Obama Approves Arctic Ocean Drilling

Originally posted by UniverSoul


no one has the right to take stuff from the ground

Hilarious!!!

You do know EVERYTHING you have in front of you,from food,to computer,to energy relies on Petroleum?



Obama is a idiot. Just look at his treasonous fiasco with Solyndra. Dont mind drilling,if its not going to come with a ecological price,or a taxpayer one.........

Originally posted by sonnny1

Originally posted by UniverSoul


no one has the right to take stuff from the ground

Hilarious!!!

You do know EVERYTHING you have in front of you,from food,to computer,to energy relies on Petroleum?

Obama is a idiot. Just look at his treasonous fiasco with Solyndra. Dont mind drilling,if its not going to come with a ecological price,or a taxpayer one.........

everything in front of me has been made from petroleum because we have been forced to use it
the fact is we could of used renewable energy to make it all many decades ago, but no people form monopolies with the 'permission' of government so we dont have a choice.

haha 'dont mind drilling if its not going to come with a ecological price or a tapayer one'
now that is hilarious
we dont even know half of the potential long term ecological risks of all this drilling, we could be ruining the very structure of the earth..not to mention countless oil spills, destruction of habitiat, destruction of third world nations.. you know the list goes on
and the taxpayer price..let me tell you its a lot more than if we had a fair unmonoplised clean energy system. they choose the price, and will continue to do so..the government allows them to do that because they get paid off and at the same time were paying them off. everything done with government permission is a cost to taxpayers

you people who support mining and the resource industry really dont know the full implications of what your supporting

Originally posted by UniverSoul

everything in front of me has been made from petroleum because we have been forced to use it
the fact is we could of used renewable energy to make it all many decades ago, but no people form monopolies with the 'permission' of government so we dont have a choice.

haha 'dont mind drilling if its not going to come with a ecological price or a tapayer one'
now that is hilarious
we dont even know half of the potential long term ecological risks of all this drilling, we could be ruining the very structure of the earth..not to mention countless oil spills, destruction of habitiat, destruction of third world nations.. you know the list goes on
and the taxpayer price..let me tell you its a lot more than if we had a fair unmonoplised clean energy system. they choose the price, and will continue to do so..the government allows them to do that because they get paid off and at the same time were paying them off. everything done with government permission is a cost to taxpayers

you people who support mining and the resource industry really dont know the full implications of what your supporting

Still,you stand there USING the very thing you are arguing about ! Hypocritical,to say the least. I am all for going green,unfortunately It will never be enough. I find it Ironic that you can claim ALL those things,but still use the very products you claim are destroying the world. You have NO problem using the energy,the plastics,the food ,the vehicles made from,or being used from PETROLEUM. I have NO problem claiming that I do,but im not using the excuse that Im forced to. How bout this ? Turn your computer off,cancel your electric bill,and live out in the open............. Then you can claim all you want to claim............point fingers at who you want to. Right now,your pointing one at me,while three are pointing right back at ya..........

reply to post by sonnny1


and asprin

some pharmaceuticals are made from petoleum deritivates.its a multi trillion dollars multi industry scenario with no other way to replace alot of those products.

Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by sonnny1

 

and asprin

some pharmaceuticals are made from petoleum deritivates.its a multi trillion dollars multi industry scenario with no other way to replace alot of those products.

Im getting a headache typing on my Petroleum based keyboard,staring through my 99% petroleum based monitor. Time to take a petroleum derived asprin,out of my 100% petroleum based plastic cup.............

Originally posted by loam
reply to post by Indigo5

 

Originally posted by Indigo5
You mean they could have lied?

Why is it you so easily assume they aren't lying now to uphold the leases?

You can lead a horse to water....

*sigh*

edit on 6-10-2011 by loam because: (no reason given)

Because denying the leases would have been the politically expediant and advantageous thing to do.

It would have avoided OPs just like this. It would have pandered to the Democrats base during an election year.

They gain no support from the conservatives by affirming the lease.

Their was great disincentive to affirm the leases, but they were obligated to report back to the courts whether the envirornmental parameters set out by the court were met, and they did just that. They didn't sell the leases, Bush did, they just FOLLOWED THE LAW.

ZERO motivation to lie in affirming that the leases met the envirornmental parameters.

TONS of motivation to fudge the numbers and deny the leases.

They chose to be honest and follow the law rather than lie for political advantage...and the possibility that it was simply an honest accounting is a big empty black hole in your logic. Does not compute.

I can point out logic until I am blue in the face...but an ideologue doesn't "think", they just eat what they are fed. Their ideology is part of their self-perception, and if logic challenges a claim, they see it as a personal challenge to "who they are" and their "belief system" and defend the contorted of failed logic as if it represents "them" and their "belief system", rather than a topic.

