a new mindset and methodology to progress as a legitimate area of scientific study.

I would guess that even in the government they still produce hard copies and don't rely on soft copies. There is always a paper trail, important documents are always turned into hard copies in case the electronic one is erased.

Here's what we should do: stop caring about all UFO cases and wait for any aliens to say hi.

Even the best, most genuine UFO case is still "unidentified" which means whether it's alien or not is unknown. No UFO document, old or new, will prove aliens visit Earth. Even if the UFOs are piloted by extraterrestrials, what utility value is there if they never wish to interact? There's none. Ignore them and let them prove themselves when they choose to because there is no other way.

For what its worth, my dad is employed as the sole IT/computer guru at the local council. The council is small, but covers a large area, as a lot of rural councils do in Australia. There is no paper trails for their records. There is a variety of digital records, but no big filing cabinets full of documents.

I know this is a vastly different situation, but it leads me to agree with the OP. I think we can safely say that there is a lot of information being held from the general population, be it about UFO's or not, and probably always will be.

Then again, maybe there is deliberately no trail what so ever, be it paper or digital. Maybe loosing all proof and/or records keeps the biggest secrets.

reply to post by CrashRetrieval

In his book UFOs: Myths, Conspiracies, and Realities, John B. Alexander mentions that he called his UFO project the Advance Theoretical Physics Group in order to avoid the UFO label. He goes on to mention that he sought to minimize a paper trail so that material wouldn't later surface through FOIAs. This was happening in the early 80s.

If he was doing it, probably others were too. I think once government organizations saw their documents could be released, they probably got much better at keeping secret things off paper, or camouflaging them when it was necessary. There's just not going to be much released from the 80s onward as there's little paperwork to be discovered,

Originally posted by TheLegend
Here's what we should do: stop caring about all UFO cases and wait for any aliens to say hi.

Even the best, most genuine UFO case is still "unidentified" which means whether it's alien or not is unknown. No UFO document, old or new, will prove aliens visit Earth. Even if the UFOs are piloted by extraterrestrials, what utility value is there if they never wish to interact? There's none. Ignore them and let them prove themselves when they choose to because there is no other way.

edit on 6-4-2012 by TheLegend because: (no reason given)

While i truly dislike and hate what you type, I must agree, whole heartedly, that this is indeed the case. What practical or realistic value would be obtained even IF new documents or confirmation were to appear? If the ET's wish to not interact or make social contact, then let them be until they do.

But, OP, you do present a very, IMO, good question and point. They gotta keep everything on file or in the system or logged but must do so to minimize leaks or FOI requests. So how is it done and what can we do to obtain this newly secured information? Other than internal penetration, which you suggested, I'm at a personal loss for an answer. The legal route is great and all, but that is a route that is decided by them and their terms (them being the Elite, the Government, WHOEVER keeps this stuff hush hush) and as thus, they can prolong the process indefinitely with legal excuse. So how do we put the fire under their butt's? How do we obtain this information on OUR terms? Wish I had an answer but S+F for a very unique perspective and question.

Originally posted by TheLegend
Here's what we should do: stop caring about all UFO cases and wait for any aliens to say hi.

I agree.... we still don't know the truth about Roswell, certainly not one that everyone will accept

But if we stopped talking about them all those whistle blowers and ufologists like Stanton Friedman would be on the out of work list and ATS would become a ghost town, with their staff joining that out of work list


Tothe OP

The paper trail is there... governments exist for the purpose of creating and shuffling paper... then hire more people to put it onto digital, like they used to use micro film...

If they didn't have all this paper work they would also join the out of work list..

The problem is that all "We the people..." see is the old stuff that is now declassified and redacted so its safe to see

Re: Gary McKinnon.... that guy is a fool that couldn't even do a screen capture and he is still not in jail, ten years later. Gary is a non issue... just a red herring

Originally posted by CrashRetrieval
We need to have a new mindset and methodology to progress as a legitimate area of scientific study.

The UFO field is dead at the moment, and will be until some event happens that is free, open and available to the general public, and consists of more than one type of evidence. That would be:

* Multiple witnesses, none of them anonymous
* Multiple videos/photos of the event from different perspectives
* A physical artifact linked by a chain of evidence to the event
* The artifact determined by independent experts to be "not from this place or time"
* Confirmation of that by authorities.

It's pointless otherwise. It's all just chasing stories and lies. And these days we're buried in stories and lies.

Unfortunately, with the way our government is now, Gary McKinnon and groups like anon are our only chances at seeing any new info from our government's archives or wait the 50 or so years for it to be declassified.