Ancient Aliens -war of the worlds?

No, this isn't about the tv show Ancient Aliens, nor is it about the film or even raidio drama War of the Worlds.

I cannot say I believe or disbelieve the notion that extraterrestrial beings visited our world, recently or in the distant past. There is just not enough out there to make a clear determination. If we simply elect to believe that we have always been alone, then so be it -there's nothing to discuss.

But if we, for purposes of discussion, accept for a moment that it is at least possible then there's a topic I would like to bring up.

Too often, I find "believers" claiming either, "they're here to ascend our consciousness!" or the opposite, "they want to eat us!" in some form or another and neither camp has much to back it up. The most compelling things I've seen over the years have brought me to a third possibility. Not only might we not be alone -they might not be alone either.

Standing out, for me, is the famous woodcarving from Nuremberg on April 4th 1561. A local newspaper read:

"At dawn of April 4, in the sky of Nuremberg, a lot of men and women saw a very alarming spectacle where various objects were involved, including balls approximately 3 in the length, from time to time, four in a square, much remained insulated, and between these balls, one saw a number of crosses with the color of blood. Then one saw two large pipes, in which small and large pipes, were 3 balls, also four or more. All these elements started to fight one against the other.”

(I tried to sign up for the images section of this site so i could post the pic but it says signs up are disabled. Any help would be appreciated)

The article even went on to describe a variety of the "balls" being shot down and crashing nearby, and the crash is also depicted in their image. Clearly, 1561 is not an era where we could even attribute this to a weather ballon, let alone man-made air craft. What did they see? Crosses and balls and cannon-like tubes, firing at one another? That's not even a meteor storm, and don't tell me its a parhelion. So, let's entertain the notion, for now, that it was indeed extraterrestrials. We've only really accepted alien visitation, either in the diatant or recent past, as possible. But what if there's more to it?

We could have either;

1) The same group of aliens erupting into some sort of civil war in our skies

or

2) Two groups of aliens warring with one another in our skies.

In either event, it seems natural to draw the conclusion that they are fighting over us. Yes, its possible they are simply at war and we were a nearby and insignificant casualty of said war. If so, again, there's little to discuss. But the other possibility, that they are in some way fighting over us or over earth itself? Are two forces at work here? two opposing forces? Is this why much of (but not all of) our mythology also seems to be pervaded by the theme of good vs evil? Even the mythos of the christian bible, in revelations, not only talks about the devil and 1/3 of God's angels rebelling against God, but is permeated by notions of a war against heaven. Were we created or guided by one group of entites and then controlled and enslaved by another? Are both at work today?

As for the theory of aliens controlling humanity to whatever degree, it can surely explain a great many things. The notion that Royal Bloodlines have controlled countless nations throughout history all with the singular goal of worldwide domination has always bothered me. If someone had handed the entire world over to any one of these disctators, what would they have done with it? Once you have it all, there isn't much left to do. Why the wholesale accumulation of all the earth's resources? I mean, after you're a trillionaire, how much more do you need? Attributing what amounts to the whole of human history to a foible, to a bad streak, to the propensity for jealousy and greed, seems awfully facile to me. No one but a fool would mine the planet to smithereens, pump pollutants into the air, and dump toxins in the water supply for profit. But what if it went down more like this:

Let's toss out the word "alien," it contains too much baggage. Too many images of little green, or grey, men in silver suits saying "take me to your leader." They're people, just like us. Maybe they look different, maybe not, but they travel in vehicles; not magically. They're just people. They came here and found a primitive group of beings fit to do their work for them. Why shuttle millions of workers here when you can just tinker with the dna of the natives. Give them an insatiable lust for gold and precious resources. Give them a basic ability to build and create. Maybe even limit their individual lifespans to prevent issues from arising like rebellions. And leave a few Watchers behind, to oversee the operation. Grow them, farm them like cattle, each kept to its apportionment of land, until the world is filled with them. Make them gather and toil and do your best to keep them servile. And then, when they've gutted the world of all its resources, unconcerned with the damage done to the environment, they return one day to load it all up and blast off to the next world.

It would similarly be difficult to imagine any society, human or not, that is capable of being of one mind about everything. We humans can't even be of one mind about anything. One nation says this, another nation says that and within each nation there are nays and yeas and undecideds and independent thinkers. So what if there are those among this outside force that disagree with all that's being done? Is there now somehow hope for an inferior race against its technological masters?

