Why my mind is closing towards Capitalism

reply to post by mastahunta

It doesn't piss you off, I know a bomb thrower when I see one, like when I look in the mirror...

Admit it, you don't love reality, you love the crusade of your own construct.

Does what piss me off?

Originally posted by thehoneycomb
reply to post by mastahunta

 

I dunno.. Ask a union leader... Some of them make billions.

Link?

Proof that even ONE union leader makes a billion dollars. Just ONE.

Or else, I will have all the proof I need to call you a LIAR, good sir.

Originally posted by thehoneycomb
reply to post by aching_knuckles

 

Your ruining america, not me.

Man up.

I know you are but what am I??!

Good comeback! Is your next one "im rubber and youre glue!"?

How old are you?

reply to post by mastahunta


There are some that make half a million a year and probably invest, not to mention pensions and bonuses...so yeah...billionaires.

Originally posted by thehoneycomb
reply to post by mastahunta

 

There are some that make half a million a year and probably invest, not to mention pensions and bonuses...so yeah...billionaires.

Again, can you link me that proof, Mr. Liar Liar Pants on Fire, sir?

reply to post by thehoneycomb


If it wasn't for unions, workers organizing, you would be working in a sweat shops like they do in China.

Do you think Americans have always had good wages and working conditions?

You want your children working? (actually that might be you judging by the content of your posts)

Child Labor in U.S. History

How was that stopped?

1832 New England unions condemn child labor
The New England Association of Farmers, Mechanics and Other Workingmen resolve that “Children should not be allowed to labor in the factories from morning till night, without any time for healthy recreation and mental culture,” for it “endangers their . . . well-being and health”

Not government, not capitalists, but the workers themselves.

Don't think that doesn't still happen...

The scandal of child labour in US farming

You need to get one of those things, what are they called? Oh yea, a 'clue'.

Originally posted by thehoneycomb
reply to post by ANOK

 

The only reason I posted was for the OP who was seriously considering socialism. I pointed to the Socialist party USA website and told him to read up. Then I got caught in the crossfires and what ended up an interesting conversation even though it pisses me off to no end.

It doesn't piss you off, I know a bomb thrower when I see one, like when I look in the mirror...

Admit it, you don't love reality, you love the crusade of your own construct.

reply to post by aching_knuckles


If I was the IRS.

I can link you to half a million.

reply to post by ANOK


I am not against child labor. Especially if a child wants to work. Let them. If it betters them or their family. Thats how america was built and I am not ashamed of that fact.

Originally posted by thehoneycomb
reply to post by aching_knuckles

 

If I was the IRS.

I can link you to half a million.

So basically, you are saying you have no proof for what you say, unlike all of us that have posted sources.

You sir, are a #ing douche bag LIAR, and you deserve to be called as such. People like you should get banned from this website for intentionally lying, obfuscating and muddying the waters.

Originally posted by thehoneycomb
reply to post by ANOK

 

I am not against child labor. Especially if a child wants to work. Let them. If it betters them or their family. Thats how america was built and I am not ashamed of that fact.

WOW

You don't have any children do you?





You are either just trolling now, or you are seriously troubled. Children should be getting educated, not performing labour.

reply to post by mastahunta


Im sorry but your still not making sense.

I make less money probably then anyone else posting here. I did not construct anything. I just believe that capitalism is a better system and Socialism does not work and ends in mass tragedy.

reply to post by ANOK


You do realize the odds that most people had to overcome to become stable and free? I don't like that picture and I certainly don't promote child labor, but times have changed and at the time it was needed.

At least those kids weren't murdered. Like so many in Germany, China and Russia as well as many other places in the world.

Originally posted by petrus4
So after talking with ANOK in my thread on OWS and socialism, I've started looking around the net for PDFs to read about it. One of the first things I found, was a refutation of it by Ludwig von Mises. I've downloaded it, but I'm noticing how ambivalent I feel towards reading it.

I'm trying to keep an open mind towards both sides, here; and I know a lot of Capitalist advocates say that what we're seeing in contemporary society is not legitimate Capitalism. I think that's true; but at the same time, there is one overpowering reason why, whether pure or impure, corporate or otherwise, I can't advocate Capitalism as a system. What is said reason?

Somebody always goes hungry; and Capitalist advocates are ok with that. We still end up with a homeless problem. We still end up with Africa being essentially nothing but a giant pile of AIDS infested, rotting corpses.

