Evolutionary theory: Gaps and not yet understood phenonemon

Originally posted by BBalazs
Evolution is a fact.

Not going to go to much into this but since it's actually NOT factually proven at all, don't make the statement that it is. You have a fused chromosome, no event in any span of evolution will cause this, it was done to you. Mainstream wants to tell you that you're not that old and some early homonids were wandering around hundred thousand years ago in Africa when we have bones of humans now being found and dated back either older or inconclusive to the other find.

reply to post by ZeroUnlmtd


Your mixing up evolution with evolutionary theory.

reply to post by Evil_Santa


Sure why not, I do investigate it also. Does it matter what I do?

reply to post by BBalazs

I open this thread, to be in constant motion examining these gaps.
I feel that we dont download knowledge, we learn it.
So if there are gaps, as we learn more and more about them, we may possibly explain them along our quest to understand.

My questions on ToE are many. But Ive found its impossible to get an honest assessment of it because many who subscribe to ToE already hold that ...

Evolution is a fact.

...when that is the very thing thats being challenged.


In my experience, I have found that
a) All who defend ToE have already concluded that ToE is a confirmed and undisputed fact, and address any queries with "we know evolution is a fact, so X must have evolved.
b) Any further debate and questioning of ToE is often brushed aside, and people asking these questions are written off as "creationists"

Not that I lose any sleep over people accepting ToE as an explanation as to how we got here, just that I've come to realize that ToE vs 'that other explanation" type conversations lead nowhere.

Originally posted by abominatonofdesolation
In my opinion, there is only there is only one gap, or problem in Charles Darwin's Theory of Evolution By Natural Selection. My problem is humans, although we have archaeological evidence of pre-human 'common ancestors.' We also have evidence that they weren't very smart, certainly not capable of much more intelligent thought than a chimp or any other primate. The problem is, we are the only animal capable of free thought, by that I basically mean the ability to say yes or no. We are the only animal that can get over survival instinct.

I do not agree with your definition of free thought. Sure my cat isn't going to answer me in English and say "yes or no" when I call her, but she does indeed make the decision to either come or to not come. If it was pure instinct, she'd come every time (or ignore me every time). Yes, quite often instincts are the prime mechanism for survival, but it doesn't mean animals don't actually think. Now I'm not saying they have advanced thought and can plan out their financial future or work with nuclear physics, but they certainly do make "yes" and "no" decisions. Many animals can think socially and use tools to build shelter or hunt. Obviously humans are the smartest creatures on the planet, but it doesn't mean homo habilis didn't have free thought. It just wasn't as advanced as ours.

My completely hypothetical example of this is to take a pig for arguments sake (because a pig is one the cleverest animals on the planet). If you were to abuse a pig and put it in unmanageable living conditions, hit it every once in a while with a baseball bat, play weird noises all day, and give it strange visuals, but still feed it as much as it needs 2 survive. The pig would eat it instinctively without a flicker of cognitive thought. But if you where to do the same 2 a human, a human would eventually think, "you know what iv'e had enough of this," and starve themselves.

Really? Then why are so many people in prison and not dead from starvation? Choice is only an illusion in those situations. The pig eats because it needs to survive. However, if you treat a pig properly, you can communicate with it and teach it many things.

news.discovery.com...

If animals don't have free thought, then why are there so many cases of animals getting depressed or committing suicide?

Originally posted by ZeroUnlmtd
Not going to go to much into this but since it's actually NOT factually proven at all, don't make the statement that it is. You have a fused chromosome, no event in any span of evolution will cause this, it was done to you. Mainstream wants to tell you that you're not that old and some early homonids were wandering around hundred thousand years ago in Africa when we have bones of humans now being found and dated back either older or inconclusive to the other find.

Prove that a fused chromosome is impossible through evolution. Evolutionary theory is not a fact in itself because we don't have all the answers but the theory is backed by so much tangible evidence, that denying evolution itself is sillier than denying the earth revolves around the sun.

a) All who defend ToE have already concluded that ToE is a confirmed and undisputed fact, and address any queries with "we know evolution is a fact, so X must have evolved.
b) Any further debate and questioning of ToE is often brushed aside, and people asking these questions are written off as "creationists"

Wrong. People who defend evolution post FACTS that support it. It is then the people who don't believe it that ignore this evidence and still bring up the same nauseating questions that have been answered a thousand times in this section. This is why creationists (not all, just fundamentalists), are often dismissed. They don't deal with facts and evidence, but are generally very quick to take something like a belief in god or creation as absolutely fact with nothing to go on.

Originally posted by Barcs

Originally posted by ZeroUnlmtd
Not going to go to much into this but since it's actually NOT factually proven at all, don't make the statement that it is. You have a fused chromosome, no event in any span of evolution will cause this, it was done to you. Mainstream wants to tell you that you're not that old and some early homonids were wandering around hundred thousand years ago in Africa when we have bones of humans now being found and dated back either older or inconclusive to the other find.

Prove that a fused chromosome is impossible through evolution.