Iran a threat to the US? A thought experiment.

Originally posted by phatpackage
reply to post by Shark_Feeder

 

Iranian propaganda BS. Another extremist left wing perspective. Been done to death already. The Iranian regime are terrorists who are going to get their own and lot of other people killed. The blood will be on their hands.

How is my statement propaganda? You are avoiding facts, and playing on emotion... the hallmark of propaganda. You can check my facts if you like, and then attempt a logical argument, but I won't hold my breath.

I smell a shill.....and this from a Registered Republican, genius.

Originally posted by Shark_Feeder

Originally posted by MrSpad
Thats an interesting map. So pretty much any place even a few US service men are gets tagged as a US base? One US base consists of few advisors, another has a signal unit, another a couple transport aircraft, another a transition hub.

Whereas in the US we are told that every petty group of fanatics, or nutty criminals is actually part of some multinational muslim effort to screw us over?

In this thread I am attempting to point out the hypocrisy of portraying Iran as a threat, when as I said earlier.... the US is "conducting operations" in almost every nation around them, and constantly pushing for more war in the region... we have them backed into a corner with no way out, but they are the threat?

Feel free to "correct" my North American map to only represent our "major" bases.

And the question is why is Iran hated across the world? Iran is not a direct threat to the US but is to all of its neighbors. Why do you think they want the US there? Its not like Iran has been sitting around looking pretty. They have been actively at war with the West and the Arab states for decades. It took a long time for Iran to push the world to where it is now. Even now it sees 40 years of its actions have gone unpunished because of the percieved weakness and lack of unity if its enemies. It is counting on that to continue and they just might end up being right.

Originally posted by MrSpad
And the question is why is Iran hated across the world?

Sources? Evidence???

Iran is not a direct threat to the US but is to all of its neighbors. They have been actively at war with the West and the Arab states for decades.

What are you on? They haven't declared war premptively in a century, and have only been to war with Iraq in that nearly that same time period.

Why do you think they want the US there?

You honestly think our military is wanted there?

It took a long time for Iran to push the world to where it is now. Even now it sees 40 years of its actions have gone unpunished because of the percieved weakness and lack of unity if its enemies. It is counting on that to continue and they just might end up being right.

What in the h*** are you talking about?

reply to post by IkNOwSTuff

Dear IkNOwSTuff,

Please don't misunderstand me, I certainly don't approve. I was only describing the situation as I thought it might appear. Iran is faced by an opponent that wants it to do certain things, Iran doesn't want to do them. What are Ahmadinejad's choices? He can't pretend there aren't any sanctions and soldiers all over the place, he has to deal with it.

I'm not pleased when my kid gets a snake bite, and I'm not happy with the snake, but I've got a situation that has to be resolved. And the facts are pretty clear.

I don't want to come across as ignorant or arrogant. Could you explain why you feel that way?

"America is here, do what we want or its sanctions/bombs for you"

Isn't that about how Iran is seeing things right about now? I think that's the message Hillary Clinton is trying to deliver.

This whole thread started as a hypothetical, a "what if." I'm trying to say that any government that is sane would look at the facts of the situation and choose it's course. Right now, the US is stronger than Iran, so if the US were in Iran's shoes the facts would be different. The US is strong enough so that it is the likely winner in any fight. Iran's leaders don't have that same certainty.

Might doesn't make right. Hitler had might, so did Stalin, and Mao, and Pol Pot. I'm not saying might makes right, but if you have an enemy much stronger than you, you tend to act differently.

I really hope Americans themselves do something about their runaway war machine of a government coz if they dont eventually the world will

That might happen, war weariness is a fact to be considered. I don't know how much demand there is in the US for an end to MIddle-East involvement, and I don't know how that would change if a new war started up. That's why the President has expensive pollsters.

Please feel free to correct me, if you think I've said something you can object to.

With respect,
Charles1952

Originally posted by MrSpad

Originally posted by Shark_Feeder

Originally posted by MrSpad
Thats an interesting map. So pretty much any place even a few US service men are gets tagged as a US base? One US base consists of few advisors, another has a signal unit, another a couple transport aircraft, another a transition hub.

