Shark fossil found in Kentucky coal mine.

Website with info Creationist view site

UPI Story Link

Everyday more and more evidence is coming out that makes Evolution look stupid. Even some of the most renowned Evolutionists have ran away from it and moved to ID (Intelligent Design) but this is not GOD for them, it is usually Aliens. Which I think begs the question, who made the Aliens or where did they come from?

This story puts something into question though, are we wrong about how coal was formed in bogs or are we wrong about the age of the Earth? Possibly Noah's flood caused everything we keep finding?

I aint really looking for a debate on it, just interesting story and food for thought.

This is interesting. Thanks for sharing. I'm a firm believer in both creation and evolution. Yes, throw the tomatoes my way. But hear me out. I believe G-d used evolution for a special purpose.

Originally posted by theindependentjournal

Everyday more and more evidence is coming out that makes Evolution look stupid.

Proof, please. Explain how this discovery makes evolution look "stupid". I'll wager that your explanation will only serve to make you look stupid. Well, maybe that's a bit harsh. Ignorant of the science you attack, then.

Even some of the most renowned Evolutionists have ran away from it and moved to ID (Intelligent Design)

Eerm.... citation needed. Care to list the "evolutionists" who have "run away from it and moved to ID"?

but this is not GOD for them, it is usually Aliens. Which I think begs the question, who made the Aliens or where did they come from?

Say what now?

This story puts something into question though, are we wrong about how coal was formed in bogs or are we wrong about the age of the Earth? Possibly Noah's flood caused everything we keep finding?

I think you'll find you're wrong about creationism.

I aint really looking for a debate on it, just interesting story and food for thought.

And why would that be? If you post up inflammatory misinformation then expect to be challenged.

reply to post by theindependentjournal


A lot of coal deposits formed in low lying tropical forests, like, for example, around the Amazon today. Periodicially (every few hundred thousand years or so) sea levels would rise, and some estuarine sediments would be deposited. Then sea levels drop and rainforest returns.

Under such circumstances, the idea of a shark being buried in estuarine deposits between layers of coal is quite
feasible.

Or maybe, the shark tooth was washed into a coastal forest during a tsunami or storm surge?

If you understand geological processes, such findings are not the least bit strange.

Every year we find more things that help to refine the history of our planet.

I know that many people believe the creation story as stated in the Bible. That's fine.

Personally, I don't think that science is being disproved but rather refined.

My view... If God exists and evolution exists, then God used evolution as a tool.

IF you believe in God, then you have to believe that God gave us a brain to be used to learn about many things. That does not mean that we are playing God. You can study the natural world and learn from it and about it. I think that God would be disappointed if we didn't examine the world around us. Eventually, perhaps, this knowledge will lead us to the path that God intended.

reply to post by theindependentjournal



Here is the problem with Science.

It only uses evidence it can directly confirm from empirical evidence.
If it can not directly confirm something then it pretty much gets thrown out.

Imagine it like a court case. The evidence is presented. Some evidence is circumstantial, some evidence is dna, some evidence is forensic. Some gets thrown out and invalidated because it cannot be verified. Then the scientific community reviews the case and then either confirms or denies something as being true or not.

And herein lies the problem. Sometimes things happen that are so outside the realm of science that they cannot be verified by scientific means. And I think this is a huge problem with science. Case in point this fossil found in coal. Something out of the ordinary happened. It doesn't fit the model for coal formation.

Now this doesn't mean that science is stupid. In fact it's quite the opposite.

But that doesn't mean it's perfect either.

Before criticizing something you should first understand the process.

Now I will criticize the process and will agree that in some areas science can be somewhat deficient in certain areas. But at least they are trying to explain what is happening in procedural method.

BTW I like the mention of the flood and scripture in the article. There are legends worldwide that describe the flood from other cultures. It's very possible that it's something that happens every so often. Possibly every time we pass through the milky way galaxy.

Originally posted by Wildbob77
Every year we find more things that help to refine the history of our planet.

I know that many people believe the creation story as stated in the Bible. That's fine.

Personally, I don't think that science is being disproved but rather refined.

My view... If God exists and evolution exists, then God used evolution as a tool.

IF you believe in God, then you have to believe that God gave us a brain to be used to learn about many things. That does not mean that we are playing God. You can study the natural world and learn from it and about it. I think that God would be disappointed if we didn't examine the world around us. Eventually, perhaps, this knowledge will lead us to the path that God intended.

I totally agree with everything you just said.

IMO I think that the creation story is somewhat allegorical. However it's very possible that in 6 days God created everything. However people forget that when it says day. It's a day measured in God's time. Not in ours. How can there be a day when the earth didn't exist yet. And how long is a day to an entity that has always existed and will continue to exist when the universe contracts back upon itself? No one knows.

reply to post by theindependentjournal


...this shark jaw is from around 300 million years ago, that's sort of within the scope of evolution, geology, paleontology, etc. What's the problem with evolution here? How does this contradict anything in modern science?
It's an Edestus fossil for crying out loud.

