The Horrifying Truth

The people of America and Europe see themselves me one of them are seen as the bastion of a peace loving and noble society. We live in a democracy a term coined by Greek Philosophy whose empire was created
and maintained by slavery. A system of slavery cleverly imposed on us still to this very day.

In essence as individuals we are all good, common sense driven and peace loving people.......

So why the wars, the misery and the greed............Kids, women innocents killed every day by the
western war mongering machine but not in our name ....

We are built upon the foundations of truth, liberty and freedom.... but in essence we have none....

Truth::TV and Media lie to us; Governments lie to us based upon this founding principle....

Liberty : Yes were free... Free to work for big corporations and create mega profits for the already mega rich.

Freedom: yes were free? except to express our views... Except to protest without para military police intimidating you for doing so. Were free to vote in micro elections where they own all the players ...

Like I said we are the good guys/gals all of us yet we let greed, manipulation and the power mongering of the few reign hand over foot over us....

There is a free and better world but we need courage like in the middle east to embrace it ....

We need to stand ... I dont no where but whereever you can ...

Every protest go join it ....

Every Strike be a part of it ....

We need to be one people ..... we deserve to be free and equal society ....in wealth and respect for each other

Any suggestions how we can acheive this would be cool......

No thanks. I LOVE my standard of living and support whatever means the gov needs to keep it that way. And just so you know this is a REPUBLIC, not a democracy. I'm pretty sure the evil west has contributed more to science than any other region on this planet, stop hating yourself and be proud.

Originally posted by Fitch303
No thanks. I LOVE my standard of living and support whatever means the gov needs to keep it that way. And just so you know this is a REPUBLIC, not a democracy. I'm pretty sure the evil west has contributed more to science than any other region on this planet, stop hating yourself and be proud.

edit on 10-3-2011 by Fitch303 because: (no reason given)

Republicans and other democracy detractors point to the U.S. Constitution and bits of history, and say, "See, the Founding Fathers who wrote the Constitution gave us a Republic. They believed democracies were dangerous and unworkable."

On that, they are partly right, but they fail to mention that democracies and republics overlap. They are not opposites. And they fail to account for the history of American government since 1788, much less the debates that took place in America prior to 1788, when the U.S. Constitution was substituted for the Articles of Confederation. Source

As for you supporting any actions your government takes to maintain your lifestyle - that makes you as bad as them. You are commiting crimes against humanity.

Ah yes A Republic like the Roman Empire

Based on a slave manipulated system ...

The only free ever society in the history of mankind were the Cathars

and the Catholic Church launched a 50 year Crusade against them killing every one

For simply creating a free and equal society who by the way were the richest in Europe at the time

Freedom means growth .... Freedom means no poverty .... So you may be secure and safe

but Millions are not and we all human and we all deserve to live decently ....

There will never be a free society when governments work for themselves and not for the people.

My solution is for everyone to ignore their goverment, if we all ignored them they would have nothing to govern.

Not sure how we'd do that but hey....anything is possible.

Out of interest but worth researching yourself ... Quick insight Cathars who had the only recorded perfect society.

In some respects the Cathar and Catholic Churches were polar opposites. For example the Cathar Church taught that all non-procreative sex was better than any procreative sex. The Catholic Church taught, and still teaches, exactly the opposite. Both positions produced interesting results. Following their tenet, Catholics concluded that masturbation was a far greater sin than rape, as mediaeval penitentials confirm. Following their principles, Cathar could deduce that sexual intercourse between man and wife was more culpable than homosexual sex.

In the Languedoc, famous at the time for its high culture, tolerance and liberalism, the Cathar religion took root and gained more and more adherents during the twelfth century. By the early thirteenth century Catharism was probably the majority religion in the area, supported by the nobility as well as the common people.
This was yet another annoyance to the Roman Church which considered the feudal system to be divinely ordained as the natural order (Cathars disliked it because it depended on oath taking).

