N. Korea Crisis - Updated as News come to hand

reply to post by jonny2410


I think that is mere propaganda, South Koreas response was very low standard for a nation - that just received a artillery bombardment

@Regensturm

Brilliant post! I agree that China is walking the diplomatic tightrope...what the public is privvy to is but a shadow of what is going on in the halls of power.

Your citations certainly paint a different picture of the DPRK, and what seems to be an orderly transition of power. I find this more disconcerting than anything.

Jong-eun is an unknown unknown...I remember the speculation when Jong-Il took over from his father that there could be military consequences.

Hard to see the strategy here from any angle...

Originally posted by jonny2410
Dang a quintuple post! ^^

Yup, don't wana keep all your eggs in one basket.

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

South Korean naval ships are seen off Yeonpyeong island November 25, 2010. North Korea fired dozens of artillery shells at the South Korean border island on Tuesday, killing two South Korean soldiers and two civilians and setting houses ablaze in the heaviest attack on its neighbor since the Korean War ended in 1953

I would keep an eye out today (well tomorrow in SK because it's midnight there) if that info is correct. A big SK naval presence in the area can only make things tenser.

reply to post by jonny2410


It is true.

I can confirm the presence. Increased military on the Island too, something are considering the prospect of a retaliation before the US fleet arrives thus making a return strike difficult, without the North declaring war on the United States.

Originally posted by infinite
reply to post by jonny2410

 

It is true.

I can confirm the presence. Increased military on the Island too, something are considering the prospect of a retaliation before the US fleet arrives thus making a return strike difficult, without the North declaring war on the United States.

Personally i would be stunned if NK themselves strike first in the coming days. Their leader may be deranged but deranged enough to, almost certainly, start a total war?

I just cannot see it. Anything, absolutely anything militarily, from NK, will definitely lead to a wider conflict. South Korea simply won't be able to hold back again in such quick succession.

IMO if there is a chance of things getting out of hand on Sunday etc then it will be from South Korea themselves. That is not a dig at SK but i imagine every single finger is on the triggers right now, a lot of tension and nerves. Wars often are born out of such tension and mishaps.

reply to post by nwobrazil


Yes, the official findings of the Russian investigation, given to the UNSC, was that it was caused by an 'external' explosion. No further speculation was given.

The russian use of media as a tool is, historical.

english.chosun.com...

Don't forget.

LOS ANGELES (MarketWatch) — North Korea warned Thursday it would launch more attacks on South Korea if its southern neighbor makes more “reckless military provocations,” according to several reports citing a statement by the North Korean military,
The statement, carried by North Korean state media, said Pyongyang “will wage second and even third rounds of attacks without any hesitation, if warmongers in South Korea make reckless military provocations again,” according to a translation quoted by Reuters.

Link www.marketwatch.com...

A tense couple of days ahead lets just hope nobody gets too twitchy i think America is not helping the situation with these exercises at this time.

Thanks

reply to post by jonny2410


Yeah, you said it.

The intracacies of all the disparate factors involved (especially the human factor), makes this a hair tirgger situation.

Replacing the Defence min., just adds to the tension. Another unknown variable.

Carrier in the Yellow Sea? Worrisome........China IS watching, waiting.

reply to post by quietone77


Thanks. We also don't really know much about Kim's youngest son who is reportedly being groomed for succession. He is said to have spent time in the West, and nobody knows what he is like....whether he is going to be a hardliner, or something of a reformist.




reply to post by jonny2410


It was mentioned by an expert on North Korea (speaking on Russia Today I think, not sure) that the fact North Korea has not acknowledged any deaths or injuries or damage by South Korea's counter-barrage is a good thing.

His view was that as North Korea had not acknowledged any deaths, injuries, or damage, tensions may just stay as they are as opposed to boiling over.

Of course the concern now is the US-South Korean military exercises, the desertion of South Korean border villages which Channel 4 News was told had been evacuated, the bolstering of South Korean forces on five islands, and North Korea warning about how it does not talk "empty talk".

reply to post by Regensturm


Indeed, the fact NK has not made a fuss about the retaliation is certainly a good sign.

