One in 25 bosses 'is a psychopath' but hides it with charm and business-speak

If you have never seen the movie, "American Psycho", you should - It explains it all so metaphorically perfect. (maybe metaphorically - maybe not???)

Trailer: www.youtube.com...

Businesscard scene: www.youtube.com...

PS. the sequel sucks... Not written nor directed by the same peope...

reply to post by v1rtu0s0

Can't say this surprises me at all and like many others, I think the percentage is probably higher within certain professions. How would you like to be working for three of them at the same time? At my last job, I was upper management, one rung under the big kahunas. There were four partners in the firm.

Psycho #1 was the CEO - I knew he was at least a sociopath on day one because his vibe was completely in opposition to his demeanor; I could actually feel the controlled hostility eminating from under a smooth surface (soon realized he was the one with true psychopathic tendencies). He was an interesting study and went through all of the "tricks" to try to deceive me because he knew I knew. He even actually cried in my office one time over the illness of one of my employees. Was such total BS and when it became apparent it wasn't working, the facade dropped quicker than you could blink an eye. He then changed tactics to "you and I are very much alike"; talk about the hair standing up on the back of your neck and it took me a few days to stop doubting myself and realize it was just another well planned manipulation. Cheated on his wife blatantly with young office workers and openly made illegal, discriminatory and prejustice statements about others in the firm while acting like Grandpa Joe to those lower on the totem pole about whom the statements were made. Image and maintaining the facade was a strategic game to this man and he took great pride in hiding his true self. I can EASILY see him slipping beyond non-violent behavior if provoked or threatended. He didn't even try to hide the sick rush he got from intimidation and power but that glimpse of reality was saved for the unlucky few.

Psycho #2 was a power hungry egomaniac who couldn't cope with anyone knowing more than he did. He had a true love/hate relationship with #1 which was bizarre. He got off on making decisions that affected other people's lives and heaven forbid you disagreed with him. The higher the stakes were for the other person, the more he got off on it. I should have kept my mouth shut but couldn't; he was the ultimate tool of my disposal because I couldn't stand it anymore and decided that no amount of money was worth it.

Now Sociopath #3 was probably the most challenging of all because not only did he make no attempts to hide his sociopathy (I don't think he could have progressed to the violence of a true psychopath), but he was convinced that certain people (namingly me) were the instruments for perpetuating the fraud so he made my life a living hell if he didn't know where I was night and day and knew all of the buttons to push when he felt I got out of line; manipulations were always emotionally based because he was able to suss out my vulnerabilities very quickly which were basically the decent and honest people working under me who I protected constantly. What's that saying about nice people??

Then there was partner #4 four who, I think, was an innocent schnook just as tramatized by 1, 2 and 3 as I was, but not enough to jeopardize his seven figure salary. So he turned a blind eye and took many extended vacations and business trips and became the butt of many jokes for 1,2 and 3. On top of that, I was involved with another sociopath in my private life who used me and then dropped me when I was no longer any use to him. People often wonder why I ended up going into seclusion for almost a year to recover and can't seem to bring myself to trust anyone. So do I think it's possible that psychopathy is prevalent and even advantagious in today's business environment? Sickeningly yes, I do and there's just not enough of the good guys at the top with the stomach needed to do battle with them day in and day out.

reply to post by timidgal


It sounds like there is a whole story here that I would like to hear. Especially because of bits like this:

I should have kept my mouth shut but couldn't; he was the ultimate tool of my disposal because I couldn't stand it anymore and decided that no amount of money was worth it.

and

the fraud.

elaborate on your situation and what happened?

Always the classic... "i am just like you" statement the psychopaths make.

My boss is a psycho and has intentionally placed sociopaths underneath him. I cant even begin to explain how angry it makes me listening to him getting the hostesses and waitresses to cry. The worst part is that his whole management staff loves it.

Although there is a silver lining. The sociopaths he places around him are just there to get a check and go home... only working as hard as they have to. They will be the leeches that eventually bleed him dry. None of them care about the food they make or the quality of service they give.... because they completely lack emapthy and compassion.

Originally posted by GogoVicMorrow
reply to post by timidgal

 

It sounds like there is a whole story here that I would like to hear. Especially because of bits like this:

I should have kept my mouth shut but couldn't; he was the ultimate tool of my disposal because I couldn't stand it anymore and decided that no amount of money was worth it.

and

the fraud.

elaborate on your situation and what happened?

