Survey Results: Origins and Evolution

Originally posted by NeverForget
reply to post by SLAYER69

 

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/58c70dad4cab.jpg[/atsimg]

Thanks, this explains everything.

Laters.

String Theory...

reply to post by Gorman91


Hi again Gorman,

Just a quickie..

Do you really honestly expect something from a different planet to be any more similar?

Depends on whether or not the 'something from a different planet' wanted us to look similar i suppose.
That or whether or not both species originated from a common but distant source.

Because if you are advanced enough to do that, chances are you won't be bothering with biological beings anymore.

Again it depends.

Perhaps not for themselves, but if there was an intention was to seed life elsewhere, the biological route would be a logical route to take. Especially if that was how their own species began, they would probably wish or have hopes that the seeded life would follow a similar path to their own.

reply to post by PapagiorgioCZ

Before I go to bed (and I have to) I've got one thing to say to all you proof-requiring atheists:

"You alone are proof of god"

Well...that's the God debate over. Peace. LOL

Originally posted by RevelationGeneration

done with discussion, was nice talking to you children

Children...interesting.
So, does that mean since you were down in the sandbox with us, you also are a child?

i think this thread is pretty much over yet i don't doubt there will be some arguing into the early hours of the morning like happened last night, creation vs evolution is a hot topic no doubt i feel sorry for the guy who claims to believe in both though,

I will admit that the two, if taking a biblical creation story, and a strict scientific understanding of evolution are indeed incompatable...its sort of wanting to get along with everyone, so you end up pleasing nobody due to not having a stand.
However, the "intelligent design" model quite often employs micro-evolution examples...saying evolution is a tool used by god for adaptation, but not the overall tool of creation...so, perhaps you feel bad for not just one guy, but the entire movement of intelligent design trying to bridge the gap.

does he know what planet he's on?

I think thats the overall discussion. Creationists do not live on the same planet as evolutionists...clearly...so the debate is who is living on earth...

I would think he must have something wrong with him to believe we came from adam and eve and then also claim to believe in biological evolution, obviously a wolf in sheep's clothing and not a Christian, thanks bye.

edit on 30-8-2011 by RevelationGeneration because: (no reason given)

Pity you didn't answer my question about what brings you here, but no problem. Thanks for sticking in there as long as you did. I personally think you are catagorically wrong here, however, I give respect to someone for sticking out against the tide whenever they do. look forward to future headbutting with you...and thanks for the foe thing.

Originally posted by Imtor

And why I think there is some other civilization similar to us to make us what we are today - do you think that from UGLY ASTRALOPHITECUS or UGLY APES our fur would fall, we would become beatiful? Because through mutation or evolution turning into somethign beatiful HELLO?

There is a little fallacy in your thinking. Iff, and I mean IFF we are the product of an alien race. How did this alien race come to be? Who created them?

Same fallacy as most creationists do ... nature is an on going event, without stop. The stars you see up there, started with just a smal microscopic collison of particles, that became a small bubble of gravity, and then gradually added plasma. They became larger and larger, and evolved into planets, and then into stars, and then from stars to ...

There is no beginning, and there is no end ... beauty is in the eye of the beholder. It all continues indefinately, and all we are, is a chemical process of the planet. We are not made by god, we only serve the purpose of chemical process on this planet. Our self thought, is not because we are big and godlike, because by self thought, and self preservation, not because it is intended ... we get eaten, and we eat ... and what we create is dirt. Any imagination, that our purpose is of some higher purpose, is merely an egoistic fantasy

reply to post by spikey


Truth, but if you started it from the beginning, the end point would probably not look like you as the creator. And if you were interested in seeding life, well, one would imagine you probably wouldn't use just your own genes. By that time you would have acquired a number of blue plants and by all means would likely not be anything more than a space-bee lol.

Hence, really, is the problem. If they wanted us to loo like them in any way, this would necessitate continual return trips to modify over eons (as we didn't just pop into existence here). But the thing is, I really doubt any civilization lasts that long. From our own observations, cultures are changing faster and faster, and civilizations are always rising and falling.