I'll say it again, i would be stunned if North Korea attacks or does anything militarily during these coming drills.

reply to post by Regensturm


Kim Jong-il's youngest son and heir apparent appears at parade.

AFP - Secretive North Korea put its leader-in-waiting on show Sunday at a huge military parade, introducing the youngest son of current ruler Kim Jong-Il to its people and the world on live television.
Kim Jong-Un, believed aged about 27, stood near his father at the Pyongyang parade, applauding and saluting as thousands of goose-stepping troops marched past along with trucks carrying missiles and other weaponry.

Linkwww.france24.com...

27 I bet he's at home in castle Kim shouting and screaming at the TV has he dies for the 200th time in black ops

Thanks

Originally posted by jonny2410
reply to post by Regensturm

 

Indeed, the fact NK has not made a fuss about the retaliation is certainly a good sign.

I'll say it again, i would be stunned if North Korea attacks or does anything militarily during these coming drills.

I agree. The only scenario I can see it occuring is if North Korea are seriously really provoked, to the extent where not to respond militarily would be seen as being weak and to lose face.

reply to post by Grayelf2009


It won't be alone, a Carrier Strike Group includes a number of other ships in addition to the carrier.

If another CSG heads towards Korea that will be big deal, until then this is all for show.

reply to post by mars1


And there we were worrying about itchy trigger fingers!

Thanks for the link.

Now believe it or not but the islands circled in red is ROK (South Korea) territory. Each island has a military base stationed on it. The single Island circled on the right is Yeonpyeong, which was attacked, and this also has a military base on it. The yellow line to the right is the 38th parallel.

For some context here, the Islands are at most just 10 miles from the North Korean mainland. When you consider how close the circled islands are to NK, and then you factor in the news today that these islands, including Yeonpyeong, are all being significantly strengthened militarily, I think the tensions in that region are pretty obvious for all to see.

IMO the next clash, whether it be in a few days or a few months, will be on or around those islands.

For some extra context this is the area in the image above. Look how close it is to NK.

Seoul to bolster West Sea forces, revise enemy engagement rules

News

Originally posted by Regensturm
reply to post by mars1

 

And there we were worrying about itchy trigger fingers!

Thanks for the link.

the trigger finger is too busy pressing R2 lol.
nah you guys, remember he's a general now. both sides are threatening war if there is any further provocation by either side, even to the slightest degree. for Pyongyang, trespassing .0001 mm is enough to justify retaliation on their part. For Seoul, who the hell knows? i expect something to occur during the wargames. btw, the wargames were planned well beforehand and are not a response to the shelling, just so you know.

Reuters reporting....

Seoul expressed frustration with Beijing for not taking sides, noting even Russia had condemned this week's attack.

"We must engage with China for it to take more responsibility on North Korea's behaviour," said a government official, who asked not to be identified.

China has long propped up the Pyongyang leadership, worried that a collapse of the North could bring instability to its own borders. Beijing is also wary of a unified Korea that would be dominated by the United States, the key ally of the South.

BELLICOSE RHETORIC

There was no let-up in the typically bellicose language used by North Korea.

"(North Korea) will wage second and even third rounds of attacks without any hesitation if warmongers in South Korea make reckless military provocations again," the North's KCNA news agency quoted a statement from the military as saying.

"The U.S. cannot evade the blame for the recent shelling," it added. "If the U.S. truly desires detente on the Korean peninsula, it should not thoughtlessly shelter the South Korean puppet forces, but strictly control them so that they may not commit any more adventurous military provocations."

North Korea said the shelling was in self-defence after Seoul fired shells into its waters. The South Korean government official said Seoul had been shocked by the attack for its "indiscriminate bombing of civilians".

"We could not imagine such a grave provocation," he said. "But now we see any kind of provocation is possible ... and it makes it very easy to respond in the future."

The official said Tuesday's artillery attack on Yeonpyeong island could only have been ordered by reclusive North Korean leader Kim Jong-il.

