The issue of Islam: My struggle!

Germans were gullible enough that when they were told stories of Jews eating babies they believed them. Is that the same as today's videos of Muslims cutting off heads, screaming for the destruction of non-Muslims, etc.? Today we have visual evidence of atrocities committed in the name of Islam, whereas in the 1930s-1940s there was only hearsay and rumor.

I'm certainly not saying that the actions of a few (though tens, or hundreds, of thousands is hardly "a few", but compared to the entire population of Muslims it is) should be applied to the whole, but people acting atrociously on behalf of Islam does the rest of them no good.

I can sympathize with your situation. I'm guessing you are a Muslim and aren't at all pleased with the acts committed by those people in the name of Allah. But please clarify who they are. Are they "not really Muslims"? Are they just misguided? Some of the acts they are committing seem to be told to them in black and white, written 1500 years ago (or at least they believe they are). If non-Muslims need to be educated on "real Muslims", then educate us. Don't come here just to say "stop the hate". Tell us why they are wrong and you are right (according to your faith).

/TOA

reply to post by sean_uk

Thank you for your response. I did not like your initial post, it made me angry, but you have proven to be unbiased, tolerant and patient to a lot of the questions and allegations about Islam. Every religion and belief system has the right to be practised, it's just unfortunate that in the 21st century, there are so many extremist in Islam, so many Muslims in Western countries causing trouble, fear and panic. Muslims should read the Qur'an, and understand what it says, instead of relying on what the scholars and Imams say.

Thank you for your kind words...

You are correct; every religion and belief system does have a right to be practiced. But unfortunately there are often minority elements that taint the good name of the many. It is up to us as individuals to see past the loud minority and look at the quiet majority. It is up to us to see through the sensationalist newspaper story’s and internet rumours.

I have lived and worked in predominantly Muslim areas and most of these were areas deprivation. High unemployment and border line poverty. And yes, like any rough areas, there have been gangs of youths acting like idiots. If you live in predominantly poor white area it will be white youths. If you live in a predominantly poor black area it will be black youths. If it’s a predominantly poor Asian area it will be Asian youth who are normally Muslims or Hindus.

Because of that, I know that most of the stuff about Muslims hating Christmas is made up by the media. I am sure there are a few who may hate it... but then there are many different people who hate Christmas for one reason or another... However, when I worked in Barking (East London) I had many young Muslims working under me and, at Christmas, we had decorations up in the office. I received Christmas cards from some of them and couple of the young women got me small gifts, which was very nice. There was not one negative comment about Christmas and one guy said that he and his family have adopted the Christmas celebrations into their family because Jesus is such an important prophet to them.

It is so easy to fall down the road of anger and hatred when we hear that people different to us have done something wrong. But I think that it is the truly strong who can stay off this path, see beauty in that which is different and forgive when people slip up.

Peace

reply to post by The Old American

Germans were gullible enough that when they were told stories of Jews eating babies they believed them. Is that the same as today's videos of Muslims cutting off heads, screaming for the destruction of non-Muslims, etc.? Today we have visual evidence of atrocities committed in the name of Islam, whereas in the 1930s-1940s there was only hearsay and rumor.

I'm certainly not saying that the actions of a few (though tens, or hundreds, of thousands is hardly "a few", but compared to the entire population of Muslims it is) should be applied to the whole, but people acting atrociously on behalf of Islam does the rest of them no good.

Yes, sadly there are such horrendous videos of Muslims cutting off heads. But my point is this... When a minority of people in, for example, Saudi Arabia commit an evil act it should not reflect on what we think of people in Morocco. In fact it should'nt even reflect on what we think of people in Saudi Arabia if it’s a minority. But to be angry with Moroccans is ridiculous. We hate a group of people who live over a thousand miles away from the country where the act was committed because they happen to share the same religion. I would be like Jews hating the British in WW2 because Britain was predominantly Christian!! It makes no sense!!

I can sympathize with your situation. I'm guessing you are a Muslim and aren't at all pleased with the acts committed by those people in the name of Allah. But please clarify who they are. Are they "not really Muslims"? Are they just misguided? Some of the acts they are committing seem to be told to them in black and white, written 1500 years ago (or at least they believe they are). If non-Muslims need to be educated on "real Muslims", then educate us. Don't come here just to say "stop the hate". Tell us why they are wrong and you are right (according to your faith).

I am not Muslim. I am Christian and i will always defend those that i feel are being unfairly attacked. In other threads i have defended Christians, Jews, Gay people, White people,Black People etc... I always have done this and always will. My person belief is that there is to much hatred and violence in the word and sometimes you have to stand up and say "enough"!

However, If you require me to explain my beliefs regarding religious doctrine i shall give it a shot...

My belief is that many time things are quoted out of context. People who are not educated in religious books can easily pick a quote and think that it is advocating evil. But when read in its full context it can often display a different message.

For example...

9:5 Then, when the sacred months have passed, slay the idolaters wherever ye find them, and take them (captive), and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor-due, then leave their way free. Lo! Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.


Now on its own this sounds terrifying. This sounds like a direct order to murder all people who do not follow Islam, until they convert. And this passage has been used in the past, on these forums, as anti Islamic propaganda.

I am equally sure that this passage has been twisted and used by fanatical “clerics” to bend people to their will. If you were a poor illiterate farm boy whose family had just been killed by a western missile then I am sure you would become easy putty in the hands of a fanatical “cleric” shouting this verse at you.

However, when you read the passage in is its full context it becomes clearer...

This verse is from part of the Quran that refers to a deal that was struck with the pagans at the time. This deal would allow Muslims to travel through the pagans land in order to do Hajj. The Muslims kept up their end of the deal but the pagans kept refusing them passage. The pagans had broken the deal but the Muslims could not go to war until they had received permission. This verse was the permission to go to war. In fact the verse before it help to make it a little clearer...

9:4 (But the treaties are) not dissolved with those Pagans with whom ye have entered into alliance and who have not subsequently failed you in aught, nor aided any one against you. So fulfil your engagements with them to the end of their term: for Allah loveth the righteous.


So you see, it is easy to quote out of context and use it for evil.

I also believe (and again this is my personal belief and probably a little controversial for some) that the holy books are tests themselves. We are given a choice when reading these books… a choice to see a message of revenge, violence and elitism. Or a message of love, peace and humbleness. It is the content of our heart that defines the message we follow. For we see what we choose to see and at the end of time shall be judged by this.

Sorry for going off topic a little and apologies to the non-religious out there who may be rolling their eyes and thinking “here we go”

Peace