Sure and it's not as complicated as it sounds. #2 didn't like me because I opposed many of the games he played with other people's lives and livelihoods just to satisfy his need to exert power over what he considered the peons. Don't get me wrong - he was one of the owners of the company and it was his prerogative to decide who he wanted in his employ, but he was engaging in illegal labor law activities (i.e. discriminating against someone because of a disability or because of their age) and I just couldn't keep my mouth shut about it and threatened to go to the authorities. He wasn't used to that and started picking apart everything I did and lying to the other partners about me (all because he was a sociopath who couldn't care less about me or what his lies might do to my reputation in the industry which is a small one where everyone knows everyone). Although his efforts failed because there was no solid proof (and I knew how to protect myself against allowing such false "proof" to be invented), he made my life miserable. The constant stress of battling and dealing with each of them on a daily basis finally got to me and made me physically sick. He tried to fire me for taking a protected leave of absence but I knew too much about the legal system and #1 was all about maintaining a certain image and didn't want to risk a lawsuit that they knew I would be vocal about. In the end, I realized that the whole time I was making myself sick because of them, they were benefiting from the work I did for their firm and my sanity snapped back into place. I didn't return and gave up a hefty salary I had worked years to attain and which is not easy to come by these days. It's great to have morals and integrity but believe me, they don't pay the bills...

and

Fraud - #3 was a fraud because he appeared to be someone he was not and did some unconscionable things that I can't elaborate on (use your imagination about this male and you'll probably get some of what I'm talking about) but it was my job to clean up his messes (of which there were many) and I did my job very well.

Difference between them and me is that their actions had no affect on them whatsoever - to them it was a game to reaffirm their self-glorified entitlements in life - whereas my actions, which I was obligated to carry out on their behalf, made me physically sick.

I wonder what the percentage of psychopaths/narcissists/sociopaths on ATS is? I have thought about this before and I think it must be much higher than the general population. I can sense something like this in some posters, I'm very sensitive to this personality type for some reason. It's not the things they say but the posting style. I can't put my finger on it but it oozes a kind of detachment from the human stream, so to speak.

Also I think these things are correlated with high intelligence, and the quriky kind of intelligence you see a lot on ATS. I imagine these people enjoy the detachment of a moniker and interactions where there is no body language, everyone is semi-anonymous at best, and relationships and "community" can be fleeting.

What else...the successful psychopath...yeah, you can sniff them out...one key is that things that horrify normal people won't horrify them. There is a kind of very unusual calmness to them, even if they are very dynamic. This gives them a strange attractiveness/charisma because they are usually very brave and steady. But you just know on other levels these people are walking time-bombs for anyone who cares for them....

reply to post by Partygirl


People who are three deviations above the norm on an iq tend to feel through what they think, and have a detachment that resembles psychopathy. They share a few things in common, but are pretty different at the same time.

I have no doubt a good chunk of people on ATS would get the label of aspd, at the very least. I've seen a lot of members reveal that they're a psychopath on ATS over the years. That's one of the reasons I'm so skeptical of conspiracies initially. Tons of con artists who just prey on weaker minds.

I have observed many internet threads on psychopathy/sociopathy, both on this message board and on other ones. It is a topic that attracts a lot of attention and interest from men and women of all walks of life. I'm sure you can find lots of different patterns in those soups of assocation. One strand I've noticed in particular that seems to run through these threads on the Internet -- It is the fascination of women with these types of men. "Ooh,ahhh, I'm just so attracted to this kind of man even though I know he will crumple me up like a used soda can and toss me over his shoulder. What should I do, what should I do?" Gee, sister, I dunno. Maybe sublimate it in an "academic-" sounding interest in these "Fascinating characters" and a barely-concealed titilation on internet message boards? Clue-by-four: There is no "enigma." They are simply bigger, stronger, and/or smarter guys who have no compunction about reaching out for what they want in the world. The rest of us call them "alphas," "d-bags," or "those &%$# lucky sons of &%'s." It's natural for you to be attracted to them, that's a billion years of cellular biology on up there, but we also have these things called frontal lobes that allow judgement. Think it through, think it through...thaaaat's right, you've seen this afterschool special before, haven't you? Avoid these people, they are not Judd Nelson to be tamed by you, the young Molly Ringwald of your fevered imagination. No. These people are usually deeply, deeply damaged in ways you cannot possibly fathom, things going back very far in their lives. They are in pain, and they will drag you along like a chainfall dragging off a pickup truck down a dirt road.

