UK urges Sri Lanka war crimes probe

reply to post by Flying Sorcerer


Here man, cricket is serious busines, especialy in Sri Lanka

www.guardian.co.uk...

Originally posted by Freeborn
Firstly the Tamil Tigers were fighting a 'terrorist' war against the legally recognised 'democratically' elected government of Sri Lanka.
The UK does not take military action against 'democratic' governmments unless directly threatened.

I know... but much like Rwanda, it just annoys me that the UN leave and then all hell breaks loose.
whether or not the Tamils were right or wrong, terrorists or not... people still stood by and watched the slaughter of tens of thousands of people.


I suppose some could say that Gadaffi had every right to crush the opposition, but we still got involved.

Then there is the fear of accusations of neo-colonialism.
Any involvement in the domesic events of the region would result in intense criticism from the region, specifically the Indian givernment who were staunch supporters of the Sri Lankan governments policies and who are a country the UK would be most reluctant to upset.
There is significant 'Western' investment in India but perhaps more importantly Indian businessmen have started investing heavily in the UK with some of the UK's highest earners being of Indian origin.

Oh for sure, much the same reasons for not getting involved in Syria or Yemen.... our Buddies Saudi Arabia wouldn't approve.

But that is, for me, the most annoying thing.... how we can claim to support freedom and democracy everywhere, while propping up the most barbaric and oppressive regimes in the world.

Conversely there is relatively little UK investment in Sri Lanka and limited natural resources.
UK interest's were not being threatened so........?

As you say, it's politics and it's bollocks!

I know man, There's nothing there for us and there's nothing there to protect, why waste our money and resources... why upset our other allies in the area...

It's only a massacre.

:shk:

Look at the complete and utter indifference shown towards Mugabe and his cronies in Zimbabwe.
The UK could, and should have, made Mugabe's reign untenable and provided the means to remove a most despotic and corrupt dictator yet failed to take any action of significant effect and was happy to only issue empty rhetoric and false promises.

We are not the world's police, indeed we have no moral or legal right at all to even think that and we most definately can not afford to be so.

I know man, exactly... that one really pisses me off.
As I said on my other thread.... there are many dictators and brutal regimes imprisoning and murdering their people... what's the criteria for an intervention?

I'm not so naive as to not know that we really only look after our own interests and only get involved when it suits us... what annoys me is that we're told that the UK supports freedom and democracy and that we will not allow these kind of things to happen in the world... We wont have another Rwanda.... we wont allow another Srebrenica
but then we do....

And the one we decide to get involved in, Libya, is the very guy we've propped up and aided and supplied weapons to and given free reign to brutalise and terrorise his people..

The hypocrisy of our "Foreign policies" and rules for intervention are a joke..

As is the UN.... the UN is an absolute disgrace.

But a bit more consistency and transparency would go a long way and probably more importantly at what point does human suffering transcend pounds and pence and political dogma and scheming?

I know... that's exactly my point.

Would be nice for once if when they said "We can't sit idly by and watch innocent people die" that they actually meant it, and that they weren't thinking of profit margins.

Originally posted by Johnze
reply to post by blupblup

 

Lol my point is man, your fairly deluded if you think anything is actualy going to happen?.

Maybe I am... but you gotta have a little hope man, otherwise humanity is doomed.

The Nuremberg Trials were a waste of time I guess?

Or maybe the International Criminal Tribunal for Rwanda?

Perhaps the UN International Criminal Tribunal for the former Yugoslavia?


Maybe we just let all these people go unpunished?

Maybe we just say f*** it... let people commit genocide, murder, rape...... and then don't go after them.
If we don't have the "resources" or it's not "viable" to involve ourselves in the conflicts, the very least we can do is prosecute those who perpetrate the war crimes and crimes against humanity.

What do you think is going to happen?, we make some arbitrary legislation about embargos, maybe target a few people, ship someone off to the Hague for some publicity?, fine there government?.

As I said, the Hague would be a start..... see above.

reply to post by blupblup


Gadaffi had moved significantly from the militant, fundamental Islamic communist who supported and funded various terrorist organisations throughout the world.
Libya was a relatively 'liberal' country when compared to other's in the region.
As you stated, we activelly propped up Gadaffi's regime for a number of years.
There is no altruistic, pro-democracy, humanitarian reason we are involved in Libya, we are there for one reason and one reason only; to protect our considerable interests and investments.

