Seriously, is there any logical argument against gay marriage?

Originally posted by masterp
6. there is no such thing as love between homosexual men. There is only lust. There is no love bond between them, as there is one between a male and a female. Again, gays will not admit that.

Oh yes, nothing can compare to the love between a drunk man and his drunk female stripper friend who get married for one night in Vegas before they sober up. If anything expresses true marriage as well as the bond of love between a male and a female, it's that.

Not really, I have no problem with gay marriage. I don't care if you're gay, straight, purple or a tree as long as you don't whack me upside the head with a stick I'm okay.
Gay people haven't hurt me.

Wasn't marriage around long before Christianity?

Originally posted by LazerTron
Wasn't marriage around long before Christianity?

Dude, this is a conspiracy site. Don't be bringing no common sense in here! But yeah though marriage was around before religion.

I really couldn't be bothered to read through all of the small minded bigotry in this thread after the first couple pages, but here's my two pennies based on the overriding opinions I saw there. Before you go further though, I'd like to point out that as an institution I'm against marriage on the whole. Same sex or mixed sex, I believe marriage is both unnecessary and pointless. You don't love the person you've married any more or any less after you tie the knot.
Now that's out of the way:

1. One of the main arguments against it is that it's wrong because a same sex couple can't reproduce.
THIS is pure idiocy, and by the same logic heterosexual couples who (unfortunately) can't have children for whatever reason also should be prevented from being married. Would you tell a woman who's uterus can't sustain a foetus that she can't be married because she's unable to perpetuate an already prolific species? Or a man who's sperm count means he's unlikely to impregnate a woman that the little chance he has of fathering a brood means he's doomed to a lifetime of just being a boyfriend?
In both of these cases no child is going to be sired, but I guess no one thought of that, huh? So are these people also lumped into your "lol no baybee, no maree" category?

2. The other main argument is that marriage is a Christian ceremony and therefore gay/lesbian couples shouldn't be allowed to participate.
As if. Like a couple of people who can be bothered to use the vast and comprehensive source of data that is the Internet have already said, marriage predates Christianity by some millennia (read: thousands of years). There were marriages in Ancient Sumeria, Ancient Egypt, Ancient Greece, etc. In fact, pretty much any source you go to to read about the history of marriage will tell you that the concept of marriage not only predates Christianity, but also predates RELIABLE RECORDED HISTORY. The institution of marriage was (like many other things) absorbed into Christianity and modified to suit their beliefs. Same sex marriage was reportedly no big thing in the Roman Empire...until, that is, Christianity became the official religion at which point it was made illegal.
Marriage on the whole has been either a social or civil institution for a long time. It still is. As one poster said, if a heterosexual couple want to be married its no good just going to the church. Sure you may be married 'in the eyes of God,' but when the tax man cometh and asks why your numbers are a little off, that argument ain't gonna fly. Every married couple has to be recognised by the state before they're official. And as we at ATS all know, to the state every drone is faceless so gender isn't really an issue there.

3. Another argument is that a child deserves to be raised by a mother and a father.
Now, while this is a fair statement, I think its a bit small minded to assume that having same-sex parents is unfair on the child. What's more important, I feel, is that the child is raised by good parents. Who cares if the kid's got two mums? As long as they provide for it, care for it, and teach it how to be a valuable and well mannered part of society, I think it shouldn't matter. After all having a mother and a father doesn't mean the kid's going to be raised well. Thinking in a small area around my house, there are literally dozens of pre to post teens who've been raised by a mother and a father... and have a criminal record, know the first names of at least four police officers, have had a history of substance abuse or theft, and three who are currently spending time at Her Majesty's pleasure for ARMED ROBBERY! Teenagers... armed robbery... Being raised by mixed sex parents certainly worked out well there, eh?

To close; there is no logical argument against it. If people want to take part in a pointless ritual to prove they love each other, let them. You're feelings on the matter are not only irrelevant, they're based on ignorance (in every sense of the word). Your arguments against it are based on a lack of knowledge on the institution or its history, a misplaced connection between Christian marriage (which isn't, legally, real) and marriage as recognised by the state (which is legally real), and complete small mindedness.

JoB

The only reason why gay interactions are viewed as blasphemy is because Christianity made it so. The Romans, Greeks and various other cultures saw homosexuality as merely another pleasure.

Take out the religion, and there's no validity. And to those who say that it's not natural in the animal worlds. Explain that to my god damn cats.

This is such a silly debate and in my opinion the haters who torque the rhetoric have their panties in a knot because they refuse to accept their homosexual leanings.
The notion gay marriage will hurt society is nonsense because gays have always existed and many of them formed hidden relationships. If driving a whole segment of society to lie and live a double life didn't destroy the world, openly accepting two people who want to publicly acknowledge their devotion to one another certainly won't.

radicalheretic

I think the closest to a logical argument here is "Zomg teh gays will end the world!"