In the meantime, while we wait for you to wise up, plenty of betas such as myself will be waiting fathfully for you to "settle" for us eventually, as you inevitably will. All we ask is that you try not to take out your own frustrations for a life misunderstood untill to late on us. It isn't our fault you are a victim of biology and genetic impulses. After all, so are we men. Do you have any idea how often we think about sex whether we want to or not? It's like the tormenting fires of hell itself for a man if he can't "scratch that itch," you know. That's why we get phenomena like Westboro Baptist Church, The Pakistani Mujahideen, and middle-aged men leafing for a disturbingly long period of time through their wives' beauty magazines. Heck, I admit it as a man. But you women need to admit your own fleshy failings, too.

reply to post by FailedProphet


Just...whatever. Never mind. Edit.

I banish this post for all eternity.

reply to post by Partygirl
You should just ask. I've found that most people with anti-social personality disorders, especially the ones you cited, are more than happy to reveal themselves under the cloak of anonymity. There was a great thread that several of us participated in about the general subject matter which you might find interesting. I'll try to find it and post the link for you. Personally, I think it would be somewhat difficult to suss out a true sociopath based on posting style or perceived detachments unless one has had the opportunity to study enough samples to come up with quantifiable patterns. There are many other categories into which a person could fall that might be mistakenly assessed through non-verbal communication (such as those on the autism spectrum).

EDIT: Found the link to the thread I noted - www.abovetopsecret.com.... I think you'll find it interesting...

reply to post by FailedProphet
I found it to be incredibly whitty and quite honestly, very sexy. Personally, I'll take a cerebral man (no pun intended) with a sardonic sense of humor over a "bad boy" Alpha narcissist any day of the week. Unfortunately, I learned this the hard way through my own fleshy failings as he was able to pretty quickly sum up what I would find appealing in a man and then played the role perfectly. With that said, it doesn't take more than once for most of us gals to learn our lesson so hang in there FailedProphet - there are still a few good women out there who know the real thing when we see it...

I wanted to post the quote below. I posted it before on ATS before once, so I hope you will forgive me if you have seen it, but I think its the best literary description of what I imagine the inner life of a psychopath to be like.

"...where there was nature and earth, life and water, I saw a desert landscape that was unending, resembling some sort of crater, so devoid of reason and light and spirit that the mind could not grasp it on any sort of conscious level and if you came close the mind would reel backward, unable to take it in. It was a vision so clear and real and vital to me that in its purity it was almost abstract. This was what I could understand, this was how I lived my life, what I constructed my movement around, how I dealt with the tangible. This was the geography around which my reality revolved: it did not occur to me, ever, that people were good or that a man was capable of change or that the world could be a better place through one's taking pleasure in a feeling or a look or a gesture, of receiving another person's love or kindness. Nothing was affirmative, the term "generosity of spirit" applied to nothing, was a cliché, was some kind of bad joke. Sex is mathematics. Individuality no longer an issue. What does intelligence signify? Define reason. Desire -- meaningless. Intellect is not a cure. Justice is dead. Fear, recrimination, innocence, sympathy, guilt, waste, failure, grief, were things, emotions, that no one really felt anymore. Reflection is useless, the world is senseless. Evil is its only permanence. God is not alive. Love cannot be trusted. Surface, surface, surface was all that anyone found meaning in... this was civilization as I saw it, colossal and jagged..."

American Psycho, Brett Eston Ellis, pp.274-275

reply to post by Partygirl


This is a good study on the subject...this is part one but you'll get the idea fairly quickly...



CJ

"the corporation" is an insane, murderous, heartless psychopath, concerning SOLELY with PROFIT, and has ZERO consideration for HUMAN PROSPERITY. anyone trying to "get to the top" must "just do their job" which requires hardening yourself against your own conscience, as you will be playing god with people's lives.
this mostly requires "buy low, sell high" with the end result being, analogically, a farmer selling something for one cent a pound, and it going for a dollar a pound at market.
cui bono? the guy who broke his back toiling (and gambling against mother nature) for a year, or the guys who spent a few minutes saying "buy" or "sell".
the stock market is evil. corporations are evil. "the market" in it's current form is evil.
you are what you eat.