Give it a try...respond with a logical answer rather than an emotional or personal one. I have made a plain and logical case above.

reply to post by Indigo5

Originally posted by Indigo5
ZERO motivation to lie in affirming that the leases met the envirornmental parameters.

TONS of motivation to fudge the numbers and deny the leases.

Originally posted by Indigo5
I can point out logic until I am blue in the face...

Logic isn't the problem here.

The problem is that you and I operate off of different premises.

You think Obama and his administration are honest brokers.

I do not.

Plain and simple.

Originally posted by Indigo5
but an ideologue doesn't "think", they just eat what they are fed. Their ideology is part of their self-perception, and if logic challenges a claim, they see it as a personal challenge to "who they are" and their "belief system" and defend the contorted of failed logic as if it represents "them" and their "belief system", rather than a topic.

Yeah.

Keep telling yourself that is what is going on here in our discussion if it makes you feel better.

Originally posted by Indigo5
Give it a try...respond with a logical answer rather than an emotional or personal one. I have made a plain and logical case above.

Back at ya... :p

Originally posted by loam


Logic isn't the problem here.

The problem is that you and I operate off of different premises.

You think Obama and his administration are honest brokers.

I do not.

Plain and simple.

And thus you respond by telling me what I believe?

By not answering any of my logic based questions and repeating the personal nonsense you have clearly confirmed that you have no answer, only an ideologues passion to perpetually suspend logic and disbelief.

Are you even aware that you didn't not support your claim or answer my simple question in your last post?
Only personal attacks and telling me what I think?

Delusion or tactic?

Originally posted by loam

Originally posted by Indigo5
Give it a try...respond with a logical answer rather than an emotional or personal one. I have made a plain and logical case above.

Back at ya... :p

What do you mean "back at ya?" Are you even reading posts.

How would I respond in a logical way to personal attacks and BS? You are not making sense.

I asked a simple question that you were apparently unable to answer. What was the motivation for the Department of the Interrior to Falsify their report to the courts in support of the Leases that the Bush adminstration sold?

Notice there is nothing personal in that question? I am begining to worry you have slipped to far to evaluate anything objectively? Is your mind just one big shouting match between FOX News and MSNBC?

Originally posted by sonnny1

Originally posted by UniverSoul

everything in front of me has been made from petroleum because we have been forced to use it
the fact is we could of used renewable energy to make it all many decades ago, but no people form monopolies with the 'permission' of government so we dont have a choice.

haha 'dont mind drilling if its not going to come with a ecological price or a tapayer one'
now that is hilarious
we dont even know half of the potential long term ecological risks of all this drilling, we could be ruining the very structure of the earth..not to mention countless oil spills, destruction of habitiat, destruction of third world nations.. you know the list goes on
and the taxpayer price..let me tell you its a lot more than if we had a fair unmonoplised clean energy system. they choose the price, and will continue to do so..the government allows them to do that because they get paid off and at the same time were paying them off. everything done with government permission is a cost to taxpayers

you people who support mining and the resource industry really dont know the full implications of what your supporting

Still,you stand there USING the very thing you are arguing about ! Hypocritical,to say the least. I am all for going green,unfortunately It will never be enough. I find it Ironic that you can claim ALL those things,but still use the very products you claim are destroying the world. You have NO problem using the energy,the plastics,the food ,the vehicles made from,or being used from PETROLEUM. I have NO problem claiming that I do,but im not using the excuse that Im forced to. How bout this ? Turn your computer off,cancel your electric bill,and live out in the open............. Then you can claim all you want to claim............point fingers at who you want to. Right now,your pointing one at me,while three are pointing right back at ya..........

what your saying is testament to what im saying
that doesnt make it a good thing, just means we dont have a choice

While Obama is basking in the glow of announcing the release of the oil leases, the EPA is helping several environmental groups bring suit to prevent drilling on the leased area.

As far as renewable energy sources are concerned, get off your butt and come-up with an efficient source. Oh wait, if you do that you will become one of the evil rich.

How lovely...

Let's face it folks, we all knew this was only a matter of time.

So now that we've killed off the flora and fauna in the Gulf of Mexico, we need to kill off the Arctic's too. Afterall, it wouldn't be an industrialized world if we didn't, right ?

The reality is, unfortunately, that this is one of the ways to bring money back into the US economy and employment base.

And as far as Obama goes, I really don't think he gives a damn about what anyone thinks of him anymore because he knows he won't be serving another term... hence he's going to go full hog with everything "unpopular" between now and his last days. Just like Bush. No doubt, there's more to come before the circus draws its tent after the final show.

There's no such thing as an honest, trustworthy, up front, and transparent POTUS. They all come across as being such (as is necessary) until they step into office. How many presidents are you guys going to go through before you finally wake up and realize that ? Political parties matter none, it's all nothing but propaganda machinations.