Parenting 101: how to instill respect for others.

reply to post by TheRedneck



ABSOLUTELY INDEED.

Thank you. Sigh.

imho, physical abuse is striking or handling a child in a way that leaves marks, bruises etc.

Warming their hide is not abuse.

However, the PTB are setting up to use every fool excuse in the book to label parental behavior "abuse"

IN ORDER TO

Detach children from parents wholesale.

IN ORDER TO

train/ brainwash/ condition/ inculcatge

ALL CHILDREN into compliant little puppets for the Marxist globalist machine.

At this stage, they are winding up as much rebellion on the part of as many children as possible. They may well come to the defense of the daughter in a big way and make her a poster child for 'emancipation' of teens from their parents.

They want the chaos of rebellious teens.

They also want the excuse of poor abused teens in order to establish the MANDATE that parents are too incompetent; tooooo traditional; toooooo OLD ORDER; toooooo 'dysfunctional' to rear children . . . therefore . . .

THE STATE MUST DO IT "for the children."
GAG. NOPE. It's to help establish tyranny over all.

I'm concerned this father will be made to look like a psychotic looney when his worst offense is being a somewhat aggressive attachment disordered poorly trained parent who really wanted to help his daughter learn enough respect for authority to function in society.

Anyway--THANKS TONS FOR YOUR REALITY BASED PERSPECTIVE.

May parents forever be able to rear children sanely to maturity according to their healthy spiritual and relational parental values.

reply to post by outandopen



There's too much truth to your assertions.

Certainly respect is earned and must be a mutual thing.

However . . . I don't think your labels are overly useful.

Not all hippies are horrible parents.

Not all hippies are wonderful parents.

Not all rednecks are horrible parents.

Not all rednecks are ideal parents.

Neither hippies nor rednecks learn proper childrearing habits in attachment disordered childhoods.

Virtually all good learning of good childrearing practices comes from a good SOURCE.

Healthy parents and/or other Mentors are the best sources.

reply to post by L00kingGlass

Adults are just as disrespectful as kids are these days, that is definitely where kids are learning it from. And the horrible thing is, adults should know better.

Uhhhhhhhh . . . NOPE . . .

disrespect is bound up in the heart of man.

Children do not NEED TO LEARN rebellion. It's in the human heart.

Children NATURALLY WANT THEIR OWN WAY regardless.
Children are naturally selfish.
etc. etc.

Certainly plenty of parents never learned proper respect of much of anything--including themselves . . . and consequently . . . they don't TEACH respect well, if at all.

However, respect must be EARNED AND TAUGHT.

reply to post by Annee



Sounds like a great method. Will share that one. Thanks.

On average, how long does it take?

reply to post by Saytan75



To him, his gun was merely an effective tool for the task.

I think you are reading far too much into his use of a gun.

If anything, he has likely catered too much to his daughter with stuff instead of bonding emotionally with her in a mutually understanding way.

Buying relationship never works.

reply to post by L00kingGlass

By the looks of things, it was the rant of a spoiled brat. She had been warned once already, and did it again anyhow. She was upset she had to do work, and was disrespectful to the poor woman hired to clean their house.

This spoiled brat needed a severe punishment or a shock to her system to make her think twice about her horrible behavior/mentality. Most parents are not doing a proper job, as we can see by the current state of society: entitled disrespectful children who go on to become entitled disrespectful adults.

I greatly agree.

And all that needed proper handling waaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyy earlier--years ago.

AT this point, he sounded like he was playing 'catch-up' and that not real skillfully.

So, I wouldn't say he handled it perfectly. I think he handled it understandably given his own childhood and values.

Originally posted by Gseven

Nobody knows what goes on in that house, but being a grown adult of quite a bit of emotional abuse as a child, I can say this was nothing but battle of wills between two very dysfunctional people. No child who is loved or respected properly, with parents who set the proper examples, would EVER disrespect their parents in this manner. As much as I hate to say it, I'd bet money on the fact that she was provoked and had no recourse to expel her frustration and anger at the situation. He may have bought her all sorts of things, but money doesn't buy love. She hurt his ego, and in turn, he humiliated her right back....on the evening news for God's sake!!!

Now, bottom line...let's remove all of us out of the equation. That relationship is YEARS away from ever being healthy and healed. It was bad enough before, but now, he'll be lucky if she ever speaks to him again. Who won exactly? Sure, he made himself look like a bad *ss in front of the world, and he has a supporting audience to tell him he was right on, but who will step up and heal the damage he's caused by doing this? Kids only lash out as a cry for what they're missing. I think this was an epic fail on his part.

