I want to believe, but you people make it really difficult.

reply to post by zorgon


Damn, Zorgon, you beat me to the punch again! I was just getting ready to say something about Valient Thor, the man from Venus that lived in the White House for several years. This, unlike many stories, is fully documented. To me, anyone that just says, "ET/Aliens Do not Exist!" is simply a person who sincerely hopes and prays they are really not real, for it would so tear down any faith the person happened to have.

Very good and solid point(s)

I know what you are saying. If I were to come across evidence/video of a UFO/Alien, I would be pretty careful about bringing it onto ATS.

You're just asking for trouble. There are some people on here that I am convinced are either paid dis-info agents or people that won't/wouldn't be able to handle such an event/announcement of UFO/Aliens that they do whatever they can to downplay and/or criticize anything/everyone who doesn't.

I want to believe but the only thing I got from ATS in that area is enough evidence to convince me there is something as much/or greater intelligence out there somewhere-but that is for me. The very next person could view or review the same info and decide that the stuff isn't good enough.

I usually leave it at this, since they are attacking us and/or anything threatening (as we see), unless they land and pop open a Keg of Beer and starting waving everyone over.... they aren't here as nice ones. Until I see that, I can only have a belief and not a positive confirimation-but I still can believe.

Originally posted by theguygeeza
reply to post by karen61057

 

Thank you Karen61057, an interesting read all be it a short read. I have saved that page to show my son Winston when he is old enough to read it properly & appreciate it. I had read some reports of those findings on various websites around the time they were published & i'm sure there may have been threads on here about such too. I've bet my bottom dollar (well pound) on there being other life out there right from the start, well since my early childhood anyway. I'm sure also that there must be life that is as intelligent if not more so than us, wether or not they are bothering visiting such a self destructive race such as ours remains to be proven/disclosed.
Thank you for taking time out to reply to my reply, honour & respetcs & may peace & harmony be with you

You're very welcome! What a nice salutation. I am a mother of 3 (all grown men now) I believe in giving them the information they want. (age appropriate anyway)

Originally posted by zorgon
Valient Thor and his brother and sister 1959

What do we have on this guy beyond someone said he was from venus and spun tails of how aliens would be coming to earth in massive quantities to help out.
this was in 57...over 50 years ago, yet, no massive swarms of UFOs or anything pointing to this being anything more than a hoax (not even very elaborate)

What we do know is a massive disinfo campaign launched around that time to muddy the waters and make people believe in all sorts of red herrings. How is Thor's story not one of them..is there anything even sorta factual to look at beyond this picture and a conversation that supposedly happened?

Sorry, but the guy looks like any 50s secret service agent...no antenna's, no 3rd eye, etc...you can post any dated picture up and give a wonderful tale with perhaps some old military commander yup-ing in the background.

Now, before you think I am being totally dismissive (I am), keep in mind, out of all the alien types discussed here, the hotty pleadians are my favorite...I would very much like for them to exist..but meh, I need proof, and a old wishy washy story with no hard facts, evidence, or even multiple highly credible witness testimony exists in this instance.
Prove me wrong...seriously...I want to be wrong here.

Howard Menger... who told us what the color of the sky was like on the Moon.. had a visitor from Venus

Howard is perhaps one of the least credible of the lot you mention. He basically ripped off Adamski's tales and remade them a bit, He is simply a bookwriter and made a tidy amount off the backs of believers. he gave pseudo-religious feelings and some basic philosophy behind it, but otherwise, he was just stealing someone elses alien mixed in with parallel worlds chatting.
Nothing of course is backed up by anything but his word. and who is he? Well, he is (or was) a professional writer of ufo books.

Again, I humbly request information supporting his claim that isn't just...some other guy supporting his claim while hocking his books.

And don't forget George Adamski...

Adamski actually did something. He I find is perhaps the most credible of the lot you spoke of, he provided some actual evidence to go over.
Were the pictures simply lampshades on strings and whatnot...well, that is open to debate, but at least there is something to look at beyond just a story.
If anything, if he was simply lying the whole time and his pictures are simple hoaxes, he at least got people thinking of an electric universe and serious consideration of EM propulsion tech, however, this does not give him a pass at skepticism for his alien claims.