In open debates with leading Catholic theologians, Cathars seem invariably to have come out on top. This was embarrassing for the Roman Church, not least because they had fielded the best professional preachers in Europe against what they saw as a collection of uneducated weavers and other manual workers. Worse still a number of Catholic priests had become Cathar adherents (Catharism was a religion that seems to have appealed especially to the theologically literate and whole Cathedral chapters are known to have defected, as they did for example at Orleans). Worse, the Catholic Church was held up to public ridicule (some of the richest men in Christendom, bejewelled, dressed in finery, and preaching poverty, provided an irresistible target even to fellow Catholics). Worst yet, and perhaps a cornerstone issue, Cathars in the Languedoc refused to pay tithes to the Catholic Church.

The Cathar view of the Catholic Church was as bleak as the Catholic Church's view of the Cathar Church. On the Cathar side it manifested itself in ridiculing Catholic doctrine and practices, and characterising the Catholic Church as the "Church of Wolves". The Catholics accused Cathars of heresy or apostasy and said they belonged to the "Synagogue of Satan". The Catholic side created some striking propaganda. When the propaganda proved only partly successful, there was only one option left; a crusade - the Albigensian Crusade.

From 1208, a war of terror was waged against the indigenous population and their rulers: Raymond VI of Toulouse, Raymond-Roger Trencavel, Raymond Roger of Foix in the first generation and Raymond VII of Toulouse, Raymond Trencavel II, and Roger Bernard II of Foix in the second generation. During this period an estimated 500,000 Languedoc men women and children were massacred; Catholics as well as Cathars. The Counts of Toulouse and their allies were dispossessed and humiliated, and their lands annexed to France.

Educated and tolerant Languedoc rulers were replaced by relative barbarians; Dominic Guzmán (later Saint Dominic) founded the Dominican Order and soon afterwards the Inquisition, manned by his Dominicans, was established explicitly to wipe out the last vestiges of resistance. Persecutions of Languedoc Jews and other minorities were initiated; the culture of the troubadours was lost as their cultured patrons were reduced to wandering refugees known as faidits. Their characteristic concept of "paratge", a whole sophisticated world-view, was almost destroyed, leaving us a pale imitation in our idea of chivalry.

Lay learning was discouraged and the reading of the bible became a capital crime. Tithes were enforced. The Languedoc started its long economic decline to become the poorest region in France; and the language of the area, Occitan, began its descent from the foremost literary language in Europe to a regional dialect, now disparaged as a patois. Completing the extermination of the Cathars, the Roman Church now had convincing proof that a sustained campaign of genocide can work. It also had the precedent of an internal Crusade within Christendom, and the machinery of the first modern police state that could be wheeled out for the Spanish Inquisition, and again for later Inquisitions and genocides.

The crusade against the Cathars of the Languedoc has been described as one of the greatest disasters ever to befall Europe.

Catharism is often said to have been completely eradicated by the end of the fourteenth century. Yet there are more than a few vestiges even today, apart from the enduring memory of Cathar martyrdom and the ruins of the famous "Cathar castles", including the Château of Montségur (Montsegùr). There are even Cathars alive today, or at least people claiming to be modern Cathars.
There is a flourishing, Cathar tourist industry in the Languedoc, and especially in the Aude départment; and also an increasing number of historians and other academics engaged in serious Cathar studies. Interestingly, to date, the deeper they have dug, the more they have vindicated Cathar claims to represent a survival of the Earliest Christian Church.

reply to post by robertauthor


You think that was the only ever free society? No there were a lot more, but yeah, they were all crushed, save for the ones still left deep in the amazon.

Originally posted by Akragon
There will never be a free society when governments work for themselves and not for the people.

My solution is for everyone to ignore their goverment, if we all ignored them they would have nothing to govern.

Not sure how we'd do that but hey....anything is possible.

BRAVO! EXCELLENT IDEA!.. Violence and protests are not always the answer..Sometimes the best way to get someone to listing is to ignore them..Like the old saying go's "Out of sight..Out of mind."

Originally posted by byteshertz

Originally posted by Fitch303
No thanks. I LOVE my standard of living and support whatever means the gov needs to keep it that way. And just so you know this is a REPUBLIC, not a democracy. I'm pretty sure the evil west has contributed more to science than any other region on this planet, stop hating yourself and be proud.

edit on 10-3-2011 by Fitch303 because: (no reason given)

As for you supporting any actions your government takes to maintain your lifestyle - that makes you as bad as them. You are commiting crimes against humanity.