Great points.

There's certainly plenty wrong on all sides.

And, sadly, it is the PARENTS' responsibility for such misbehavior; lack of bonding; lack of respect; lack of capacity to hear and understand etc. IT is not the child's duty to train the parent.

I would be kind of funny if the laptop was technically the property of the school system, wouldn't it???

Kids learn by example, and quite frankly, the adults today are crappy examples....
you want your kids to respect you, show some respect for them, and show some respect for the other adults around you!!!
Same goes if you want the neighbor's kids to respect you!

when my kids were younger, one of the neighbors came over complaining that my kid had called her a bad name.....and well, I knew that that word wasn't never used in my home, but I did remember hearing it...many nights, late at night, while my kids were laying in their beds trying to sleep, while this lady and her friends were gathered two doors down the street, it was being yelled up and down the street by the drunks that were partying late at night. whith no respect for the kids who had to get up in the morning, or the parents who had to go to work.

I told her this, and then proceeded to tell her...
Don't expect my kids to act more adult than the adults are acting around them!!!

ya, he shot the girls laptop in the quest for respect....
so, well, next time the girl feels disrespected by the adults, wonder what she will shoot??

What an example, dealing with frustration by shooting material things with a gun. So he wants to tell his kid how valuable his gifts are, then continues to destroy them. Now if he had just sold the laptop on ebay that would have been a good example, "Since you don't know how to properly use a laptop I'll just sell it to someone else and use the money to buy new bullets so I can go to the shooting gallery and vent my frustration over my lack of parenting".

That would have made sense to me, now I just see an idiot giving a pathetic kind of lecture, teaching others it's ok to bust up valuable equipment (which her kid needs to make it in a technological society), posting it on the internet making life more difficult for her daughter. What guy is going to date a girl whose father shoots at laptops when he reaches his boiling point? I think I would pass.

I think if he wanted to make the point he could have also gathered her laptop, cell phone, game systems and everything else she was given and did not respect, then donated them to an under privileged school nearby.

That would have been a great film as well, all the while commentating on why he was doing it, and that now if she wanted these things she would have to work for them herself, but it would have not had a dramatic impact.

I think in today's "Jerry Springer/Hollywood Society" we all expect drama, and react accordingly. Anger does take over, but it shows exactly how we have been conditioned, on all levels, to deal with situations.

What he did was not right or wrong, just how he reacted to the situation, some people would have done it differently.

What I can say is that, if I was his daughter I sure as hell wouldn't want to ever go back to school again and show my face. Tough love for sure.

Oh hey, you made me post, but dang...

So I was saying to myself, "That's not right." But then what is? This guy did something. He's doing something. I don't have the same problem probably because I don't act like that but he's just doing what needs to be done (that's probably going on and on in his head).

The man had just justified his actions way before he filmed it I guess. So, S&F not coz I think it's right but because it's still way better than inaction. I hope these people get counselling or something because the way it's going seems like a road to violence and grief. There are countless ways of dealing with this without resorting to violence or outrageous measures. Embarrassing the girl for one thing will ensure a retaliation they would feel in their lifetime.

He's stuttering and mad. Sheesh. Cool down bro. The daughter will utterly follow suit and do something rash too, like shoot something else - like a person's head! Kids really are monkey see monkey do. But I like how he got the kid to do the chores and such. This is probably just a case of poor communication.

[color=dodgerblue]One thing that people forget (and I am going to try like hell to keep this in mind when my kids are teenagers) is that teens really can't always help it. They are flawed biologically. Their frontal lobes are under-developed impairing their ability to see consequences. Which is why its nearly impossible to get them to learn from our mistakes.

They are also suffering from ego-centrism and have a very difficult time seeing anything from any perspective but their own.

And let's not forget about invincibility because bad things only happen to other people.

Luckily the frontal lobe is a work in progress that will be fully mature (we hope, anyway) around 25 years of age... for some I think it's much much later.

Not saying that I agree with either side here.. But the letter from the daughter is a prime example of ego-centrism and a lack of the ability to see the possible consequences (ie... her parents reading what she wrote despite the fact that she blocked them)...

I do think that he taught her a lesson... even if it isn't the way that we would have handled it, I am certain that she won't soon forget

reply to post by TheRedneck


REDNECK, just wanted to say what's up? How you doing? It's been awhile.

We live in a society that empowers and embraces the weak and caters to their every whim. This is why they haven't got a backbone and a majority of this alleged BULLYING/cybervbullying is nothing but the result of a childs bruised ego which is uncapable of handling any criticism whatsoever.