The religious argument is completely illogical. God says marriage is between a man and a woman? He also says don't eat shellfish, don't eat meat on fridays, don't work sundays. I do all three and no one thinks less of me for it, yet if I were to say "I want to marry my girlfriend" I am suddenly a heretic? That makes no sense

I shouldn’t be giving this argument any credence by mentioning it but ... marriage is for procreation? One of my friends cant get pregnant, ever, are you now going to tell her she should be banned from marrying her boyfriend? No, of course your not.

Honestly, a site like this where the majority of us are worried about being controlled by governments and so many give up their right to free thought to simply say "God says so?". What, you can't question god? What would your reaction be if someone told you "You cant question Obamas wisdom!".

Seriously, if your "logical" argument boils down to the "word of god" without any serious reason as to WHY thats gods word, quite simply you are wrong. Whatever the argument.

Reflecting on this forum, I've came to 1 conclusion.

Some of us dislike the idea of gay marriage, some of us are for it.

This is a huge forum, alot of arguments in which will come will have no logical point behind, merely people stating opinions, THEIR opinions.

Why do "Gays" want "Marriage" under the Christian institution if it's frowned upon in the first place... ??
Why can't Gay's just have their own ceremonies outside of the realm of christian marriage ??

I'm not against gay people, I'm against them wanting indoctrincation into a faith belief system that doesn't fit their criteria. In New Zealand, Gay marriage is Legal, and carries all the legal bindings of Christian Marriage as seen in the church and law.

Get your own Insitution setup, and marry therein.

reply to post by abaraikenshi


Why does a gay marriage devalue your own marriage? You honestly feel like your marriage would be meaningless if two strangers who happened to be the same sex got married? Do you need government approval to love your entire family, or just your wife?

Where did the idea that Christianity hates homosexualty come from? Not all christians are homophobic, not all priests are either. Why are you clinging so hard to that idea? Although it is in the bible its hardly a footnote. Remember this is the same bible that allows slavery and calls for death for very minor offences.

even though yes, there are animals etc that are 'gay' that still doesn't prove to be a great argument because if it was going to go to survival of the fittest, they would lose. No way to procreate, no way to bring a child into this life. Their family tree is automatically severed and everything genetic about them = lost.

unless you watch eastenders and have a female friend that is willing to conceive a child for you
which again is wrong and unnatural as a child is supposed to be brought up by man and women.

yet again, opinion ofcourse.

Originally posted by arbitrarygeneraiist
reply to post by FuGGer

 

Say what now? You do realize that marriage isn't a prerequisite for reproduction, right? People do in fact have sex and procreate without being married.

sure. i have no problems with gays or their marriages.

Originally posted by arriana
Where did the idea that Christianity hates homosexualty come from? Not all christians are homophobic, not all priests are either. Why are you clinging so hard to that idea? Although it is in the bible its hardly a footnote. Remember this is the same bible that allows slavery and calls for death for very minor offences.

Lev. 18:22 , "You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an abomination."

Lev. 20:13, "If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act."

Cor. 6:9-10, "Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders."

Rom. 1:26-28, "Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones."

Though I think that last one might be more of a "thou shalt not use a vibrator".

You know, though, I've always been the type of I feel everyone has rights, and I respect them. Though I'll admit, I'm not big on the idea of same-sex marriage, its just how I am, but I'm not going to bitch about it. Life is way too short to worry about such an idea, and who the hell am I to say they can't marry?

Originally posted by troubleshooter
A 'marriage' is the physical union of two individuals who have the ability to procreate.

If two people have a physical union that does not have the potential to produce offspring...
...they can call it what they like but it can't be called a 'marriage'.

LOL... all those old people who have remarried are running around thinking they are now married but by your definition, they are 'living in sin' so to speak. I'll send Granny around and she will whip your sorry butt.

Why don't people think about what they are saying before they hit the reply key.

I knew someone was going to quote scripture. Its not clever, its not an automatic "I win", the devil can quote scripture. Like I said, it *is* in the bible, but its only a few random verses.

The very same people that use the bible as an excuse to refuse gay marriage wouldnt dream of using the very same book to advocate slavery, or to keep women as objects, even though the bible says thats what you should do.

reply to post by technical difficulties


gay people are people too and if they want to get married then there is no reason why they should not be allowed
there is no logical reason only religious bigoted fearfull hatred of something that is alien to these people and like most sheep they fear the unknown the alien . thats it the only logical opposition to gay mariage is fear of the unkown .THERE IS NO NEED TO FEAR GAYS THEY ARE PEOPLE LIKE US

You should have just named this the ,Lets all fight over our own personal beliefs ......I have no issues with Gay marriage personally and i am a straight male but i will admit gay adoption makes me uncomfortable , to me it seems unfair to the child ...They are to young to understand the complexities of adult relationships

Yeah the thought of two men engaged in sex is sickening to say the least.