I remain neutral about him, but would like a really deconstructive look at his life accomplishments to truely get to the root of the picture question at least.
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/0aa535d42819.jpg[/atsimg]
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/001bc8a7cc2b.jpg[/atsimg]
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/d9a40318d008.jpg[/atsimg]
(I wonder what that ring on the top is used for...hmmm...)
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/9bfead15b6d4.jpg[/atsimg]
(eat your heart out Billy Meirs)

Oh, and should the Adamski pictures ever be found genuine, I will tell this to our pleadian neighbors (or venus, or whatever)
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/0d7f78d5c8cf.jpg[/atsimg]
Once we start, our ships will look way cooler than yours!

Originally posted by SaturnFX

Originally posted by zorgon
Valient Thor and his brother and sister 1959

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/d9a40318d008.jpg[/atsimg]
(I wonder what that ring on the top is used for...hmmm...)

To take the lid off.

Originally posted by SaturnFX
What do we have on this guy beyond someone said he was from venus and spun tails of how aliens would be coming to earth in massive quantities to help out.
this was in 57...over 50 years ago, yet, no massive swarms of UFOs or anything pointing to this being anything more than a hoax (not even very elaborate)

Frank Stranges

Valiant Thor - The Stranger at the Pentagon by Rev. Frank E. Stranges


Dr. Frank E. Stranges
www.nicufo.org...

C2C Am Valiant Thor Frank Stranges
www.disclose.tv...

There was no message of a fleet coming to save us... there was an offer to give us knowledge... which we turned down

BTW the movie "The Day the Earth Stood Still" was based on a true story (the original version 1951, not the new one) He was also from Venus

Originally posted by LilDudeissocool

Originally posted by SaturnFX

Originally posted by zorgon
Valient Thor and his brother and sister 1959

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/d9a40318d008.jpg[/atsimg]
(I wonder what that ring on the top is used for...hmmm...)

To take the lid off.

I should have said to twist the chandelier apart as that is a threaded eye-bolt in the center, the lid being the top of the chandelier the cover being the bottom. The top is also used for hooking the chain which attaches it to the ceiling. "To take the lid off" I guess sounded more like a kettle lid. Everyone can clearly see what it is so this explanation is sort of academic, but thought on a second read of what I wrote it might be too vague. No pun intended.

Originally posted by redoubt
reply to post by SaturnFX

 

This is a problem that the UFO community has been dealing with for decades.

Some hold the belief that the circus was created by design to do exactly what it does; discredit the subject and discourage further investigation.

Personally, I think our species has enough fruit loops floating in the bowl to account for it all and then some.

So, yes. The challenge is to wade through the lunatic fringes, sift the disinformation, the video jockey hoaxes, the adolescent Photoshop jobs and then dodge all the desperate housewives and lonesome cowboys who follow the parade in search of romantic rescue or a trip to Orion from ET.

If you want some good, straightforward reading on the subject, I highly recommend the book, 'UFOs - Generals, Pilots and Government Officials Go on the Record' by Leslie Kean.

Great book. Yes, one needs to go out and find the info themselves. This forum alone will not convince a skeptic. 90% of the threads are ridiculous. But there are occasional gold nuggets. I'm certain beyond any reasonable doubt alien visitation is real. There is enough proof to conclude that.

The existence of UFOs, meaning technological objects with seemingly "impossible abilities" detected in our atmosphere, is an undeniable fact. When you study the big picture, all the declassified historical documents, the testimony of many credible witnesses, and the many legitimate "insider" whistle blowers, ET hypothesis is the best, most rational, explanation for some UFOs. If you need a perfect high definition video of a flying saucer with grays walking around to be convinced, you'll be waiting a long time.