The reason they can't handle anything is because of the way their parents and teachers are raising them. Everything they do is sugar coated and pampered. From the responses of many here I have the image of you carrying your kid around in a purse like paris hilton and her dog. 1/2 of you adults have nothing but unstable, fragile and shattered egos and you wonder why your kids are weak.

The fact is we need to raise and ground our children in reality, because the majority of this country is nothing but a bunch of spoiled brats who can't handle the slightest inconvenience, nevermind when a real problem arises. The first response to the situation is a total breakdown and suicide.

My son is 18 and he's seen me on the occasional flipout. I've never laid a hand on him, EVER (accept to show my love) and he has nothing but respect and love back. He's learned lessons most of the adults here probably never will.............................. and from his own words, he tells me that the structure of our current society is doing NOTHING but setting our kids up for FAILURE.

You all need to wake the hell up and come out of your spoiled fantasies. Deal with realities problems and overcomne adversity. It builds character and strength which in turn we teach our children.

I'm torn on this one. This guy does remind me of my father in a lot of ways. The girl doesn't remind me of myself as I didn't have access to act out in those ways. I was online in the days of chat rooms and newsgroups. I was too busy discussing politics, music or weird stuff to find it if there was something to talk about your parents on.

I can remember something that might shore up with this girls experiences though. My parents are fundamentalist Christians, Pentecostals to be precise. I was raised in that type of household. My parents were very strict. I couldn't cut my hair, couldn't wear pants..Couldn't do a lot of things normal girls could do. I resented my parents for it and in some ways I still do. I couldn't express myself without being told "That's wrong".

Of course, I'm not successful, have money or happen to be intelligent so one could say my parents are failures like me. They did the best they could with what they knew but the parallel here is the heavy handed tactics. I wasn't acting out, I just wanted to be me. What the girl did wasn't right, but at the same time kids say things they don't mean. It's the nature of being human. How many of you get mad and say something you didn't really mean? She was venting, certainly it shouldn't have been done in public, but everyone needs to vent at times.

I wouldn't go out and shoot something over it now would I make a video and put it on the internet. I'd talk to her and make her take it down. Then I'd buy her a diary and take away the computer until she figures out which thoughts should be private and which should be public. As for the Respect issue, he doesn't seem to have a lot for himself considering the cancer stick, can't take him seriously on that note.

I can agree that you have to discipline your kid...but up to a point. I think this guy went a little overboard and this was not discipline...this was a personal attack by involving all of her friends (thus ousting her in her social arena), showing all of this to the whole world..which should have been something personal. If she was that out of control, he could have sent her to a boot camp, as absence makes the heart grow fonder, but to go this route it seems more like a personal attack. He is going to show her respect...by disrespecting her in front of the whole world? That is like bombing other nations to prove that we want peace. You know what they say about a woman scorned, his daughter was already resenting him and this is only going to make it much worse. How could this make things better? It's a pride issue at this point. Who wins? What he should have done was to confront her about it in private, listened to her side of the story (so that she at least feels validated in being heard) and then enumerated all of these points that he just made to the whole world. He should have been talking to his daughter in a private,non-threatening setting and let her know about all of this stuff,.....this time without yelling. This is no way to raise a child. I had a mother that was just as abusive, a little worse and she thought she was teaching me a lesson too, by doing crap like this. I left and never looked back and there are only 3 people in this world that I actually disrespect as humans.....she is one of them. Incidently, the ither two are women as well. I, learned all of my better habits and respect and the way to treat people, from my father, whom I do respect. (except for feminists, sorry I just can't respect them,I consider them a cancer to mankind).
At any rate, this girl is going to get much worse now and resent this guy for life. I am in I.T. as well, and that has nothing to do with parenting. This guy just messed up. Sorry, Redneck, I like you man. We agree on alot of things on here and I was raised in the south too, but this one I can't agree with as I have lived the outcome.
I wouldlove to see a Before and after video on this one a year from now.
He destroyed her social fabric that she has probably worked years on, none of her friends are going to want to be associated with her after this, now world-wide incident, He effectively communicated to her that he and her mother are against her.......so she's alone. So now what? She comes up to him and hugs him and tells him waht a good father he is and it's all pickett fences from there? Nope, He took away her friends, her cherished laptop (which by todays standards are like having clothes to kids), he is going to make her pay for his rounds that he shot into her computer and, in essence, has backed an already fearful, confused, angry girl into a corner and now itwill be fight or flight. I'll have to give this guy an 'F' in parenting. I have 2 girls of my own and I have to do none of this to get them to do what they are supposed to do. Ground 'em some, take the internet away...but never any crap like this.