Whereas in the US we are told that every petty group of fanatics, or nutty criminals is actually part of some multinational muslim effort to screw us over?

In this thread I am attempting to point out the hypocrisy of portraying Iran as a threat, when as I said earlier.... the US is "conducting operations" in almost every nation around them, and constantly pushing for more war in the region... we have them backed into a corner with no way out, but they are the threat?

Feel free to "correct" my North American map to only represent our "major" bases.

And the question is why is Iran hated across the world? Iran is not a direct threat to the US but is to all of its neighbors. Why do you think they want the US there? Its not like Iran has been sitting around looking pretty. They have been actively at war with the West and the Arab states for decades. It took a long time for Iran to push the world to where it is now. Even now it sees 40 years of its actions have gone unpunished because of the percieved weakness and lack of unity if its enemies. It is counting on that to continue and they just might end up being right.

Care to tell us what Iran has done? I mean other than what you may have just heard on the tube. Something with some proof please.

Originally posted by bekod
this is the same question asked of Germany in 37 is it a threat to Europe? well we all know what Germany did in 38' should we wait and see what the next 2-3 years brings or should we act now? this should be the question

I couldnt agree more, we need the world to unite coz its the only way we have any hope of beating this menace to humanity

P.s just to make sure were on the same page, you are talking about the USA arent you?

lol boy the propaganda is flying now.

reply to post by charles1952


Hey dude apologies for my poor wording, I assumed you were just stating the facts as they stand but wasnt sure.
I agree with you that your post is pretty much the way it is its just an unfortunate state of affairs put in place by arrogant and ignorant people.

Definately wasnt having a go at you

The USA is a threat to Iran. This includes the proxy-state of Israel.

They think that Iran is rising in power, but is not allied with them, and alliance is unlikely because too different. USA wants to increase its control over the Middle East, but Iran is like "no". Israel is obviously a lot closer to Iran, and they are in line with USA, and they don't like the idea of another powerful nation in that region of the world, as it could distort their place in global heirarchy.

Does this make sense? I think it sounds kind of childish when I say it like this. But it's all capitalist economics really. Money, power, regional controll. It is interesting to see USA and Israel not so cohesive here. Israel is very militant and has no problem with conflict, but USA is holding it back, because they know that Iran has a supporter in Russia, and would be chaos if they dared to invade Iran. It's all inter-connected. You cannot speak of a single country without mentioning another, this is of globalisation and international economic relations and such.

So, Israel and USA are synonymous. Iran is very aware of the USA's presence and influence in Middle East. This is why they look to, say, Russia, for support and alliance. And they get it. We're bros in how we don't like the USA politics. And they know that USA will not do anything confrontational and will not let Israel do this, for reasons I said above. It would be chaos, really, to break the stand-off.

reply to post by IkNOwSTuff

Dear IkNOwSTuff,

Not a problem at all. I was never offended and my writing isn't all that clear.

I don't think it helps anymore to try to figure out who's at fault. We could probably trace it back to Muhammad's conquering missionary parties 1500 years ago. Perhaps the excitement around this issue is basically everybody calling out "Mommy, he poked me first."

This situation won't go to a court, maybe it should. But for now, I'm just looking for both sides to say "Does it make any sense to do X when we know what the result will be?"

Anyway, I'm very glad you wrote back, nice to know you.

With respect,
Charles1952

Originally posted by MrSpad
Thats an interesting map. So pretty much any place even a few US service men are gets tagged as a US base? One US base consists of few advisors, another has a signal unit, another a couple transport aircraft, another a transition hub. It even has so called bases over a thousand miles away. Of course lets not let that get in the way of the fun. If I was a nation and almost every nation around me for thousands of miles was willing to let its bases be used to attack my nation, then the my first response would be to wonder just what had we been doing to turn the entire planet against us.