Do 'they' think that 'we' are so naive that we do not recognise that?
Do 'they' think that 'we' could not handle that?

A bit of transparency would go a long way.

But surely there comes a point where enough is enough.

There shouldn't be another Srebenica.
There shouldn't be another Dafur.
Or Rwanda.
Or Iraq.
Or......?
The list is endless.

But how do we do that?

I for one don't have the answers mate.

But I do know that the way things are now is just wrong, plain and simple, and that we should, and could, do a better job of it.

So after Cameron calling for an investigation into the War Crimes and Crimes against Humanity.....

Britain tonight are about to deport 40 Tamils back to Sri Lanka...

As one member of Parliament said, "You may as well paint targets on their backs"


Apparently, the UKBA have also shared information and documents about some of the passengers WITH the Sri Lankan Government..

FFS.... :shk:


www.bbc.co.uk...


www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk...


www.channel4.com...

Just to balance it out a little

Link To Article

reply to post by blupblup

Why is this not being investigated, why are war crimes trials and proceedings not being initiated, why is Ban Ki Moon so keen to not get too involved in this? We jumped into Libya almost instantly.... but we sat by while up to 100,000 thousand people were slaughtered? Something very wrong about that.

If it weren’t for some truly dedicated journalists, this world wouldn’t know diddly. Or squat. They make WikiLeaks look like a bunch of gossipy old ladies.

www.channel4.com...

Ban Ki-Moon has come under attack for failing to push for a war crimes probe in Sri Lanka. But a former UN Deputy Secretary-General tells Channel 4 News Ban is powerless to defy Russia and China.

Critics say Ban is reluctant to take on China and Russia - veto-wielding permament council members who are against a probe into the Sri Lankan conflict - as he intends to stand for re-election for the UN's top job and needs their backing.

But Mark Malloch Brown, who was Kofi Annan's deputy in 2006, told Channel 4 News Ban is in an almost impossible position as a "new cold war of ideas" puts Western liberals on a collision course with China and Russia on human rights.

The advocacy group Human Rights Watch say he could set up an international investigation without the backing of the UN security council.

Ban said an international investigation would need the co-operation of the Sri Lankan government - something it has already rejected - or a Security Council referral likely to be vetoed by China and Russia.

John J Metzler, a veteran UN correspondent and lecturer in Asian Studies at St John's University in New York, told Channel 4 News: "I believe he clearly seeks re-election, and he's certainly within his rights to do such.

"He must balance the interests of the five permanent members of the Security Council. He must tread very, very carefully when it comes to humanitarian issues.

It’s hard to do the right thing when you’re trying to get reelected. Everyone knows that. Humanitarian issues be damned – he’s got votes to win and members of the Security Council to appease – and a gift basket just ain’t going to cut it.

Could it be that simple? Hard to believe - but there is so much about this that is difficult to believe. Hard to believe no one (the UN) knew it was happening, hard to believe no one said or did anything - hard to believe that either Russia or China could turn a blind eye to the torture and slaughter of innocent civilians.

Oh - wait...

Well, anyway, we all do - we just see, explain and justify it differently

Maybe it’s time to start holding the UN accountable for crimes against humanity. Indifference and inaction can do just as much damage as anything else.

WE THE PEOPLES OF THE UNITED NATIONS DETERMINED

to save succeeding generations from the scourge of war, which twice in our lifetime has brought untold sorrow to mankind, and

to reaffirm faith in fundamental human rights, in the dignity and worth of the human person, in the equal rights of men and women and of nations large and small, and

to establish conditions under which justice and respect for the obligations arising from treaties and other sources of international law can be maintained, and to promote social progress and better standards of life in larger freedom,

AND FOR THESE ENDS

to practice tolerance and live together in peace with one another as good neighbours, and

to unite our strength to maintain international peace and security, and

to ensure, by the acceptance of principles and the institution of methods, that armed force shall not be used, save in the common interest, and

to employ international machinery for the promotion of the economic and social advancement of all peoples,

HAVE RESOLVED TO COMBINE OUR EFFORTS TO ACCOMPLISH THESE AIMS...

www.un.org...

