Are police out of control? Seems human nature makes them that way.

Let me start by saying that I am not convinced that all police will succumb to their human nature but that most will when given total authority especially when given the weapons to enforce it. First is the Stanford prison experiment
www.prisonexp.org...
which had to be stopped due to the level of brutality which unfolded. It became a snowball of escalating humiliation and violence as those with unchecked authority sought to impose their will.
www.google.com...:en-USfficial&client=firefox-a
over half a million videos using the terms youtube+excessive police brutality and also note I could not find any search criteria which pulled any video regarding public violence against,brutality against or any thing but literally millions of videos of police brutality and violence.
It is beginning to sound like the experiment is it not? But wait one other bit of human psych that is relevant
blogs.discovermagazine.com...
given instruction from a perceived authority MOST people will deliver pain to another to alter their behavior to an ideal stated by the higher authority.

Given these facts and the general notion that today's Law Enforcement Officer is far removed from the Peace Officer of kinder days. This change came, as the links show, as the police gained too much authority and to many painful toys with permission to use them. Now I have heard it said on this board by two LEOs that it is the crying for protection that has brought this about and we the victims of this large scale experiment are just getting what we beg for. However what I see in the millions of videos in the search base of the internet is folks want protection from the police and the violent toys and excess authority grantd them by government without public input. The ballot measures are mild compared to the policy changes that occur without input from out side, just as in the Stanford experiment those in authority gave themselves increasing control and authority over those subject to the authority. The subjugated group eventually became violent and alternately depressed.
Is the correlation I am making clear?
We must 'retire' all LEOs take away the military toys and most of their ability to exert control over the public and rehire public servants keeping the peace instead of enforcing the law. The next step is for the public to shoulder it's responsibility to self police responsibly.
I feel I will be called naive or ignorant of realty on the streets by most LEOs here but really the science and social examples are on my side in this despite the fear of anarchy that many will perceive.
Final fact no country has ever been made more "safe" by a large military police force. Most Latin American countries are examples of that. In fact perhaps we should take a history lesson from countries which did adopt an authoritarian military style police.
Thoughts?
seed

Humans+Power+near-complete lack of accountabilty=the very definition of "out of control".

Add to that the requirement that police recruits have a very low IQ (it's below "janitor" on the test chart), for-profit prison industry and hey, what a beautiful place.

reply to post by mustard seed


For every example of police brutality you show me I will show you one of police courage. You will find more videos of police brutality simply because people rarely tape the good things they do which skews alot of people's thinking.

Rational people understand this and know that if you constantly show somebody only one side of something they will come to belive that. And also police don't have absolute authority, if they did they would never be brought up on charges of any kind.

Originally posted by kro32
reply to post by mustard seed

 

For every example of police brutality you show me I will show you one of police courage. You will find more videos of police brutality simply because people rarely tape the good things they do which skews alot of people's thinking.

Rational people understand this and know that if you constantly show somebody only one side of something they will come to belive that. And also police don't have absolute authority, if they did they would never be brought up on charges of any kind.

So it has nothing to do with the examples how people handle excess authority it is only a "perception" problem? I think most rational people would study the information provided and derive a different root of the issue at hand.
And I do disagree about only the bad being shown I know plenty of people who would rather film a cop doing a good deed and if they were such angels it would be on Youtube with millions of examples along with every other thing in creation but it is not.and people are not out looking to catch cops doing wrong. Most of us still ,despite the evidence, expect the best fro our public servants. So I have to assert if cops were doing all these good deeds there would be evidence in an equal number of thankful people as those on the wrong end of the stick so to speak.
seed

reply to post by mustard seed


This is not true at all. People don't grab their video cameras when they see someone pulled over to catch the cop being nice. They do it to catch them messing up.

Alot of brave acts cops do are not situations where people may have access to cameras. Saving lives from accidents when they are first on scene, catching people prowling neighborhoods before they break in to someone's house, letting people off for tickets with a warning when they don't have too, things like that.

I was stuck waiting for a train the other day in my car and some whacked out homeless lady walked in front of my car and banged on my hood for no reason. Next thing I hear is that berp berp of a police siren, there was a cop 2 cars behind me who got out and dealt with her.

I thought that was really cool...train went by and I left but I was thinking hmmm so they are there sometimes when you need them.

I lost my license once and was riding my bike at night and a cop pulled me over. Didn't harass me but informed me that the law is that I have a light on my bike for my safety and that of drivers. Didn't give me a ticket but gave me a pamplett of the law and what the requirements are.

I would suggest not fawning over police brutality video's on youtube if you truly want an accurate picture of what most of law enforcement is like.