Again, I believe none of this nor do I discount any of it. I am interested in discussing it fully, seeing what tidbits of histroical oddness you all might present, and exploring these notions and more. For those who immediately look at this and say, "none of that could be so, we have always been alone," I invite you to look elsewhere then. We know none of it may have ever happened, just saying so is belaboring a possible truth we already understand. For those who have never considered the aliens-at-war theory, or have already imagined it could be so and have something to add to the discussion, I welcome it. let me hear differing theories, support for this theory, or just any records of oddities you find interestingly applicable.

Which site has the image?

There, I think i figured it out

Ok, surely SOMEONE wants to discourse on this.

WarIn Heaven....the words have alweays fascinated me....even when youngster.
Its all rather strange to me that God , whoever it is, would allow there to be a war in heaven.
I have always thought that this refers to aliens figghting in our skys.
I refer you to a sighting made in BC over a lake in the okasnagan.
A saucer apeared obver the lake ;late one night, and another pone right behindit.
They exchanged some beam fireing and one ship caught fire and pluged into the lake.
Only to come back up shooting.
The other saucer exploded and the one that dived into the lake took off.
Witnessed by two sepparate witnesses.
There is every possibility that the races of aliens who haunt our skies do not all get along well.
In fact it has been spoken of here and there in my studies.....(no refs but ill try to find some)
I have to agree there are indications the aliens may have fought wars in the past above earth.

That happened in the Germany,Nienburg.

It was painted by some painter which i can't remember the name.

I read about this before.

Here's description

At sunrise on the 14th April 1561, the citizens of Nuremberg beheld "A very frightful spectacle." The sky appeared to fill with cylindrical objects from which red, black, orange and blue white disks and globes emerged. Crosses and tubes resembling cannon barrels also appeared whereupon the objects promptly "began to fight one another." This event is depicted in a famous 16th century woodcut by Hans Glaser.

At dawn of April 4, in the sky of Nuremberg (Germany), a lot of men and women saw a very alarming spectacle where various objects were involved, including balls "approximately 3 in the length, from time to time, four in a square, much remained insulated, and between these balls, one saw a number of crosses with the color of blood. Then one saw two large pipes, in which small and large pipes, were 3 balls, also four or more. All these elements started to fight one against the other." (Gazette of the town of Nuremberg).

The events lasted one hour and had such repercussions that an artist, Hans Glaser, drew a woodcut of it at the time. It describes two immense black cylinders launching many blue and black spheres, blood red crosses, and flying discs. They seem to fight a battle in the sky, it also seems that some of these spheres and objects have crashed outside the city.

(UFOs at Close Sight - Ufologie.net)

---------------

Today in Odd History, an eerie battle raged in the skies above Nuremberg, Germany. It began at dawn, as dozens, if not hundreds, of crosses, globes and tubes fought each other above the city. It ended an hour later, when "the globes in the small and large rods flew into the sun," and several of the other objects crashed to earth and vanished in a thick cloud of smoke.

According to the Nuremberg Gazette, the "dreadful apparition" filled the morning sky with "cylindrical shapes from which emerged black, red, orange and blue-white spheres that darted about." Between the spheres, there were "crosses with the color of blood." This "frightful spectacle"was witnessed by "numerous men and women." Afterwards, a "black, spear-like object" appeared. The author of the Gazette warned that "the God-fearing will by no means discard these signs, but will take it to heart as a warning of their merciful Father in heaven, will mend their lives and faithfully beg God, that he avert His wrath, including the well-deserved punishment, on us, so that we may, temporarily here and perpetually there, live as His children." In the same year, a Lutheran clergyman on progress in Nuremberg wrote: "...God the Almighty has ... placed in the heavens many horrible and hitherto unheard of signs... We have seen far more signs now than in any other year. The sun and the moon have been darkened on a number of occasions. A crucifix in the sky was seen, as were biers and coffins with black men beside them. Further, rods and whips and many other signs were seen in a multitude of places... and scarcely a year has passed of late without an eclipse of the sun or moon..."

(News of the Odd)

----------------

Nuremberg, Germany. April 14th 1561. The Hans Glaser wood-cut from 1566, 5 years after the event and in the same year as the Basle report.

At sunrise on the 14th April 1561, the citizens of Nuremberg beheld "A very frightful spectacle." The sky appeared to fill with cylindrical objects from which red, black, orange and blue white disks and globes emerged. Crosses and tubes resembling cannon barrels also appeared whereupon the objects promptly "began to fight one another." After about an hour of battle, the objects seemed too catch fire and fell to Earth, where they turned too steam. The witnesses took this display as a divine warning. This report is unique in the annals of Ufology, in that it has never been repeated. There is no record of such "objects" in either local or German national folklore. The surviving Town records from the period, give no indication of any unrest either civil or external. Given the uniqueness of the incident, it appears that something supernatural or paranormal took place.