Originally posted by SoymilkAlaska
reply to post by Trexter Ziam

 

the daughter wasn't wrong in her post.

she described that way she honestly felt.

and she felt angry. oppressed. a slave.


she felt as if she was wronged.

and what does the father do? wrong her again.

im going to laugh SO hard when that girl doesn't pay him back a single CENT.

I'd just like to point something out to you here. You are expressing your outrage, in this forum, at something you feel is unfair. And you have every right to do that. AND I understand those feelings, having had them many times myself. But, with the perspective that comes from having lived some thirty some years as an adult....and knowing which kinds of internal mental strategies work, and which are blind alleys and lead to dead ends, I feel an urge to perhaps ask you to consider if the one you are currently using, will benefit you throughout your life.

People motivate themselves in various ways. You have been motivated to respond to this thread, because it touches something in you, that you feel strongly about. Am I correct in that? That feeling caused you to "act" by responding...by taking your time and energy to write and read. This is an attempt to "do something" about what you feel is an injustice, it would seem from here. And I applaud your desire to do that. And I also invite you to consider how well your own mental and emotional strategy for this kind of situation, works for you, in your own life.

Because let's face it, any time we get incensed about something, it hits home for the very reason that we have something similar in some way, in our own experiences, that causes us to feel frustration or sympathy for one party or the other. True? IOWs, in order to think about it at all, we necessarily have to imagine ourselves in one or the other's position, and take a side. And we all do that, all the time. It's just human.

But, once we are in that position, we aren't really thinking about that other person or their circumstances any more. We don't actually have enough details to do that. So we tend to fill in that part with our own details, in order to maintain our chain of emotional thought and motivation. Not even realizing we are doing it usually. That's normal. We even have physical structures in our brains for it, that scientists call mirror cells. And those cells literally light up on scans when we are experiencing thoughts and emotions, to things that are happening to someone else. It's how we engage with our fellow humans,. And without those mirror cells, we would not even be able to enjoy a movie, because we would not be become sufficiently engaged enough to do so....let alone act to stop a genocide or something big like that. In a very real way, that is what makes us human.

Ultimately it comes down to whether or not our own personal strategies of mind, get us closer to happiness, or distance us from being content.What I noticed about your response was mostly the last line. People also have a need to close emotional loops that we have opened, in order to continue on with our lives. We wouldn't get much done if we kept all that stuff going all the time. So we seek some kind of closure, to free up our attention for something else.

Your loop closing strategy seems to be one where you imagine some future event, that both proves you "right" and provides for some kind of justice in the situation. However, since you will never know how close it was to what ACTUALLY results, It bears little practical predictive value. "Kinda" feels like closure...but doesn't gain you any real knowledge to hone decision making in the future. And since you predict an event...(you laughing about it)...that of necessity, will NOT come to pass, since the trigger for that event is outside your control, you leave it to improbable random chance that will dictate if you ever get the opportunity to "actually" laugh about it.

So, that loop isn't really closed. It's just paused indefinitely. How many of those do you think you can tolerate in your life, leaving all those loops running in the background? It's kind of like all those useless programs on your computer that eat up memory, but that you don't actually use. Do I really need a little thingy to constantly monitor if my caps lock key is on, or if Java feels a need to "upgrade" me, if I could be using that processing power on some task I actually want and need?

What important tasks are you engaged in in your present life? What relationships are important NOW? If you could close all your un-needed trivial programs by coming up with a better way to close those loops permanently and on the fly, how would you do that? I'm only asking because you may have a kid of your own, now or in the future, who needs all your best focus, in order to turn out as a loving and responsible human being. I know you will do well in that.

reply to post by outandopen

When will adults learn they can't beat yell and lecture respect into there kids. Respectful children have respectful parents. Loving parents that actually treat their kids like humans not like property.

You appear to be attempting to categorize all known material in the Universe into two groups: humans and property. I happen to believe that is incorrect.

Children are human, obviously. They are not property, as evidenced by laws that (rightly) prevent doing harm to them. The laptop was property; the child was a charge. The goal of every (decent) parent is simply to raise a well-adjusted individual.

That is going to entail quite a bit more than simply being compassionate. What do you do when your child develops a desire to stick things in an electrical outlet? The old school way to handle the problem is to spank the kid with increasing levels of severity, in the thought that it is better to get a few whacks on the behind than to allow the child to find out the hard way that electricity can be deadly. The modern way to handle it is to verbally scold the child (which can result in amusement for the child) and buy special cover plates to keep the child out of the electrical sockets until they can hopefully "grow out of it".

