chemtrails over Florida 01-01-2012

Originally posted by defcon5
Here, it must be related to atmospheric conditions as they can now forecast where they will form at.
Go here:
NASA Contrail Forecast
Put the date and time to start at, 24 frames, then run it. You'll see FL has had proper conditions for contrail formation over the last 24 hours, starting at 16:00 UTC.

That's good information, thank you.

I am still left wondering why two different aircraft leave distinctively different trails. If weather is the common denominator it would stand to reason all airplanes in the same airspace would leave similar trails. That is not what I have witnessed and documented in the video.

reply to post by Argyll


Maybe absence isn't the proper word to use, what I meant is that the same amount of trails are visible year round regardless of conditions.

Some people say there are less trails in the summer, but most people believe this to be untrue due what they see with their own eyes.

You can tell me that persistent contrails are more common in the winter, but then I will tell you that according to my observations that is completely untrue because I see the same consistency Of trails all year regardless of the season.

Originally posted by Argyll
reply to post by onecraftydude

 

And what education should I possess in order to understand your theory?

A basic knowledge of meteorology, and that planes fly at different altitudes..... that's all.

So a meteorologist should know what they are right? Are you a meteorologist? I have watched a meteorologist in Tampa Florida state on live tv that these are obviously chaff just like they used in military aircraft overseas since they show up on radar. So he must be wrong and you are right because of your background in basic meteorology?

I have not seen anything yet that would convince me what I am seeing is not deliberate.

High bypass engines might hold water if you can prove it.

reply to post by onecraftydude


Very nice videos...examples of the making of chemical skies. This evening the sun set into chemical soup at 4:20pm. Yesterday and the day before it was closer to 4:30pm. We're past the solstice but the days seem to be getting shorter. When the sun is out, even near the horizon, it is a monster that you can't even look at peripherally. I'm wondering if there is something agitating it or if the reflectant particles have made some sort of horror movie out of not only the skies but the way the sun appears as well. I've watched a lot of sunsets and never had to wear goggles in order to view them.

I agree with C.E. in that chemtrails know no season - winter, spring, summer or fall - they're on with them. I don't know where this myth of more chemtrails in winter came from. I've never observed that myself.

reply to post by Corruption Exposed


Our air has been dry for several years. We have had drought conditions for most of that time. I can count on both hands how many days I have NOT seen chemtrails. If weather was a factor this information should destroy that theory.

High bypass engines go further to explaining it than weather or seasons, but still falls short of proof.

Even so I am not at all convinced this is just water in the air since it never falls as precipitation. That alone should bust both theories since water is heavier than air and must fall after it accumulates and gets too heavy to stay lofted.

Originally posted by onecraftydude
I am still left wondering why two different aircraft leave distinctively different trails. If weather is the common denominator it would stand to reason all airplanes in the same airspace would leave similar trails. That is not what I have witnessed and documented in the video.

Its for multiple reasons:
1) Differences in altitude between aircraft that are not discernible from the ground.
2) Variances in the atmosphere such as Thermals, Clear Air Turbulence, etc.
3) Engine bypass ratio:
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/0bf065d2bfeb.jpg[/atsimg]

Additionally, number two is what causes a trail to suddenly start and stop, making it appear that someone shut off the spray. In reality it usually means the aircraft just flew through a thermal updraft.

You may need to cut and paste the below into google.

www.belfort-group.eu/sites/default/files/page/2010/05/COpart1.pdf

Pass it around

Originally posted by Corruption Exposed
You've been here longer than I have, but on several threads it's been pointed out that there is no increase in trails during the winter. The concensus is that this is a "debunker" myth.

It depends on where in the world you are. For example, here in Florida its going to be more prevalent in the winter, but we get some year round, usually in the mornings or evenings. Now up north it may be too cold in the winter for them to persist, so they will be more prevalent up there in the spring and fall.

Any day though there is a chance that the weather is going to be favorable for contrails to persist. Remember though, its not the atmospheric conditions at the ground that are important, its at the level that the aircraft is passing through that matters.

Here is a fun app to play with that will let to set the conditions and see how contrails will form:
Contrail Simulator

reply to post by defcon5

It depends on where in the world you are. For example, here in Florida its going to be more prevalent in the winter, but we get some year round, usually in the mornings or evenings. Now up north it may be too cold in the winter for them to persist, so they will be more prevalent up there in the spring and fall.

I am up "North" but what I've been trying to point out is that there is no time of year that they are more or less prevalent. They are consistently the same amount according to what the eye can see. I'm not sure how familiar you are with Northern weather, but they persist up here during the winter. I got pictures to prove it.

I traveled to a few different regions over the holidays and everywhere I went there were persistent contrails blanketing the sky. It was real cold out too, down to -20 c in some places (I hate the cold weather)

Thanks for the app

I'm going to mess around with it for a bit

Originally posted by onecraftydude
I have watched a meteorologist in Tampa Florida state on live tv that these are obviously chaff just like they used in military aircraft overseas since they show up on radar. So he must be wrong and you are right because of your background in basic meteorology?