Kim and his son and designated heir, Jong-un, visited the Yellow Sea coastal artillery base from where shells were fired at Yeonpyeong just hours before the attack, North Korean media reported.

"This kind of serious provocation could only be planned by Kim Jong-il," the official said, adding the attack was also designed to promote the younger Kim's military credentials.

U.S. officials have said the attack appeared linked to the upcoming succession in North Korea's leadership.

Reuters reporting that North Korea media reported Kim and his son visited the base from where the North Korean shells were fired just hours before the attack.

Link



North Korean foreign ministry statement....

Statement Released by Spokesman of DPRK Foreign Ministry

Statement Released by Spokesman of DPRK Foreign Ministry

Pyongyang, November 24 (KCNA) -- A spokesman for the DPRK Foreign Ministry Wednesday issued the following statement:

As already reported by the Supreme Command of the KPA, the revolutionary armed forces of the DPRK on Nov. 23 took a decisive self-defensive measure to cope with the enemy's reckless military provocation of firing shells inside the territorial waters of the DPRK side around Yonphyong Islet in the West Sea of Korea.

The army of the DPRK warned several times that if even a single shell of the enemy is fired inside the territorial waters of the DPRK, it will take a prompt retaliatory strike in connection with the live shell firing drill they planned to stage from Yonphyong Islet while conducting the ill-famed war maneuvers for a war of aggression against the DPRK codenamed Hoguk.

At 8:00 a.m. on Nov. 23, the very day the incident occurred, the head of the delegation of the DPRK side to the inter-Korean military talks sent a telephone message to the head of the delegation of the enemy side once again strongly urging it to cancel the plan for staging the above-said firing drill in the waters around the islet, the sensitive waters.

This notwithstanding, the enemy committed such an extremely reckless military provocation as firing dozens of shells from the islet inside the territorial waters of the DPRK side from around 13:00.

The enemy fired shells from the islet which is so close to the territory of the DPRK that it is within each other's eyeshot despite the fact that there are so many mountains and rivers, sea waters and islets in south Korea. This powder-reeking saber-rattling cannot be construed otherwise than a politically motivated provocation.

The enemy is claiming that they fired shells southward from the islet in a bid not to get on the nerves of the DPRK but Yonphyong Islet is located deep inside the territorial waters of the DPRK away from the maritime military demarcation line. If live shells are fired from the islet, they are bound to drop inside the territorial waters of the DPRK side no matter in which direction they are fired because of such geographical features.

The ulterior aim sought by the enemy is to create the impression that the DPRK side recognized the waters off the islet as their "territorial waters", in case that there was no physical counter-action on the part of the former.

Herein lies the crafty and vicious nature of the enemy's provocation.

The army of the DPRK took such a self-defensive measure as making a prompt powerful strike at the artillery positions from which the enemy fired the shells as it does not make an empty talk.

This incident is one more dangerous development which took place because of the illegal "northern limit line" unilaterally fixed by Clark, UN forces commander, as he pleased on Aug. 30, 1953 after the conclusion of the Korean Armistice Agreement.

The U.S., its followers and some bosses of international bodies should drop such bad habit as thoughtlessly accusing somebody before learning about the truth about the incident.

If they shield south Korea, the criminal, without principle, just for being their ally, this is little short of feeding oil to the fire.

The DPRK that sets store by the peace and stability of the Korean Peninsula is now exercising superhuman self-control but the artillery pieces of the army of the DPRK, the defender of justice, remain ready to fire.

North Korea says it asked South Korea to stop it's exercises and are saying that no matter where the South Koreans fired, the shells would have landed in North Korean territory....

I'm trying to find where Reuters got that report purpotedly from North Korean media that Kim and his son visited the North Korean artillery base hours before it fired. Just to have the report from the horse's mouth, so to speak. Potentially an important development.

reply to post by Regensturm


To be fair to the North Koreans, for a minute, you can see what they mean about the island if you look at my maps in the above post. They are very close to NK and if i did not know better i would have thought they were in NK waters.

I'm not defending their actions but it's an important thing to consider.