Originally posted by theindependentjournal
Everyday more and more evidence is coming out that makes Evolution look stupid.

Name some and explain how.

Even some of the most renowned Evolutionists have ran away from it and moved to ID (Intelligent Design) but this is not GOD for them, it is usually Aliens.

...except that they haven't. Unless you're talking about the dishonest edit job done on Richard Dawkins...so a straw man.

This story puts something into question though, are we wrong about how coal was formed in bogs or are we wrong about the age of the Earth?

The shark jaw is 300 million years old, and geologists are quite right about how coal forms.

Possibly Noah's flood caused everything we keep finding?

Except for not a single shred of geologic evidence actually resembles anything that would be found in a world which was globally flooded.

I aint really looking for a debate on it, just interesting story and food for thought.

The actual story itself is interesting, not the ignorant creationist distortions of it.

edit on 19/4/11 by madnessinmysoul because: (no reason given)

reply to post by theindependentjournal
A fossil of a genus of shark was found in a region where the genus was believed to be indigenous to, dated to the time frame from which all other related fossils have been dated.

This proves evolution to be false? Explain your view sir.

Now if the fossil were dated to 100 mya, the anomaly would merit further consideration.

Don't know why this is even newsworthy, aside from being local chatter. Though, the person who found it certainly should be proud. But its just another rock to throw on top of the mountain of evidence for evolution.

This was due to a WORLD WIDE FLOOD!

There's evidence EVERYWHERE.

Originally posted by CanadianDream420
This was due to a WORLD WIDE FLOOD!

There's evidence EVERYWHERE.

So you're bastardising science to support the bible? How does that work when it makes Noah 300 million years old?

Originally posted by john_bmth

So you're bastardising science to support the bible? How does that work when it makes Noah 300 million years old?

There have been theorized that there have been several different floods over time.
Some may be due to comets or other heavenly bodies causing huge tidal surges.
some floods due to glacial dams bursting and flooding areas.
Tsunamies caused by earthquakes could be considered floods.
Same with catastrophic volcanic eruptions causing tsunamies that cause floods.

I don't think he's bastardizing any science.

reply to post by grey580


Yes, but the biblical account has only one world wide flood and it doesn't mention it being 300 million years ago. Assuming he is referring to the biblical flood, it is a bastardisation of science to pick elements out of context to support your faith whilst conveniently ignoring the wider context and conflicting evidence.

Originally posted by grey580

There have been theorized that there have been several different floods over time.

There's pretty good evidence that nowadays major floods - whether from snowmelt, glacial melt, heavy rain fall, tropical storms, tsunamis (earthquakes) etc happen all over the world every single year.

No wonder there's so much evidence of such events in the geological record.

reply to post by john_bmth


I don't believe that he is using the biblical flood account as the event that put that bone in the coal layer.

It is quite obvious that the flood of noah was not 300 million years ago.

It would of have to have been another flood in another age.

I think he's just using the biblical flood event as an example that a "flood" did occur at some time in the past.
He was however trying to show that the bible was a historically relevant book.

And research shows that it is based in some fact.

So wait...finding a fossil millions of years old, in a region where you'd expect to find such a fossil somehow disproves evolution??? I guess if you live in crazy talking snake land it makes sense, but not if you're thinking logically/rationally.

I also love how the OP says he doesn't really wanna discuss, just post his belief (or that of IRC). No criticism allowed...which makes it preaching

reply to post by grey580


...there's evidence of large and possibly catastrophic flooding....but nothing on a global scale. Sure, we have evidence that regional floods occurred on scales that we have yet to witness in recorded history...but there's not a single shred of geologic evidence that shows that any global floods have happened.

Very cool find of an Edestus fossil fragment... from the era when most of the eastern seacoast was under the ocean (and interestingly enough, this was during a time of glaciation when sea levels were lower. Map of it his here: en.wikipedia.org...:US_pennsylvanian_general.jpg )

I like the idea that the miner will get to keep his fossil.

(edited to add that the Creationist story mentions it was found at the top of a coal seam. This means that the area was becoming an ocean as the glaciation period ended and sharks and other creatures that live along the continental shelf came into the environment.

Institute for Creation Research is always worth a laugh.
There is so much going against the "Flood of Genesis" even if we could not explain this finding (and we can) it would still not be nearly enough to even consider the Genesis account.

Your arrogance brought a smile to my face OP, Thanks.

While the Swiss Alps are made of about 60% ocean ground material, I think you can find a shark everywhere if you search enough.