I think in reality and from Iran's perspective, yeah, even some advisers in a long term position would be a threat to plot of the map. Iran isn't stupid and they know a couple dozen troops in some small position can blossom in days to a couple hundred or within a week or two into more. Far more. So, if these were the positions of...say...Soviet Troop positions, I think I'd feel pretty threatened and pretty forced to do something as a nation.

I really have to think Soviet on the positions around the U.S. because it's the only comparison that crosses the size/power difference to really see this from Iran's side of things. We're orders of magnitude more powerful and larger than they are......and that is something that has to be kept in mind. It's funny but I can't think of anything more recent... It's been that long since the U.S. psyche, let alone MSM, has dared even suggest there exist a power on Earth that can really challenge us. That isn't the case..of course, but it's the perception.

...and the thread is all about perception right? I can see where Iran would perceive their Death Warrant having already been signed....and only WE can dial this down a bit. Such is the burden of being Goliath.

(now if Iran attacks so much as a fishing boat 1 mile outside it's own national waters...EVERYTHING changes...but that better be a 2000% certain case of Iranian sailors on an Iranian ship that returned into an Iranian port afterward. )

You simple man...

Why don't you try to UNDERSTAND first what a THREAT means?

It is a MILITARY threat ? A TERRORIST threat ? An ECONOMICAL threat ?
Once you find the answer, ask yourself the NEXT question ?

It is a IMEDIATE threat, or a future threat?

As for to answer you why Iran is a THREAT : it is the ONLY country on this PLANET who have a RELIGIOUS government, parliament AND the supreme leader MUST BE an AYATOLLAH.In a sole word : a country run by religious NUTS (muslims beleive death to be more WORTHY than life - you can document on this).

Is Iran NOW a threat? NO, it is NOT.Is Iran a potential threat to OUR ALLIES ? Insert Israel as ally and the answer is YES.Could Iran be a NUCLEAR ARMED NATION in the future ? YES.
Do Iran have a TERRORIST behaviour ? Three times YES - you can also document on this.

Should Iran be BOMBED now or wait until they have nukes ? BOMB THEM NOW, FAST AND HARD.

reply to post by Shark_Feeder
no need, we the US do not go running around saying death to Israel nor seeking the ends to the means,Hitler said the tanks were used for farming, Iran says nukes used for power. Hitler said it is for the good of the country, Iran says the same, that they should be wiped off the face of the earth.

reply to post by Shark_Feeder

I smell a shill.....and this from a Registered Republican, genius

Hmmm calling the "Shill Card" just because someone has a different opinion to your own. Now that is a thought that is narrow minded and completely lacking in any tolerance. Oh and by the way "Genius" (term used very loosely) sorry to disappoint your wrongful and uninformed "assumption" I am not a "Registered Republican".

What is next the "Troll Card"? Note I did not assume I asked.

I agree with u

Originally posted by phatpackage
Hmmm calling the "Shill Card" just because someone has a different opinion to your own.

I call them as I see them...I say that because of your often debunked ridiculous reasoning. No matter how untrue it is you cling to it.

Oh and by the way "Genius" (term used very loosely) sorry to disappoint your wrongful and uninformed "assumption" I am not a "Registered Republican".

Hey, "smart guy" I was informing you that I am a registered Republican.

reply to post by VBarbarino


You make a great point!!! Iran is dangerous because the MSM says so!!

reply to post by yourmaker

I agree with you 100%. You practically sum it up in three sentences. No countries in the world is a threat to the US now but everyone views the US as a bully. If only the US would revert back to its ways back in the 50s when it was not meddling in other countries' affairs. I don't say that I can foresee the future but the US would face threats when it is weakened economically and militarily with internal upheaval and external threats. At this rate it is engaging in conflicts worldwide its just a matter of time before this becomes a reality. My advise is "stay strong America...we need you" and you don't have to proof yourself over and over. You are being led over the cliff edge half asleep by your
"allies" so wake now before its too late. You are no good to us in a weakened state. Your presence in Muslim countries have created ill feelings between Muslims and Christians. It was never that pronounced back in the 60s. Iraq and Libya are worst off now than it used to be. Like it or not you have a hand in these problems and it doesn't take a genius to see that.