It's a matter of perspective, I don't think they're bad and I also don't believe in "crimes against humanity".

reply to post by robertauthor


No problem. Like the joke 'How do you eat an elephant?' - One bite at a time.

You are awake & aware. Talk to people. Share with others. Not force-feeding, just one bite at a time. We have to remember that we are surrounded by heavily distracted, overworked, improperly nourished wage slaves who have arseholes of all sorts tap-dancing on their foreheads in the office or on the warehouse docks. It is very hard to see without blinders on when you are knee-deep in the rat race.

But it is imperative that we talk to each other. People love some attention, it brightens their day and it slowly erodes those invisible fences we all have between our houses.

Here or there, sooner or later, small talk may come around to an opportunity to plant a seed in someones ear.

Unemployed people, retired folks, all sorts of people that are not knee-deep in the trenches of the work world are good to speak with. People that have some time on their hands. Because there is a lot to talk about. We didn't get to where we are overnight. Things take time.

I don't agree that it is smart to join every protest and attend every picket line. But, if I were to attend, it would be in discreet clothing, and I would be sure to shield myself from the heat with dark sunglasses and a hat. A hat with a large, adjustable brim. I would park very far away. And I would stay on maximum alert.

reply to post by LargeFries


Hey Fella

I didnt mean every protest ... As some may be against us lol ...

A metaphor of how people should be willing to stand up for freedom

instead of ignoring it ...

Thanks responding .....

Not advertising a book I wrote this is the now delated version

22 minute video of my beliefs done in 2005

www.myspace.com...

reply to post by Fitch303

I LOVE my standard of living and support whatever means the gov needs to keep it that way.

Wow.

Laziness?

Inability to think for yourself?

You place far to much trust in your honest politicians.

It's a matter of perspective, I don't think they're bad and I also don't believe in "crimes against humanity".

Keep that wool firmly over your eyes.

More than 1,000,000 Iraqis murdered since 2003 invasion.

Originally posted by robertauthor
We live in a democracy a term coined by Greek Philosophy whose empire was created
and maintained by slavery. A system of slavery cleverly imposed on us still to this very day.

This seems a bit of an exaggeration to me. First, everybody had slaves then, not just the Greeks. Second, I believe the Greek slavery system was quite a bit different than anything in the western world now. I don't see the continuous line of slavery that you do.

In essence as individuals we are all good, common sense driven and peace loving people.......

So why the wars, the misery and the greed............

This is where I think you might have a problem. There isn't an answer to your question. Do you think that good people somehow mutate into the corporations, media, and mega-rich you condemn? I don't think people are naturally good, that's why the Constitution has checks and balances, to protect against the bad people who would inevitably gain power.

We need to be one people ..... we deserve to be free and equal society ....in wealth and respect for each other

Any suggestions how we can acheive this would be cool......

That's been asked and attempted many times. Before you tear down this system, have a better one ready to go or the bad people will take complete control of the structure and you'll never be heard from again.

Originally posted by Fitch303

Originally posted by byteshertz

Originally posted by Fitch303
No thanks. I LOVE my standard of living and support whatever means the gov needs to keep it that way. And just so you know this is a REPUBLIC, not a democracy. I'm pretty sure the evil west has contributed more to science than any other region on this planet, stop hating yourself and be proud.

edit on 10-3-2011 by Fitch303 because: (no reason given)

As for you supporting any actions your government takes to maintain your lifestyle - that makes you as bad as them. You are commiting crimes against humanity.

It's a matter of perspective, I don't think they're bad and I also don't believe in "crimes against humanity".

You "don't believe in "crimes against humanity""
Well...
You say you "don't think they're bad" - so I assume you know the history of the government abuses but you still think there is a good in these humans in government in general - often reffered to as humanity.

or are you saying you dont believe in crimes?
crimes like (carefully chosen list btw):
•Aiding & Abetting / Accessory
•Assault / Battery
•Bribery
•Computer Crime
•Conspiracy
•Counterfeiting currency
•Drug Cultivation and Manufacturing
•Drug Distribution / Trafficking
•Embezzlement
•Extortion
•Forgery
•Fraud
•Harassment
•Hate Crimes
•Murder
•Perjury
•Pyramid Schemes
•Robbery
•Solicitation
•Stalking
•Theft / Larceny
•White Collar Crimes

Excuse me for being so lost but saying you "don't believe in "crimes against humanity" seems like willful ignoance, on a deny ignorance site, to me. But I will let you explain before I jump to conclusions.