You have a lot of law enforcement that serve in the reserves. And yes they get called up to go to Iraq and other places then end up on your local streets after coming home. They wont tell you that but it is the truth. And they have less rules over seas then they do in the US.

LMFAO! this has been moved to Rant! What a joke. ATS= Allowable Topic Selectors. I am gonna deny ignorance of what is going on around here and bow out of this circus of censorship. When a scientifically backed and referenced topic becomes just a rant Something smells like rat urine. Cointel mining pit, C-YA
seed

Originally posted by kro32

For every example of police brutality you show me I will show you one of police courage.

That you match them one for one, show how far the police have fallen.

A 1:1 ratio is not something anyone should be bragging about or citing as an example of 'good' anything.

reply to post by kro32


It's a persons first hand experience, not videos, that really determines a persons opinion. This can work for or against an LEO. I wish more LEOs would use this simple fact to their own advantage.

Originally posted by Exuberant1

Originally posted by kro32

For every example of police brutality you show me I will show you one of police courage.

That you match them one for one, show how far the police have fallen.

A 1:1 ratio is not something anyone should be bragging about or citing as an example of 'good' anything.

That is not the ratio but is an example that police brutality doesn't outweigh their positives. There are plenty more good things done by police than negative but nice of you to extrapolate something from my post that I didn't write.

Originally posted by kro32

That is not the ratio but is an example that police brutality doesn't outweigh their positives. .

But it does outweigh them.

You can be a good cop for years but you brutalize one innocent guy and all the good you did no longer matters: You are now a bad cop.

Here ya go, where this all started,
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Are the police out of control? No. Are humans out of control? That sounds more likely to be true. It is not a matter job title, its how much power a person has. Anyone who has any sort of control or power over another person has the potential to abuse that power. However, it does not mean that everyone with power will indeed abuse it.

Apparently it has come to a point, that if you do not have anything bad to say. Do not say anything at all !

One can mention several other groups, often only being highlighted in both the news and elsewhere, when they make mistakes. This applies to doctors, social workers, politicians, celebs, soldiers, religious groups and other. Out of control, it really gets, with this "all of them, as a whole".

Some people are or will at some point experience a situation, where they simply have to have confidence and trust in law enforcement. Why let a bunch of rotten apples ruin the trust ?
Especially if you live in a country where weapons and self defense is not allowed. Roughly speaking, one can even end up being arrested for holding a müslibar near a criminal.
Therefore, some people simply don't have other options, than to rely on the law enforcement

If people "forget" to point out, when they do something good, but on the other hand, complain when they do something bad. They're not been given any reasons , why they should be "nice", Consider the working conditions they have. People complain if they are not there when you need them Civilians who prefer working against them, instead of working with them.

Criminals don't get less "creative". While on the other hand... It's like we expect, that the police must do the job the old-fashioned way. It must be like playing chess by the rules, with an opponent who invents his own rules as the game progresses

The same complex probably applies to this forum. The rules are intended the members for the sake of the members

Interesting to note the science is ignored but the opinion is hotly debated. My basic premise is that given the amount of authority and the compliance tools they are given. A large body of LE is heading down the path of the stanford experiment. Can we discuss the scientific facts presented and keep the opinions secondary please? I am already treading thin ice so let's keep this on the topic of the social ramifications of the Stanford experiment and are they playing out in society as a more violent disconnected police force? Thanx
seed

reply to post by mustard seed


Sadly, it seems the increase of a variety of "compliance tools" have made for easy reactions rather than thoughtful reactions. I can remember this 1997 case of non-violent protesters who had pepper spray swabbed directly into their eyes. LE had started using ps in the late 1980s.

The lawsuit stems from three separate incidents in September and October 1997, when protestors at the headquarters of the Pacific Lumber Co., at the gates to a logging site in Bear Creek and at the Eureka offices of then-U.S. Rep. Frank Riggs had pepper spray rubbed directly into their eyes with cotton swabs by law enforcement officers. The officers were attempting to get the protestors to release themselves from "lock boxes," into which they had secured their arms so as not to be dragged away from the site of the protest. Throughout the trial, law enforcement and defense attorneys maintained that pepper spray was a safer alternative to physically cutting the "lock boxes" apart with power tools.

The incidents became the subject of national attention after several network news outlets broadcast videotapes taken of sheriff's deputies holding back protestors' heads and swabbing their eyes, as the protesters screamed in pain.

source

Years ago I read somewhere that police car chases increased dramatically after the 1968 movie Bullitt began the car chase genre.

To say that water boarding is not torture shows just how far the national culture has advanced violence and sadistic behavior to new highs, bringing us to a new low in human behavior.