Another Chemtrail Question

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul


I've been doing a lot of looking myself. Here's an excerpt from an article from 2002 which points to the three days of downtime for air traffic after 911 resulted in a change of temperature...that means contrails change the weather.

"A team of climatologists presented their work Tuesday, showing that temperatures in the United States fluctuated by 1.2 degrees Celsius more when airplanes were grounded than when normal flight patterns prevailed. That is, planes in the sky dampen the variability between day and nighttime temperatures. More air travel, the researchers suggest, brings less meteorological difference between noon and midnight.

This research provides one of the strongest indicators that air travel itself changes our climate. "

www.wired.com...

reply to post by Yankee451

We had snow in the hill country of Texas. Something was in it. For once, I just listened as some people were talking about the residue (brown) that was left on their vehicles after the snow melted. A light brown powdery substance. I didn't put any ideas in their heads about where it came from, but I did ask them if they paid much attention to the sky.
Nope, not really, why?
There you have it in a nutshell. Most people don't really pay any attention.
Elites 1. Us 0.
But then, for so many years people thought some cave dwellers with razors pulled off 911.
Elites 2. Us 0.
And most people really don't know that the federal reserve is privately owned bankster criminal scum.
Elites 10. (They get bonus points for that). Us -10. (Bonus points provided by Us).
Point is, they can do whatever they want, and they largely control what gets published in "official" publications, or there is hell to pay by someone.

BTW, love your signature Yankee. Wonder what the other hand is up to?

reply to post by Stewie


Let 'em chew on this one.

Let’s all take a moment to take a look at what I’m trying to describe. I’ll try to think like the pilot guys want me to think for a second here…I’ll delve into a little minutiae, but not too much. This image was taken on the afternoon of June 24, 2010. This is a “low spray” day, most days would be worse than this. I may not be able to tell what the altitude is of these contrails, but I can certainly tell what the weather conditions were on that day.


[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/2e5a54f86331.jpg[/atsimg]


To all the laypeople out there, “sounding” data refers to the information gathered by weather balloons all over the world. You can check your own data from your area for any given day at the below link:

weather.uwyo.edu...

The timestamps of the snapshots of the atmospheric data are given in “Z” time…that’s just referring to Greenwich Mean Time…0Z indicates zero hour at Greenwich (on the next day, because they’re ahead of us), or late afternoon out here in the Pacific Northwest (the day before 0Z time). 12Z indicates early morning my time of the same day.

Regarding contrail formation, we’re interested in temperature, relative humidity (RH), dew point and altitude. For contrails to form, they need to have the right temp, but there also needs to be the right RH. For perspective, a dry relative humidity is considered to be areas like parts of Arizona with a RH of 50, Antarctica has the lowest in the 20s.

Dew point indicates the temperature needed to be reached for the amount of humidity in the air, relative to the air temperature, to reach the saturation point…aka the temp needed to be reached for condensation to form.

So, armed with my photo from June 24 2010, I pulled up the below data from the above site. Note the temperatures, especially note the RH at altitude…and finally, note the Dew Point. With a relative humidity in the low 20s and a Dew Point never being reached, can any of those pilots tell me when June 24 could support the conditions required to make so many contrails at ANY altitude?

We had low humidity and the dew point was never reached, so contrails should not have formed at all.

Please Clarify...this is directed at the Flying Circus.