Various reasons are given as to why that's morally acceptable. I tend to find that they usually reduce down to social Darwinism or the "useless eater," hypothesis; i.e., if someone can't or won't get a job, then let them die.

Contrary to how it might seem, I do not advocate avoidance of work. I do, however, think that society should put a lot more effort into creating a scenario where people are able to find the sort of work that they are best suited to. If that was to happen, it would benefit not only the individual, but society as a whole. I also don't think that a person should automatically be judged unfit to work, simply because they don't have the aptitude for a job that somebody else considers appropriate for them.

In other words, I'm not a fan of the, "I took whatever job I could find, regardless of how much it sucks, so those filthy hippie vermin should damn well do the same," argument. I don't think it benefits either the individual person or society as a whole. I've read a lot of stories online recently about Americans with PhDs or Master's degrees, working as janitors or at McDonald's. Is your country really benefiting from having its' intelligence wasted like that?

One more thing. I consider John D. Rockefeller to quite literally be the closest thing I've ever heard of to Satan incarnate, with his son David taking second place. If the definition of entrepreneurialism is the lives and natures of these men, then I absolutely will oppose it. If it is possible to become wealthy without being a raging psychopath, I have no objection to that; but can anyone cite even one example of a prominently wealthy individual, who is not openly evil?

Von Mises and his supporters might claim that the only alternative to a scenario where a single individual (or group of individuals) can theoretically own everything on the planet, to be complete chaos; but I personally am not willing to make the type of moral compromises that Capitalism seems to take for granted. Economics and compassion should not be at odds with each other. I'm writing this in a place where people come to get help, when they sometimes haven't eaten for a week; and where, in pouring sub-tropical rain, I've seen people in sleeping bags on the front verandah.

I'm tired of living in a society which treats any human beings like disposable garbage; and I'm especially tired of hearing people who advocate Capitalism, saying that such a situation is perfectly fine, and even express contempt towards the people in said situations.

I am not saying I have any definite idea of how to, just yet; but I think we can do better...and I think we have to.

edit on 1-2-2012 by petrus4 because: (no reason given)

You should look up distributionism. Granted I am not done reading into it, but it seems like the most stable and most socially beneficial economic policy.

Originally posted by thehoneycomb

At least those kids weren't murdered. Like so many in Germany, China and Russia as well as many other places in the world.

Unless they were black or Aboriginal American, but I guess in your eyes they arent humans and dont count.

Originally posted by thehoneycomb
reply to post by ANOK

 

You do realize the odds that most people had to overcome to become stable and free? I don't like that picture and I certainly don't promote child labor, but times have changed and at the time it was needed.

At least those kids weren't murdered. Like so many in Germany, China and Russia as well as many other places in the world.

Why do you keep contradicting what you said whenever anybody calls you out?

At that time no it wasn't needed, it was done because there were no laws stopping it. There is no morality in capitalism, only the desire to make profit above everything else, and laws had to be enacted to keep that in check.

At least they weren't killed? What does that mean? They weren't killed by socialism. Unless of course you still haven't learned what it is after being told many times.

Are you the chairman of the capitalists alliance or something? Spokesperson for the Human exploitation movement?

reply to post by aching_knuckles


Now you're playing the race card.

Good one.

I started working at 15 and it was good for me. Though I didn't do slave labour or anything like that. I have no problem with letting kids go to work if they want. I don't think you should force them to. But if they want to it should be allowed.

The way things are going though, work is frowned upon, we need more time to indoctrinate children and teach them about socialism and communism. They can teach our kids to suck the governments tit until one day they can get something for nothing.

reply to post by ANOK


Hello... When America started there was no structure. No schools. No roads. No buildings. Just men with guns who defended themselves and women who raised their kids.

Originally posted by thehoneycomb
reply to post by aching_knuckles

 

Now you're playing the race card.

Good one.

I see, so actually recognizing that injustices were done is "playing the race card". Just what I would expect from a proven LIAR.

Originally posted by thehoneycomb
reply to post by ANOK

 

Hello... When America started there was no structure. No schools. No roads. No buildings. Just men with guns who defended themselves and women who raised their kids.

Thats not true at all. By 1776 (nearly 300 years after columbus landed) when America was formed, there were roads, buildings, cities, plantations, etc. New York City was already 150 years old.

Got any more lies for us, MR. LIAR?

Maybe before you destroy your credibility even further, maybe you should do some...yknow...research and actually...well yknow.....learn something. Theres this awesome thing called Google, its right here on the world wide web that we are now using! Its amazing.