I have to admit I agree to a certain extent with the OP. I did come here originally with the expectation that here I would find evidence that rocked me over the fence and into never never land. I agree also with other posters that yes you do have to 'dig through the s**t to find the gold'

The problem is that with so many people interested in UFO's or the unexplained you are going to have to deal with people that will see a common or garden cat and call it Bigfoot. Most people aren't that bright and they aren't that informed. Added to which some people are so terribly desperate to 'believe' that they'll see a red foil helium balloon in the shape of the number 3 and post it on here WITH PHOTOGRAPHS AND DRAWINGS calling it a Red Trimaran UFO....

In life its very easy to filter out the 'crazies' you don't have to mix with them and you can ignore them, on a forum unfortunately you do have to open the thread and read a bit before you can dismiss something as utter nonsense and by then its too late we've read or watched the crud they are presenting as evidence and we get frustrated.

I have defiantly fallen on the sceptic side of the fence since I joined even to the point of being a total unbeliever in Alien visitation AT THIS POINT IN TIME and I came here believing! I am aware though that people in general are ignorant and can see a party balloon and call it Nessy, Bigfoot, Angel or Alien Space Craft. The same people are also arrogant and unable to believe they are wrong 90% of the time and stick with their beliefs.

Its my belief that if you are going to look into the sky for something then you need to learn what is meant to be in the sky first, learn what is a star, learn when venus is rising, learn when the ISS is crossing over, look at balloons and the shapes and sizes they come in, learn about aeroplanes and jets and man made objects...

Sherlock Holmes once said...

when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth

In our case we seem to have to eliminate the possible first so my new quote would read 'When you have eliminated the possible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth'

We have to be modern day Sherlock Holmes

Originally posted by Versa
I have to admit I agree to a certain extent with the OP. I did come here originally with the expectation that here I would find evidence that rocked me over the fence and into never never land. I agree also with other posters that yes you do have to 'dig through the s**t to find the gold'

The problem is that with so many people interested in UFO's or the unexplained you are going to have to deal with people that will see a common or garden cat and call it Bigfoot. Most people aren't that bright and they aren't that informed. Added to which some people are so terribly desperate to 'believe' that they'll see a red foil helium balloon in the shape of the number 3 and post it on here WITH PHOTOGRAPHS AND DRAWINGS calling it a Red Trimaran UFO....

In life its very easy to filter out the 'crazies' you don't have to mix with them and you can ignore them, on a forum unfortunately you do have to open the thread and read a bit before you can dismiss something as utter nonsense and by then its too late we've read or watched the crud they are presenting as evidence and we get frustrated.

I have defiantly fallen on the sceptic side of the fence since I joined even to the point of being a total unbeliever in Alien visitation AT THIS POINT IN TIME and I came here believing! I am aware though that people in general are ignorant and can see a party balloon and call it Nessy, Bigfoot, Angel or Alien Space Craft. The same people are also arrogant and unable to believe they are wrong 90% of the time and stick with their beliefs.

Its my belief that if you are going to look into the sky for something then you need to learn what is meant to be in the sky first, learn what is a star, learn when venus is rising, learn when the ISS is crossing over, look at balloons and the shapes and sizes they come in, learn about aeroplanes and jets and man made objects...

Sherlock Holmes once said...

when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth

In our case we seem to have to eliminate the possible first so my new quote would read 'When you have eliminated the possible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth'

We have to be modern day Sherlock Holmes

edit on 25-1-2011 by Versa because: (no reason given)

Quote, "Most people aren't that bright and they aren't that informed."

Relative to whom, uh, YOU?

Originally posted by LilDudeissocool
Quote, "Most people aren't that bright and they aren't that informed."

Relative to whom, uh, YOU?

You're seriously gonna challenge that statement ? Half of everyone on this planet has an average IQ or below average IQ. Sure they may be nice people, but they don't have a clue, nor are they even aware how much they don't know. I'd be surprised if the average person reads 2 books a year, and yet national television viewing habits are something insane like 35 hours per week.