(Jim Morris)

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April 1561 - A War In Heaven?

One of the most astounding of documented sightings of aerial phenomena took place in 1561 over Nuremberg, Germany. What was described could only be called a war in the heavens, with a wide variety of craft ranging from spheres to spear-like cylinders to crosses. The sky was apparently filled with the machines, clashing in battle. Comets and such were well identified and charted in this period, so it is highly unlikely that what the people witnessed was merely a celestial phenomenon like a 'meteor shower', as some debunkers suggest. Rather, what is described are physical objects of unique detail and shapes, in 'battle' for over an hour. The battle was such that a winner was perceived as well. Spheroid UFOs were seen emerging from cylindrical 'motherships'. At the conclusion of the battle, it seems a magnificent, black, spear-like super-ship of some kind came upon the scene...

It began at dawn, as dozens, if not hundreds, of crosses, globes and tubes fought each other above the city. It ended an hour later, when "the globes in the small and large rods flew into the sun," and several of the other objects crashed to earth and vanished in a thick cloud of smoke.

According to the Nuremberg Gazette, the "dreadful apparition" filled the morning sky with "cylindrical shapes from which emerged black, red, orange and blue-white spheres that darted about." Between the spheres, there were "crosses with the color of blood." This "frightful spectacle" was witnessed by "numerous men and women." Afterwards, a "black, spear-like object" appeared. The author of the Gazette warned that "the God-fearing will by no means discard these signs, but will take it to heart as a warning of their merciful Annunciation with St. Emidius Father in heaven, will mend their lives and faithfully beg God, that he avert His wrath, including the well-deserved punishment, on us, so that we may, temporarily here and perpetually there, live as His children."

(Rense.com)

-----------------

A broadsheet that dates from 1561, held in the Wickiana Collection of Switzerland's Zurich Central Library, describes an ancient battle of ufos over the skies of Nuremberg, Germany, on April 14th of that very same year. At sunrise, many people witnessed large numbers of dark red, blue and black 'globes' or 'plates' near the sun, 'some three in a row, now and then four in a square, also some alone. And amongst these globes some blood colored crosses were seen.' The document also refers to two great tubes ' in which three, four and more globes were seen. They then all began to fight each other.' This went on for about an hour, until 'they all fell...... from the sun and sky down to the earth, producing alot of steam'. Beneath the globes a long object that looked like a great black spear was also described as being seen.


Source: Link

so what was this? wasnt any meteor storm or parhelion, thats for sure. I wonder if anyone went to investigate the crashes.

at any rate, does this bring any new elements to the ancient aliens theory? I never hear anyone ever talking about us being possibly caught up in a conflict.

Originally posted by stirling
WarIn Heaven....the words have alweays fascinated me....even when youngster.
Its all rather strange to me that God , whoever it is, would allow there to be a war in heaven.
I have always thought that this refers to aliens figghting in our skys.
I refer you to a sighting made in BC over a lake in the okasnagan.
A saucer apeared obver the lake ;late one night, and another pone right behindit.
They exchanged some beam fireing and one ship caught fire and pluged into the lake.
Only to come back up shooting.
The other saucer exploded and the one that dived into the lake took off.
Witnessed by two sepparate witnesses.
There is every possibility that the races of aliens who haunt our skies do not all get along well.
In fact it has been spoken of here and there in my studies.....(no refs but ill try to find some)
I have to agree there are indications the aliens may have fought wars in the past above earth.

I think, if they're really here, based on these references, they are more than likely engaged in some conflict. I think that sheds an entirely new light on them. Always they are the benificent, spiritual beings or the hell bent for leather monsters -but never two sides engaged in a bitter war. I wonder what else we can dig up?

reply to post by sgreco


As for 'war in heaven,' I always thought there was a rebellion of angels led by Lucifer but it seems the only reference to that is a propehcy of it some day happening, in revelations. Other than that, there are only sparse references earlier on to anything like it happening to cause lucifer's fall in the first place.

reply to post by sgreco


Perhaps they are real but are no longer with us in physical form as we see it because they themselves ascended? And what we have here are people who are somewhat related to them who are here to assist mankind?

Originally posted by cry93
reply to post by sgreco

 

Perhaps they are real but are no longer with us in physical form as we see it because they themselves ascended? And what we have here are people who are somewhat related to them who are here to assist mankind?

i'm not sure i'm ready to accept ascenion and noncorporeality without some serious evidence. But, in essence, I think its possible there are people here who are related to them. Whether they are here to assist or enslave, remains to be seen. perhaps both...