It's practically impossible to maintain such endeavors for, if they wanted us to look like them, we wouldn't be s unstable. Which in turn necessitate they be drastically different than us and, in turn, genetically incompatible.

Originally posted by Ozvaldo
reply to post by RevelationGeneration

 

REVELATIONGENERATION

YOU HAVE BEEN ASKED ON SEVERAL OCCASIONS NOW, TO EXPLAIN HOW ETHNICITY CAME ABOUT FROM ADAM AND EVE..

WHY ARE YOU IGNORING THIS? YOU SEEM TO HAVE PLENTY TO SAY.

Excuse caps everyone,
Thanks

How many times of asking this question now Oz..3 or 4? I've lost count, but i know you have got 0 replies on it..you're not the only one asking this either, so how about it RG? How about an answer?

reply to post by spikey


psssst...

Over here...

Originally posted by SLAYER69
Darwinism tells us something along the lines of survival of the fittest and that the superior traits for any given environment would become dominate and win out over lesser ones. Then if that's the case why didn't the Neanderthals win out? They were physically stronger, used tools and fire and had larger brains.

I am not going to point by point debate everything you wrote, just wanted to shed some light on this and maybe you can tumble logic it with the rest of such examples you come across.

Neandertals and homo sapian sapians bred..you can find their dna in us today (some more than others). They didn't lose, they simply got assimilated by the similar but more populated sapians..

Sort of like coming across a light skinned black man...the dark black man didn't die off, they bred with lighter people and the result is Rhianna or Obama, etc.

The previous incarnations all went this sort of way...faster reproduction cycles can produce more...a slightly higher intelligence will make more favorable survival areas that can allow for more reproduction, etc...in the end, its all about who knocks boots with who and who does it faster...and yep, our cave bro's were just as obsessed with getting their freak on as we are...and hey, some neandertals didn't look half bad (and some neandertals probably didn't ask permission anyhow)

Originally posted by spikey

Originally posted by Ozvaldo
reply to post by RevelationGeneration

 

REVELATIONGENERATION

YOU HAVE BEEN ASKED ON SEVERAL OCCASIONS NOW, TO EXPLAIN HOW ETHNICITY CAME ABOUT FROM ADAM AND EVE..

WHY ARE YOU IGNORING THIS? YOU SEEM TO HAVE PLENTY TO SAY.

Excuse caps everyone,
Thanks

How many times of asking this question now Oz..3 or 4? I've lost count, but i know you have got 0 replies on it..you're not the only one asking this either, so how about it RG? How about an answer?

Been answered...migration and adaptation
This is the one thing creationists and evolutionists both sort of agree on...once the spring sprung, people wandering around slowly changed.

Slayer answered this pretty well. so, star one of his posts

Originally posted by SLAYER69

Originally posted by Ozvaldo
REVELATIONGENERATION

YOU HAVE BEEN ASKED ON SEVERAL OCCASIONS NOW, TO EXPLAIN HOW ETHNICITY CAME ABOUT FROM ADAM AND EVE..

Mass migration out of Eden [The Fertile Crescent where Homo Sapiens and Neanderthals interbred] Then later they became genetically isolated and developed individual physical traits better suited for their local environments.

RG won't agree will he...according to him the Earth is 3000 years old, no wait...it changed to 4000 years old, or was it 6000 years ago, although some biblical scholars he knows put it between 7000 and 10,000 years old.

Neanderthals more or less died out (although we still carry some genetic material of theirs) 30,000 - 40,000 years ago...a bit longer than his 3, 4 or 6000 years claim, so didn't happen.

Originally posted by SaturnFX

Originally posted by SLAYER69
Darwinism tells us something along the lines of survival of the fittest and that the superior traits for any given environment would become dominate and win out over lesser ones. Then if that's the case why didn't the Neanderthals win out? They were physically stronger, used tools and fire and had larger brains.

I am not going to point by point debate everything you wrote, just wanted to shed some light on this and maybe you can tumble logic it with the rest of such examples you come across.

Neandertals and homo sapian sapians bred..you can find their dna in us today (some more than others). They didn't lose, they simply got assimilated by the similar but more populated sapians..

Yes I know and have argued the same exact stance.