Foresight tells me that the old way is better. Why? Because I can only control access to the outlets in my home, not those in a friend's home or those in a school or other public building. The old way teaches the child that their actions are wrong and should not be done; the new way does not do so, but rather tries to prevent the ultimately unpreventable.

Yes, I do have kids, 4 of them. The 2 that are in school are excellent children, teachers love them Perfect scores. Respectful to their teachers. I am respectful to my kids and guess what their teachers are respectful to them.

Congratulations then! As has been said, results triumph theory.

I have not been so lucky with teachers. Some of those who I have come into contact with have been disrespectful to my kids. In a way, I consider that a good thing; better they encounter adversity when I am around to back them up and teach them from the experience than to encounter such when there is no one there to give them support. May your children never experience anything their childhood has not prepared them for, or at least may they be capable of handling it.

I have no concerns in that vein for my children.

All us modern parents and our "hippy" crap. Loving our kids instead of beating or threatening them. What's wrong with us.

Apparently nothing... that results thing again.

But here's where the problem really starts. Why do you apparently believe that because I spank my children it follows I do not show them love or even use alternate methods when applicable? Why do you apparently believe that what happened to your children happens identically to every other child? Why do you apparently believe that all children react to their environment the same way and therefore can be disciplined effectively by the same methods?

Here's an example: there used to be this family that lived next door to me. They were on welfare and dirt poor with three children. One was grown and was desperately trying to find a job, but had never been exposed to a working role model; I mentored the boy myself until he was able to make his way and move out. The other son was a bit slow mentally and younger, a well-mannered young lad; I spent as much time talking with him as I could to try and help him out as well. The daughter however... well...

She was 14 when they moved in. She was constantly the source of screaming arguments, primarily because of her 'boyfriends'. The parents were pretty much afraid to do anything more, since she had realized that a single phone call to DHS would get her parents in trouble. By age 15, she was a full-fledged whore, and I use that term in the most clinical manner. There were rumors she had had a couple of abortions already. They moved out when she had just turned 16... but the girl didn't. She refused to go. Instead she moved in with her present 'boyfriend', who was a known drug dealer in the area.

A few months later, I got a phone call from the police department. The officer on the other end asked if I knew her. I said yes, she used to live next door but the family had moved. He asked me to come down to the station so I did. There she sat, crying. They had found her sleeping in my carport. Her 'boyfriend' had kicked her out and she had nowhere to go.

I found out that during those months, she had been beaten, abused, raped multiple times, and sold as a prostitute. At age 16. Still a baby in my book.

I wanted to cry.

(continued)

reply to post by outandopen

(continued)

I didn't want to, mainly because I didn't want to be accused of anything untoward, but out of pity I drove her to her parents new house that night. She still didn't want to go, but after an hour or so of talking to them over the phone, she agreed.

Now, these were not good parents in my eyes by any means, but could things have been different if they had been able to connect paddle to butt, would she have perhaps been spared some of that horror? Why did their approach work some for the boys and not for her? Was it worth her experiences at 16 to prevent the possibility she might have been upset over earlier discipline?

This is the seriousness of parenting issues. This is what can happen, what too often does happen, when someone is denied discipline at an early age. This is what parents world over want to avoid.

This is why no one, I repeat no one was able to tell me I could not spank my children when they were younger. To do so was, and is, in my mind, a direct assault on the children... no different than someone beating on them in my presence. How much do I love my kids? Enough to protect them at all costs from whatever is threatening them.

Your way worked. Congratulations. I am happy for you. But do not ever say I do not love my children.

Ever.

TheRedneck

Originally posted by Daughter2
So you are saying once teens learn "respect" they will vote against welfare? They don't need to learn respect for authority but respect for EVERYONE.

You should brush up on your reading skills... He said, "warfare", not "welfare". Come on..? Sarcasm is not your strong suit...

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by BO XIAN
Folks who have a hair dialing finger for Child Protective Services can readily leave me feeling ill. Some of them need to get a life and grow up themselves.

Ugh! We just went through a CPS experience because of an inexperienced counselor.

There was physical contact (not sexual) by the father - - with no intent to cause harm.

The child is a "drama queen". We don't know for sure if the father (who does love his daughter) was physically too aggressive - - - or the child was dramatizing the experience.

Instead of pursuing it further - - the counselor immediately reported the dad as an abuser - - because of physical contact.

We went through weeks of interviews by case workers and police. Really upset the child and could have caused more harm.

Oh....it's not just the inexperienced ones that do that. Many of the VERY experienced ones have it as a job security strategy. Getting Children's Services involved is always a serious crap-shoot. IMO, more harm than good is done through that particular agency.