Have you ever seen the man on the street skits ?The average person can't name one supreme court justice. The average person has no idea who the Speaker of the House is at any given point in time. In 2007, a national poll revealed 31% of Americans couldn't name the Vice President ! (Cheney)

How poorly informed did you have to be to not know, in the year 2007 over six years after he was elected, that Dick Cheney was the VPOTUS ? That's just a scary number. Many of those were likely voters too.

Originally posted by Schaden

Originally posted by LilDudeissocool
Quote, "Most people aren't that bright and they aren't that informed."

Relative to whom, uh, YOU?

You're seriously gonna challenge that statement ? Half of everyone on this planet has an average IQ or below average IQ.

]So that would be less than most?

Sure they may be nice people, ]What does that have to do with price of tea in China? but they don't have a clue, nor are they even aware how much they don't know. ]Well that would be everyone on the planet. You should really think about the last part of your statement. I'd be surprised if the average person reads 2 books a year, and yet national television viewing habits are something insane like 35 hours per week.]It all depends on what is read vs what is viewed



Have you ever seen the man on the street skits ?The average person can't name one supreme court justice. The average person has no idea who the Speaker of the House is at any given point in time. In 2007, a national poll revealed 31% of Americans couldn't name the Vice President ! (Cheney)

]What does general knowledge have to to with IQ? They are two different things entirely. You can have a low IQ and win big on Jeopardy for example. And you can have a high IQ and be as ignorant as an ape so to speak.

How poorly informed did you have to be to not know, in the year 2007 over six years after he was elected, that Dick Cheney was the VPOTUS ? That's just a scary number. Many of those were likely voters too.

] That doesn't mean jack. Stick a camera in most people's face and blurt out a question they will even forget their mother's name. It's not like those street survey 'entertainment" productions are conducted academically in anyway.

Anything else?

It basically comes down to what you personally believe. If you believe in ET UFOs, then power to you. If you think its some kind natural phenomenon that can be easily explained, more of the same. People will see what they want to see and believe what they want to believe.

Of course I'm a believer by my own experiences, things I've seen and heard on my own. So things are going on out there, but as someone said in a earlier post is why are they so curious about us? I'm curious of this answer since they are so much more then we are with techonolgy and stuff. There's a reason behind it we just don't know what it is yet.

Originally posted by josephina
Of course I'm a believer by my own experiences, things I've seen and heard on my own. So things are going on out there, but as someone said in a earlier post is why are they so curious about us? I'm curious of this answer since they are so much more then we are with techonolgy and stuff. There's a reason behind it we just don't know what it is yet.

Just using humans as a reference
Why do we go bird watching, or to the zoo to visit the primitive animals
Why do we go on trips to 3rd world nations, or send missionarys to really poor areas in our world..
Why do we have people go rescue animals, or try to protect wildlife preserves..

Why do we care for babys (they are not as clever as adults)

You know people,

I could not be happier to be on this site, I watched this website since over 1 year and I dont care what people believe in or what not, call this a hoax or that.

Fact is, everyone has their own opinion and I believe.

Not because I want to, but because I believe to be had an encounter of the third kind.

However since I was younger, I was afraid of what was in front of me. Today I wish I could have met it.

My biggest dream is to get in touch with Aliens or to be picked up by an Alien Spaceship, seriously.

This world is so full of aggression and hatred, it is disgusting.

If you tell your friend for what you believe in, you are automatically crazy and are being ignored.

I waited long before signing here up.

I waited long for the Aliens to get back in touch with me.

But I fear I am not to old and would understand what they are.

I hope almost every day for the impossible.

To meet one of them. To learn from them.

Yes if they abduct me, so what? if they can help me to help others, why not?

I am 27 years old, my encounter was when I was around 15-16, cant remember but I never forget to what I have seen, the look scared the hell out of me.

I just want this one chance in my life.

My Parents and my 4 years younger sister dont believe in aliens.

They called me crazy, you can call me crazy, but I never give up on my believe, yes they are out there and yes I am ready for it.

As much as I am afraid of the night and darkness, I want a chance!

Sorry, I had to post this to see for everyone