Sort of like coming across a light skinned black man...the dark black man didn't die off, they bred with lighter people and the result is Rhianna or Obama, etc.

Yes, Exactly.

The previous incarnations all went this sort of way...faster reproduction cycles can produce more...a slightly higher intelligence will make more favorable survival areas that can allow for more reproduction, etc...in the end, its all about who knocks boots with who and who does it faster...and yep, our cave bro's were just as obsessed with getting their freak on as we are...and hey, some neandertals didn't look half bad (and some neandertals probably didn't ask permission anyhow)

No issues at all for the most part.

reply to post by bjarneorn


eh, not so sure about that. Not the evolution, you're right there. But as to nature. There is a beginning and end, set in stone. One day the universe is going to be a lot more dead, having decayed. One day that decay is going to get to dark matter and dark energy, and the repulsion force making the universe get bigger is going to stop. Then it's all going to fall back in on itself and through the black magic of quantum mechanics and string theory, reverberate into something, from something. It's almost machine-like in its precision and timing. And does beg to ask who built it. All theory of course, because that's just so far out we cannot be sure.

Originally posted by RevelationGeneration
reply to post by spikey

 

You realize you are talking to someone who believes in both the biblical accounts of Genesis and the natural evolutionary biology process at the same time?

Their belief or politics wouldn't matter to me if they were in need of help and i were in a position to help them..the fact they are a living being would be the motivation for me, not whether or not i agreed with their philosophy.

Originally posted by SaturnFX
Neandertals and homo sapian sapians bred..you can find their dna in us today (some more than others). They didn't lose, they simply got assimilated by the similar but more populated sapians..

The first part is true, almost all non sub Saharan Africans have a little bit Neanderthal DNA. The second part (Neanderthals got assimilated) is an interesting idea, but I'm not a population geneticist so I can't say, but it seems unlikely. I've only read about a short period of interbreeding (there have been 2 or 3 articles on this now) but nothing about assimilation..

Originally posted by RevelationGeneration
reply to post by SLAYER69

 

Talk about brainwashing.

OK let's...

Take a baby in swaddling clothes, indoctrinate on pain of punishment, brow beat them and condition them with your own philosophy, reward them when they parrot your belief, punish them when they don't.

How's that for brainwashing?

Seems to work very well.

Originally posted by intrepid

Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by intrepid

 

I forget if Lot was related or not, but the covenant was for Abraham's descendants.

I just checked. Lot was Abraham's nephew.

As to the rest I could show you many instances where god punished masses, not individuals. Hell, this episode alone. The Sodomites and the Gomorrahans. Jericho anyone?

Another occasion was where the Jews were wandering the desert and moaning about the food..'all this manna, manna, manna...can't we have something else for a change? A nice Egyptian roast would go down great about now, shall we go back to Egypt' kind of talk...God apparently didn't like that, and sent a plague among them and their camps and tents were sucked down into the Earth.

Just goes to show, it's bad 'manna s' to moan about the food!

reply to post by intrepid


That doesn't disprove the bible to me nor contradict it. Perhaps I missed something? I do not trust the guesstimation of man in terms of timelines, let alone some medieval monk. Like I said, I'm still looking it up.

From what I've seen, the fall of the oldest part of Egypt is pretty well synced to the flood. That's all I can say at this time because I've not honestly looked into it yet.

Besides this fact, we do not know how many people were soon after. If you read my comment a ways back, you may have seen where I pretty much pitched to left field and said Noah could have been a genetic biologist for all we know, terraforming Earth with clones and scrambling genes himself to create diversity.

It's a way out there idea, but it just goes to say I don't know at this time. If it doesn't contradict the bible, it's perfectly plausible.

reply to post by spikey


To be honest, he did just part the sea, and nearly destroy an entire civilization. To whine after that? I'd probably get pissed too.

Originally posted by spikey

Originally posted by RevelationGeneration
reply to post by SLAYER69

 

Talk about brainwashing.

OK let's...

Take a baby in swaddling clothes, indoctrinate on pain of punishment, brow beat them and condition them with your own philosophy, reward them when they parrot your belief, punish them when they don't.

How's that for brainwashing?

Seems to work very well.

This.