I idolized the United Nations when I was a little girl. Being a little girl was probably the only thing that made that possible. Truth is - it's a lawless planet and we have no recourse

sorry blups - feeling a little extra cynical tonight

reply to post by Spiramirabilis




Don't be sorry, your post is spot on and yes.... the UN are a bunch of useless, corrupt wankers who have literally no point or reason to exist.

All they do is sit there and watch people starve and die and get displaced.... and then when the UN and its staff is threatened, they run away and leave the native people there to die.


They are a JOKE.


And anyway, there's no point in discussing this, people don't like REAL news on ATS.... they don't want to hear about REAL atrocities and crimes against humanity.

They just want to discuss FEMA camps and NWO and reptilian overlords and so on.... Imaginary crap.... made up threats on their lives and so on....

FFS.

ATS should be as ashamed as the world....

reply to post by blupblup

the UN are a bunch of useless, corrupt wankers who have literally no point or reason to exist.

You're wrong about that. The UN has been giving top quality jobs to people for years and I hear they also throw great dinner parties.

reply to post by boncho







That's true.... and it times of austerity and high unemployment, I suppose the more jobs the better?

:shk:

So the LLRC are going to look through the footage from the Channel 4 documentary....


They said

LLRC spokesman Lakshman Wickremasinghe told the media that the Commission has already been examining the documentary evidence related to the war and the Channel 4 video will also be examined as a part of that process. "We have been similarly examining documentary evidence such as photographs as part of our routine procedure from time to time including the Channel 4's previous video," Wickremasinghe said. "This is not a special treatment of the Channel 4 video," Wickremasinghe added.

www.colombopage.com...

The documentary/footage can be viewed here.

It's very graphic so be warned...

Hate to say it but:

No Oil
No Money

No need to get involved

reply to post by Lucifer84




I know man, It's very sad indeed.... but not exactly well hidden buy our governments huh?

UK urges Sri Lanka war crimes probe ???

I find that to be the pot calling the kettle black.

So who is gonna urge the war crimes probe
of the UK and the USA into the atrocities
of Afghanistan and Iraq and now in Libya
and Syria ???

Hypocrites !!!

reply to post by boondock-saint




I know man.. It is stupid.

The thread was mainly about the documentary to be honest.... which is just harrowing, but yes you're right, our governments have a lot to answer for too.

Although I think if we rounded up half a million people into camps and said that these would be no-fire zones and civilian safe zones.... only to then bomb them and shell them, shoot them and rape them... that'd be pretty awful.

Or perhaps if we were purposely targeting hospitals and other make shift surgeries with a huge RED CROSS painted on the top... and blowing them up and killing people who were sick and injured... that would be pretty bad.


Or perhaps if we waited 10 minutes and then dropped a bomb where we had just dropped one.... so we could KILL anyone who tried helping the injured, so that people would have to sit by for up to 30 mins and watch their loved one's bleed to death.... that would be pretty bad.


Perhaps if we flouted and broke every war crime going......



Did you WATCH the documentary.... or perhaps you don't need to right?
Maybe it's all the NWO and doing it?

Originally posted by blupblup

And anyway, there's no point in discussing this, people don't like REAL news on ATS.... they don't want to hear about REAL atrocities and crimes against humanity.

They just want to discuss FEMA camps and NWO and reptilian overlords and so on.... Imaginary crap.... made up threats on their lives and so on....

FFS.

ATS should be as ashamed as the world....

Too true my friend, it was one of the main reasons for my absence.

Wake up ATS, properly.

This doesn't mean reptilian overlords, the real conspiracies and politicking are right in front of your eyes. Will it only matter when you and your own are suffering in this manner and the wider world stands by and does nothing?

reply to post by Goathief




I know, unfortunately ATS has moved from a semi serious alternative discussions forum, where people can talk about things that others overlook or don't get to hear about, to a joke of a social networking, youtube kinda site... where people just post a youtube video or attack a minority group or whatever and then the discussion (Argument) runs on for 300 pages... while anything of merit and anything discussion-worthy gets little to no attention.

Which is why most decent members have left... or have regular long breaks.


Oh well...