The OWS crowd owes the Tea Party an apology.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Where I'm at...the Tea Party is widely accepted by the OWS'ers.

Hence the message is still in muddy waters.

Originally posted by TDawgRex
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

Where I'm at...the Tea Party is widely accepted by the OWS'ers.

Hence the message is still in muddy waters.

I sure won't argue that Tdawg....I won't argue a bit. The message focus has to become a priority in getting on the same page between locations nation-wide, if not world wide. The sloppy and uncoordinated outreach efforts are actually doing more harm than good. If we aren't entirely too busy keeping things smooth tommorow, I plan to raise that very issue at evening GA.

I'll note though that one thing people don't seem to be understanding is, there is no 'One' OWS movement here. Each location and each city seems to have a slight twist of the local complexion of that area. New York is very liberal, as New York itself tends to be. Some of these Midwest ones aren't so much and the one I'm at..Well, I wasn't rejected, and I've made no bones about the fact my politics, when mentioned at all, are conservative and rather hard in that direction. Of course the important thing to note there is that it's rarely if ever mentioned...either way. It isn't about politics....as I am sure you know...and I wish the public would step out, come down and spend a few hours to see themselves.

Solidarity!

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


I believe that OWS should focus on one thing....anger. And why they are angry. All the various reasons.

You've got to boil down the problems to get to the core of the solution.

Kind of like milking spiders for their silk...And it is never easy and they don't like it.

reply to post by beezzer

Define the message, kick out the loons, oust DNC support (and GOP and blah blah blah support) and you might have the base required for change.

Beezzer, I wanna believe... Are you really warming up to the idea of not buying into either party's ideology? Striking out on our own? I think both parties have betrayed us miserably and I want to open it up to multiple parties, require term limits (no more lifelong career politicians) and get the corporations and lobbyists out of our "representatives" pockets. My number one agenda item is to repeal the law that lets corporations contribute to campaigns as "persons".

You have my apology for dismissing the Tea Party as soon as Glenn Beck got involved. It's not your fault it was hijacked. I'm not convinced the OWS is hijacked at this point - jury is out so far...

I'm all on board with us working together for the things we can agree upon! Now, I'm off to check out this new movement you are starting.

I'll just leave this here

market-ticker.org...

thanks

reply to post by beezzer


I wanted to get on this thread earlier today.Unfortunately,I had to WORK.

This pic sums up my position.






S&F

reply to post by Wrabbit2000

Thank you for your input and honesty.

Go back to the Tea Party, or better yet, start your own. We need people driven to hold politicians accountable.

Originally posted by gwynnhwyfar
reply to post by beezzer

 

Define the message, kick out the loons, oust DNC support (and GOP and blah blah blah support) and you might have the base required for change.

Beezzer, I wanna believe... Are you really warming up to the idea of not buying into either party's ideology? Striking out on our own? I think both parties have betrayed us miserably and I want to open it up to multiple parties, require term limits (no more lifelong career politicians) and get the corporations and lobbyists out of our "representatives" pockets. My number one agenda item is to repeal the law that lets corporations contribute to campaigns as "persons".

You have my apology for dismissing the Tea Party as soon as Glenn Beck got involved. It's not your fault it was hijacked. I'm not convinced the OWS is hijacked at this point - jury is out so far...

I'm all on board with us working together for the things we can agree upon! Now, I'm off to check out this new movement you are starting.

I wouldn't say it if I didn't mean it.

Originally posted by TDawgRex
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

I believe that OWS should focus on one thing....anger. And why they are angry. All the various reasons.

You've got to boil down the problems to get to the core of the solution.

Kind of like milking spiders for their silk...And it is never easy and they don't like it.

Plus, their teats are small and the buckets tip over alot.

Good one Beez! OWS really isn't the majority it wants to be. So many are really fringe. Communists, socialists, Nazi party, even Francis Fox Piven was there giving talks.

I was listening to Jonah Goldberg on CSpan. He mentioned that OWS has completely lost the mainstream America.

Originally posted by ColCurious
reply to post by beezzer

 

What the hell? First time I read about this.
Nazis actually attended at the OWS protests? What was the peoples reaction towards the Nazis?
Why are there no videos about this???

If Nazis showed up at the protests here in Germany they would face a pretty rough welcome...

The Nazis have pledged their support for OWS. Whether they showed up physically I do not know.

Hey know what else I thought was interesting...Donald Trump was saying that the banks really have done wrong by the people but that the people need to be protesting in front of the White House and that it really is the fault of govt. He said you cant do deals with the banks and he's right, but the govt really is responsible for this trashed econ.

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by neo96

 

Neo, I'm willing to give them the benefit of doubt. Call me an ol' softy, but if they're against large government and espouse personal responsibility, then why not back them?

All they need to do is disavow the DNC endorsement, the nazi endorsement, the socialist endorsement, the union endorsement and stand on their own.

For ALL Americans.

You know, that 99%?

To that, I would add that they need to stop with the calls for violence. It is clear that many of them want violence so that they can become martyrs for the cause and make it look like all the police are just evil. If they stop calling for violent revolution, that would help make them look like really peaceful protesters.

I think the difference is that the Tea Party was actually hijacked by racist, bigoted people like Glenn Beck. The OWS movement, while being somewhat vague but having a general message, has not been hijacked. It is simply a bunch of pissed off people who decide to walk downtown and protest. That is how it is in Seattle anyways, and it appears similar everywhere else. The OWS isn't trying to be a party; they are not hosting one-off rallies with big name politicians coming and speaking; they are simply a bunch of people doing what they think, and so of course the message is less clear, but they are all angry about the same thing.