72694 SLE Salem Observations at 00Z 25 Jun 2010
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
PRES HGHT TEMP DWPT RELH MIXR DRCT SKNT THTA THTE THTV
hPa m C C % g/kg deg knot K K K
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
387.0 7690 -25.9 -30.9 63 0.76 271 23 324.3 327.1 324.4
353.0 8348 -31.3 -38.3 50 0.40 276 23 325.6 327.2 325.7
338.0 8654 -33.7 -41.7 44 0.29 278 24 326.4 327.6 326.5
315.0 9144 -36.5 -50.5 22 0.12 282 24 329.2 329.7 329.2
300.0 9480 -39.5 -55.5 17 0.07 285 24 329.6 329.9 329.6
290.0 9711 -41.7 -59.7 12 0.04 289 24 329.6 329.8 329.7
275.3 10058 -44.5 -61.0 14 0.04 295 24 330.5 330.7 330.5
254.0 10596 -48.9 -62.9 18 0.03 264 27 331.7 331.9 331.7
251.2 10668 -49.3 -62.6 20 0.03 260 27 332.1 332.3 332.2
250.0 10700 -49.5 -62.5 20 0.03 265 28 332.3 332.5 332.4
217.9 11582 -55.4 -67.8 20 0.02 270 23 336.5 336.6 336.5
200.0 12130 -59.1 -71.1 20 0.01 295 26 339.0 339.1 339.0
198.0 12192 -59.5 -71.2 21 0.01 295 26 339.4 339.4 339.4
194.0 12320 -60.3 -71.3 22 0.01 295 27 340.1 340.1 340.1
188.6 12497 -60.0 -71.5 21 0.01 295 24 343.3 343.4 343.4
184.0 12650 -59.7 -71.7 19 0.01 285 21 346.2 346.3 346.2
181.0 12753 -58.7 -70.7 20 0.02 278 19 349.5 349.6 349.5
179.6 12802 -59.0 -71.0 20 0.01 275 18 349.8 349.9 349.8
175.0 12964 -59.9 -71.9 19 0.01 264 21 350.9 350.9 350.9
171.1 13106 -58.5 -70.5 20 0.02 255 23 355.4 355.5 355.4


weather.uwyo.edu...

reply to post by Yankee451

Yankee, I am an artist. My avatar is my work, and I take my work seriously.
I notice things. Things like the atmosphere and how distance will make the hills slowly fade into the atmosphere. This is natural. It is also natural that a cold front clears the air...or, is supposed to.
I can see the crap in the atmosphere on heavy spraying days, and not just in the sky, but hanging in the air. I noticed that I had to rethink my landscapes because I couldn't see nearly as far. My eyesight is fine, in fact, I am closer to sixty than fifty and I don't wear glasses.
It takes a LONG time for that crap to completely settle onto the earth. I don't know what it is, but it doesn't fall like it has much weight, almost like a fog on a day when there should be NO fog, but it comes from above instead of below.
Disturbing.

reply to post by Stewie


I can't deny what I've seen either. I am pretty oblivious actually and I'm certainly not blessed with an artist's hand, nor eye but even I can see a difference in the sky.

This is my favorite post from FirePilot, who has gone incommunicado for some time now:

"There is no secret fleet of aircraft, there are no secret bases. Every time chemmies make these allegations and try and prove it, its laughably wrong and does not stand up the the slightest scrutiny. You know how many times chemmies have put up photos claiming its their smoking gun, and its anything but? They never actually admit to bring wrong, either they disappear, or just call everyone names who told them what it really was."

Actually, that's just the favorite paragraph, my favorite sentence bears repeating:

"They never actually admit to bring wrong, either they disappear, or just call everyone names who told them what it really was."

Originally posted by Yankee451
This is my favorite post from FirePilot, who has gone incommunicado for some time now:

"There is no secret fleet of aircraft, there are no secret bases. Every time chemmies make these allegations and try and prove it, its laughably wrong and does not stand up the the slightest scrutiny. You know how many times chemmies have put up photos claiming its their smoking gun, and its anything but? They never actually admit to bring wrong, either they disappear, or just call everyone names who told them what it really was."

Actually, that's just the favorite paragraph, my favorite sentence bears repeating:

"They never actually admit to bring wrong, either they disappear, or just call everyone names who told them what it really was."

Well, I realized that it was pointless to try to explain anything to you. You had already made up your mind that chemtrails DO exist, all because a chemtrail site told you so. You are not investigating anything, you are looking for validiation of your chemtrail beliefs, and anything to the contrary gets dismissed.

And yes, I completely stand behind that paragraph.

My point with that paragraph was that every time a chemmie trots out some supposed smoking gun photo of an aircraft, airport, secret spray equipment, its NEVER what they claim it was. For example, look at thesingle KC-135 modified to spray water to test how a wing behind on a plane will behave. That photo is present on many chemtrail sites and gets put here all the time. Is it chemtrails? No. Its not proof of anything except that we need to know how certain wing shapes will handle icing. same with the Navy E-6A photo doing the fuel dump..

And look at that silly Ted Gunderson video where he claimed Ft Sill and the public Lincoln airport are used for chemplanes. Ft Sill does not even have a runway for large planes, and where are any photos from the Lincoln airport of secret unmarked bomber type planes?

But, when you point out things like this, instead of them acknowledging the information or being corrected, they just call you shill, gov disinfo agents, or else just leave after looking silly. Look at how many people fell for the KC-10 video prank by an ATS member...and that still continue to fall for it.