Chaff is not chemtrails:
1) Chaff does not form persistent “clouds”.
2) Chaff is visible on radar, “chemtrials” are not.
3) Chaff is only used in areas closed for military maneuvers called Military Operations Areas (MOA's), which are closed to other traffic with an appropriate Notice to Airmen (NOTAM) filed with the FAA to warn away civilian air traffic.

Reminiscent of the UFO phenomenon from a few decades ago, we are now past the point of denial.

Chemtrails (or non-contrails) are acknowledged. Only their purpose(s) remain unknown.

And just like the UFO phenomenon, just because we don't know their motives, that doesn't automatically negate their existence.

IMHO, the thing that really puts the nail in the “chemtrail” coffin is FAA tracking itself. I know that it comes from the “government” so many here don't trust it, but the rules for air traffic are consistent because its an area that is used primarily by civilians.

Any aircraft that is operating in Class “A” Airspace, between 18K feet to 60K feet, HAVE to file a flight plan, these rules extend to our military aircraft, and even top secret flights such as the “Janet Flights” into Area 51. In order for any government entity to operate at will in the atmosphere over this country, they must either be in a Special use airspace (SUA) (such as a MOA or TFR mentioned above), or be flying VFR.

If a plane has filed a flight plan then it is traceable by any civilian using software such as “FlightAware”. If a Temporary Flight Restriction(TFR) has been filed to allow for “Spraying” then a Notice To Airmen (NOTAM) must be filed to warn away civilian air traffic.

See, they cannot just do what they want up there, there is too much civilian traffic that it would endanger.

reply to post by mileysubet


Wow. You really are uninformed. You really should do at least a modicum of research on a topic before making such an absolute comment.

Originally posted by satoriku
reply to post by mileysubet

 

Wow. You really are uninformed. You really should do at least a modicum of research on a topic before making such an absolute comment.

What post would you be referring to as being "uninformed".

reply to post by onecraftydude


I live in FL to down in the Keys and the chemtrails have been heavier here too. The sky was streaked left to righ up and down! I'm not sure WHAT they are spraying or WHY by they are spraying something! I really wish TPTB would give us SOME relief! BPA in food- Flouride in water- now Bromine and Aluminum in the air! BP oil in my beloved Gulf! STOP THE MADNESS

reply to post by onecraftydude


Your post is very interesting. Thank you.

reply to post by onecraftydude


I live in Central Florida and with it being New Years day I had to drive to some of my relatives homes for family get togethers and was in 3 different counties (Osceola, Orange and Lake). The Chem Trails were everywhere and I took several videos with my iPhone 4. Please check them out. In one of the I counted over 40 different trails.
m.youtube.com...#/watch?v=OEfYBf7XCkc

m.youtube.com...#/watch?v=556M817YSXQ

m.youtube.com...#/watch?v=qoJ0D-8fLWg

m.youtube.com...#/watch?v=Pi5paQbuWaM

m.youtube.com...#/watch?v=MLQ-X6Yygyc

m.youtube.com...#/watch?v=556M817YSXQ

reply to post by killemall

You may need to cut and paste the below into google.

The "Belfort-group" PDFs and their so-called "Case Orange" are long known to be a compilation of rubbish and misunderstandings. Mis-identified other aspects of well-understood things, such as "cloud seeding", and rolled into this MYTH and Hoax of so-called "chemtrails".

The myth and hoax promulgated (originally) by a few (or several) charlatans intent on selling elixirs and "remedies" for non-existent "maladies". Combined, then, with a segment of people, who are using the Internet to continue the disinformation, because they are banking (counting on) on the lack of science knowledge of many in the lay public, when it comes to flying, and contrails and meteorology in general.

Those who are not well-informed of the said sciences, then, quite innocently, pick up the same hoax misinformation and repeat it, again all over the Internet. In essence, perpetuating ignorance.

May want to take a gander here (in addition to the several ATS threads as well):

"Debunked: Belfort Group "Case Orange" conclusions and recommendations"

reply to post by PMNOrlando

The Chem Trails were everywhere ......

Here's a question:

For decades going back as far as World War II (and even before that) the existence of persistent contrails was well known and documented.

The science on this is solid (despite the terribly mis-informed garbage you read on the Internet claiming "chemtrails" are something other than normal contrails).

They look exactly like contrails.

They behave exactly like contrails.

They are the same color as contrails.

They have been researched to a large extent. AND, even more telling, since contrails are indeed a type of cloud (a sort of cirrus, specifically designated Cirrus Aviaticus (the "aviaticus" to denote they are associated with aviation).

And, a second source of images.

They are nothing but man-made cirrus clouds. Composed of ice crystals, JUST like cirrus clouds that form in Nature, they are the same exact color and exhibit all the same characteristics.

We can see the passenger jets that form the contrails, and there are no "secret storage tanks", nor "spray equipment" on these passenger (and cargo) jets.

So, when you filmed the contrails, and we can all see that they are contrails, then just what aspect about them told (or indicated) to you that they were "something else"?

reply to post by ProudBird


Metabunk.org ?? This is the site you proffer as having debunked the Belfort Group? A site that advises you to use character assassination on the messenger if the material itself cannot be debunked. A site that gives you step by step on how to debunk something - true or not doesn't matter. I can see you now walking hand in hand with Machiavelli into the chemical sunset. Don't forget your gas masks pals.