So yeah, I am with OWS, and I was one of the people who was against the Tea Party. I don't think it's hypocrisy because the two movements had different goals and different ways of getting at the goal. The Tea Party held rallies but never actually stayed overnight for weeks in front of banks; I am all for the true Tea Partiers, the actual people who are mad about corrupt government, getting involved with OWS, but I respect OWS' initial dedication to the cause in a way that I did not respect the events of the Tea Party or the structure behind the events. This feels more organic and real, and I especially can see that OWS isn't really set up in a way that it would be easy for anyone to hijack them, because they are in so many places, have so many involved, and have no hierarchical structure.

reply to post by spacekc929
So you don't think the Tea Party is real enough? Do you espouse the violence? The DNC endorsement? The socialist endorsement?

Just because the Tea Party didn't do camp-outs doesn't invalidate their message.

Do you agree with a smaller government message?

How about a return to personal responsibility?

These two items have no political label attached to them.

reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus

Yes I read that.
Most Germans have strong feelings against Communists and National Socialists alike, because as you might know, we already had "some problems" with both of them in our history.

Thats the reason why I oppose strong government and corporatism merged into one... its the same thing all over again.
It would be absurd to protest corporate corruption and big government on the one hand, and to allow Nazis to participate in the protests on the other.

However, there is a huge difference between "pledgeing their support" and actually "showing up physically".
As I stated before, OWS needs to dissociate themselves from Nazis... if they show up, they must be rejected.

If they pledge their support, OWS must still dissociate themselves, but its not the same, since everyone can announce their support for anything.

Originally posted by ColCurious
reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus

 

Yes I read that.
Most Germans have strong feelings against Communists and National Socialists alike, because as you might know, we already had "some problems" with both of them in our history.

Thats the reason why I oppose strong government and corporatism merged into one... its the same thing all over again.
It would be absurd to protest corporate corruption and big government on the one hand, and to allow Nazis to participate in the protests on the other.

However, there is a huge difference between "pledgeing their support" and actually "showing up physically".
As I stated before, OWS needs to dissociate themselves from Nazis... if they show up, they must be rejected.

If they pledge their support, OWS must still dissociate themselves, but its not the same, since everyone can announce their support for anything.

edit on 19-10-2011 by ColCurious because: (no reason given)

Hahaha so Obama supporting them really means nothing because he hasn't showed up in their midst. Well okay then!
I guess that means you supporting them here means nothing either because you are not physically there?

reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus

Well, I wouldn't say it means nothing, but its not the same as "hijacking" the agenda or actually participating in the protests - openly accepted by everyone.

Neither the tea party, nor the OWS protesters become Nazis, just because Nazis announce their support towards them or some of their ideas.

This thread is stupid!!!! Tea Partiers are too stupid to realize that OWS has the same goals. You people just keep bashing any attempt to incite real change from the top down, and cannot even support Americans.

Tea partiers think they are "better" than OWS people. You are idiots.... Bottom line....

1. If your retirement has been smashed by the government...you are all on the same side....
2. If your grand kids/kids are in $35,000 debt upon birth...you are all on the same side...
3. if your retirement portfolio (if you have one) is worth 1.3 less than 3 years ago...you are all on the same side...
4. If your paycheck is the same or less than 3 years ago...and your bills are all up...you are all on the same side...
5. If your bank took a bail out, and you are paying $5.00 every month to use your debit card...you are all on the same side...
6. If you are aware that corporations create federal policy behind your back...you are all on the same side...
7. If you are aware that this country does not produce anything, because all manufacturing has been "extracted"...you are all on the same side...
8. If you believe that the federal government id getting a tighter grip on your personal lives and freedom...you are all on the same side...
9. If you believe the voice of your movement, should NOT include celebrities, and politicians...you are all on the same side...
10. If you just want to be left alone, to pursue life, liberty, and happiness,...you are all on the same side....

If you are a clean cut conservative, republican, veteran who does not like dirty hippies...get over it...you are fighting for the same side....

Grow up, dividers...you are all getting raped by the same side.... Tea Party arrogance will be their own demise, and guess what...Tes Partiers seem to represent all the old farts that are directly responsible for this mess my kids have to deal with through your stupidity, willful ignorance, and arrogance, and trust of the government....

Why do the young people have to deal with your attacks on them just for actually showing up to something, persistantly to address change while you losers have spent your entire life drinking the kool aid, and being a very active part in this mess over 40 years.....

leave the kids alone to finish the job you ignored for a lifetime....stop bashing them dor doing what you were too scared to do your entire life, or drop the stupid pride, and learn about OWS and how to navigate the waters to make a difference...your arrogance is pathetic...

I know I have been pretty focal about OWS in several threads. I will say this. I would like to add my support to them, but i can not. The reason, I am very principled person. I can not subscribe to the " My enemies enemy is my friend" thought process. Yes I agree with certain aspects of the OWS movement. I do not like the way banks operate, I think the government is corrupt and non responsive, I think the fed is an evil entity. Thats about where the similarities stop for me. I think Unions are just as corrupt and dangerous as the Fed (the leadership not the actual members) Socialists, nazis, communists, fascists all are bad ideas for this country. So therefore I can not lend my support. The OWS movement has too much lean to the progressive side of things. It was first organized by anti capitalists. I happen to like capitalism ( pure capitalism, not this farce we have currently) Personal responsibility and smaller government. Personal responsibility is the biggest one for me. progressive ideals run counter to that, as they want more entitlements, which in turn creates a bigger government, which raises taxes even more. So how can I support a group who has the prevailing ideas tend to be progressive?