Here is an honest question. What are your thoughts when chemtrail sites and chemtrailers post blatantly wrong information? Does it bother you or do you more just ignore it and move on?

reply to post by firepilot


I thought I made it clear I wanted to lean the truth, not to be proven "right", hence my request to collaborate with folks who knew more. I am genuinely interested, in spite of what you may think.

Looking at the Appleman chart for June 24th, it does appear that conditions at the average cruising altitudes for jets were OPTIMAL FOR PERSISTENCE, meaning I stand corrected. Thank you for your patience.

Well I will be fair and give you a star for that, at least with that you did more actual investigating than 99.9 percent of chemtrailers do.

reply to post by firepilot


"Here is an honest question. What are your thoughts when chemtrail sites and chemtrailers post blatantly wrong information? Does it bother you or do you more just ignore it and move on? "

I think it should be obvious I don't just "ignore it and move on". My honest opinion is as I've already stated...I tend to disbelieve anything our criminal government says. This puts me at a disadvantage, just as much as someone who automatically believes authority by virtue of their authority. I am aware I don't trust authority, hence my need to double check my convictions.

I am genuinely interested in the truth, and I cannot believe anything simply because it's what everyone takes for granted. To be truthful to myself, I must question everything that I took for granted prior to 911...and I mean everything. I suspect any information I haven't been able to prove or disprove to myself.

I have many pictures...plenty of clear skies too. I am still skeptical, but I will continue to compare the Appleman chart and sounding data with my pictures until I'm satisfied. If it boils down to having no more proof to justify a suspicion, I will say so, but I already feel better about it, if not just a little humbled.

I wasn't lying when I told you I appreciate the repartee, or that I liked you guys...although eating crow in front of Weedwhacker will leave a mark, of that I'm sure.

reply to post by firepilot


Thanks...being "right" definitely feels better than proving yourself wrong.

To any other laypeople out there still reading, I highly recommend researching the sounding data for your area and comparing it to the Appleman chart. It's actually not too hard to learn the basics, and it's kind of fun, at least it was for me, but I don't get out much. The Flying Circus have some very valid points about learning the basics, and you can save yourselves some grief by avoiding arguing a point from a position of ignorance. Folks who are sincere about this can only benefit by learning this stuff.

I'm still skeptical, but more cautious...this means the government is much more diabolical than I thought.

reply to post by Yankee451

The "government" is definitely diabolical, if we are talking about the federal government. And, to be even more specific, if we are talking about the so called leaders. Whom exactly are they taking their orders from?
Chemtrails exist as visual evidence that a very few can affect the very many. And I am not talking about just a few human beings putting other human beings in jeopardy, but all life itself. I mean, really...look around. Look at the affect these few people are having on the world.
Chemtrails personify the wounds, just like a scar upon the skin. They are screwing with the atmosphere. How more personal can you get, when you are speaking for the earth?
I think we are all fools. On both sides, if we are actually on two or more sides. We argue about chemtrails, while some very powerful people that are beyond our control do whatever they want to us. And our food. And our air. And our God Damn Earth.
ATS is fun, but sometimes I wonder why we choose to play games while the world crashes. I suspect that we are collectively putting off the challenges that lie ahead. Those challenges that require us to put our very lives at risk for the common good.
The common good...what the hell is that?

reply to post by Stewie



I hear you man.

The system exists only for the system...at the expense of the world. As far as chemtrails go, I still can't deny what I witnessed, but now that I'm getting a feel for at least how to investigate the weather conditions required for contrails, I feel more confident I'll be able to keep my suspicious mind in check the next time I witness that sky covering haze. There's no denying I don't trust the bastards at the top...we're still killing Pakistani wedding parties due to Bush's lies for crying out loud! However I have no right to take it out on some nameless, faceless guys on ATS.

I owe the lads who have been trying to get through my thick skull a sincere apology.

And here's my apology.

Weedwhacker, Firepilot, Aloysius, SoylentGreen, Stars15 and everyone else who I abused with my belligerence showed remarkable restraint in their dealings with me.

I was a boorish, childish, hypocritical heel.

Thank you for your patience and for the lessons in contrail science, not to mention social grace.

Please accept my sincere apology for my behavior. I also apologize to any laypeople out there...don't do as I do; check your facts before making an a@@ out of yourself.

Yankee451