I agree with the OP that there is a whole lot of slavery going on today, that most still don't recognize as such. Working for slave wages, adhering to beliefs that keep our minds captive, making excuses for not taking personal responsibility, etc.

But I don't think the Cathars / Albigensians are much to look up to. They really did threaten the world order of the time, and they would do so today.

...Roman Church which considered the feudal system to be divinely ordained as the natural order (Cathars disliked it because it depended on oath taking).

Well, our word is in fact important. In politics, in commerce, in our own families, the concept of an "oath" can't get too far from us without consequences.

Maybe that was the main reason they were wiped out, although their absurd dualism was certainly asking for trouble too, especially back in those days.

While reading about the Cathars in this thread makes them sound like enlightened proto-new-age-protestants, ahead of their time, the reality, as far as I know, was quite different.

This essentially Gnostic sect believed that there was a good god, and a bad one, and that all material was intrinsically evil. Which led to ridiculous things such as encouraging suicide, the promotion of homosexuality, the virtual impossibility of a realistic continuation of the familial basic unit, etc. It wasn't just about recognizing women as equals, or being vegetarian!

Sure, it appealed to lots of people, but I have to wonder how many were attracted for noble reasons, when they were more or less an early version of "Free Love" (think late '60's and '70's). At that time, it must have been seen as the justification for the huge sex party everyone always wanted. Perhaps if the Catholics hadn't done what they did, something like AIDS would have come along shortly and rained on their parade, who knows.

I'm not a religionist myself, the Catholics had plenty of issues too obviously, but to idealize the Cathars seems silly. This was a group that almost could never survive anyway, just based on the fact that they abhorred procreation, almost as much as they loved (non-procreative) sex.

Hmmm. Sort of sounds rather modern come to think of it!

JR

I agree with you OP, but the west won't care. They are too busy caring about their dogs.

reply to post by robertauthor


R, thank you for your reply. your Video was one of the best i've seen in quite some time. i'll admit i have little patience for most Video posted for the bulk of them are painful to watch.

i enjoyed the pacing, music & imagery. you obviously have a lot to get across & i think you covered the ground pretty well. i'm going to watch it again.

robertauthor if per chance you have other Video to watch or a blog to read, whatever, please message me. and I thank you for sharing

"Liberty : Yes were free... Free to work for big corporations and create mega profits for the already mega rich."

Free to create your own business, free to learn anything you want, free to freelance your skills and earn money.
I never had a job but i earn enough to support myself by freelancing and i love it. I love the concept that you can get around without even looking at the big corporations.

People are too stupid to realise that they are doing a job they hate to buy things they don't need to appeal to people they don't like.

This issue goes back to the wide spread discussions of civil disobedience that were common here just a year ago.

Pull monies out of mega banks, move to small local banks, en mass... Collapsing corporate banking system and diluting finacial influence.

Hold politicians on all levels directly responsible.

Protest in the streets. (non-violent)

The masses have the power, inherently. Nothing happens without the cooperation of the "average" citizen. It's a matter of withdrawing our approval of the status-quo, with unmistakable clarity, and not allowing ourselves to be bullied into surrender. Not easy, not comfortable, not better in the short term. Worth it imo.

To add...

One perception that must be changed is that which governs the relationship between business and employees and also the wealthy and the average...

It is seen that the wealthy and their business are always deserving and that it is a privilage for you to work for them. This is completely off-base, it is exactly backwards.

The wealthy and their businesses are privilaged to have the support of employees and consumers. It is assuredly so, that in the absence of their wealth and businesses, the needs which are no longer provided for with be filled by others. However, in the absence of public support, they would have nothing.

All the trappings of wealth and privilage are provided by those who have none. We ALLOW you to be wealthy. As history shows, if the masses will it to be, no amount of wealth or power can buy you a future.

That's the dirty little secret "they" don't want "us" to figure out.