The Prophecy of Jesus in Luke 23:43

Originally posted by St Udio re: the three crosses= Body - Mind - Spirit... representing the totality of the created human

Let me suggest that you define the word “mind”.

In such a way, however, as not to violate Occam’s Razor.

(And, when you realize that you can’t do it—you can’t, trust me—I don’t want you to feel bad. There are people with Ph.D.s in physics, philosophy, and/or neuro-anatomy who have written any number of journal articles and books on the “science of consciousness”…who can’t do it either.)

What you are suggesting is nothing more than thoughts of a ‘thinker’.

What I have written has to do with Knowledge that is Revealed.

Jesus makes reference to this same Knowledge in Saying #30 of the Gospel of Thomas: “Where there are three gods, they are gods. Where there are two or one, I am with him.”

“Where there are three gods” refers to the three dimensions of consciousness: the consciousness Created by God, the consciousness of the “beast of the sea”-“self” and the consciousness of the “beast of the earth”-‘thinker’ (which, together, comprise the ‘fallen’ consciousness).

“Where there are two” refers to the consciousness Created by God and the ‘fallen’ consciousness.

“or one, I am with him” refers to the 2-dimensional ‘flat’ space consciousness within which everything exists; including the 3-dimensional ‘curved’ space ‘fallen’ consciousness.

There are also Three Phases in the War of the Sons of Light.

And there are also Dead Sea Scrolls (4Q534-536, entitled The Birth of Noah; and which should be understood in the context of 4Q529, entitled The Words of Michael —see pgs. 33-39 of The Dead Sea Scrolls Uncovered by Eisenman and Wise) which makes reference to the “Three Books”: the Book of the Law (the Torah); the Book of Life (see Revelations 22:19), referring to the Revelation of the “resurrection”; and the Book of Truth (see the Book of Daniel 10:20), referring to the Vision of the “Son of man” or the “Vision of Knowledge”.

Mi cha el

Originally posted by Michael Cecil
That was the reason for the separation of Pauline Christianity from the 'Gnostics', and the extermination of tens of thousands of Albigensians 1100 years later.

I have read a few of your threads and found them very interesting, although much of it does go over my head. I wonder though if you can help me to understand what is wrong with Paul's teachings? I don't know the Bible at all well, just certain bits and pieces, one of which is Paul's letter to the Corinthians...

biblescripture.net...

Reading that, I struggle to see the Paul, you and others, seem to speak of disparagingly, and certainly in some ways, having read your posts, I can find similarities in tone and content, and besides minor points, very little disagreement. But, I may be missing something, I can be very literal and if there is information between the lines, be sure I'll have missed it.

Any help, would be most appreciated, please.

You guys are missing the point. Redirect your thoughts while considering that the world is a type of birthing passage like a womb/vagina.

Now, there are only thieves. There are thieves who understand what and who they are, and there are thieves who do not turn from their own ways. So then, there is not a specific correlation to "groups" of people except that there are animal-humans (animals who appear as humans who conduct themselves without God-like expressions of Order and Charity which are/lead to Life), and there are god-humans (people/animal-gods which are bound by natural bodies, but express understanding in a recognizably godly way).

The animal-humans do decay in this world, and what life they had is torn apart as it is compressed down into smaller pieces. Pride and Chaos lead to Death, even empirically, however it's manifestations modulate away from spiritual truth by way of "reality" or "distorted echos/reflections." This is why good things happen to bad people and vice-versa. This is also why Life is not mocked.

So then, as this world "ripens as a womb ripens," the slaves of sin will remain forever divided by and subtracted from by death, but the slaves of life will continue on to the unseen kingdom where Christ came from and returned to so that it would be added and multiplied to them.

Just as the first child opens the womb and hips of a mother and subsequent children are usually birthed more easily, this is also the case for us who could not be born again into the next life and out of the womb. More so, in the conclusion of this world's placement on the altar of the universe, there really is only the womb and the child/children.

Children, Brethren, look out, look in, and be comforted.

Originally posted by KilgoreTrout

Originally posted by Michael Cecil
That was the reason for the separation of Pauline Christianity from the 'Gnostics', and the extermination of tens of thousands of Albigensians 1100 years later.

I have read a few of your threads and found them very interesting, although much of it does go over my head. I wonder though if you can help me to understand what is wrong with Paul's teachings?

Briefly, Paul was a Pharisee who believed in the Egyptian doctrine of the physical raising of a dead body from the grave; the doctrine that Jesus was murdered for contradicting.

Paul's contradiction of the Teaching of Jesus on the "resurrection"--specifically, that it is a Doctrine of 'Rebirth'--led to the creation of an anti-Semitic theology which, 1900 years later, resulted in the slaughter of millions of Jews during the Holocaust.

This is not at all a complicated doctrinal issue.

That should be sufficient evidence to demonstrate the errors of Paul's teaching.

Mi cha el

Originally posted by Dasher Now, there are only thieves.

Now that I 'think' of it, you are correct.

There was a "bad thief" and there was a "good thief"...

And Jesus referred to the coming of the "Son of man" as a "thief in the night" which is a description of the experiences surrounding the Vision of the "Son of man" for reasons which I will not explain here, but which are alluded to in the Book of Daniel Chapter 7.

So, they are all thieves of one kind or another.

And what does the "thief in the night" steal?

The absolute, rock solid conviction of the consciousness of the "self" and the consciousness of the 'thinker' that it is capable of acquiring Absolute Truth and that belief is fully equivalent to Knowledge.

Mi cha el

Originally posted by Michael Cecil

Originally posted by KilgoreTrout

Originally posted by Michael Cecil
That was the reason for the separation of Pauline Christianity from the 'Gnostics', and the extermination of tens of thousands of Albigensians 1100 years later.

I have read a few of your threads and found them very interesting, although much of it does go over my head. I wonder though if you can help me to understand what is wrong with Paul's teachings?

Briefly, Paul was a Pharisee who believed in the Egyptian doctrine of the physical raising of a dead body from the grave; the doctrine that Jesus was murdered for contradicting.

.. snip ..

That should be sufficient evidence to demonstrate the errors of Paul's teaching.

So, you are saying that no evidence is needed? Because you have provided none.

What is the source of claiming that Paul believed in the Egyptian doctrine and Christ did not? How is this belief any different than that of the Pharisees, who argued with the Sadducees and gladly embraced Jesus when he told the Sadducees that they were wrong to deny the ressurection? What is your source for the belief that Christ taught your "Doctrine of Rebirth" and was murdered for that? Why would Christ represent a greater threat to the Pharisees, just being one guy, while the Sadducees were a whole movement?

Where does Paul teach something in direct opposition to Christ's New Testament teaching?

reply to post by adjensen

First of all, Sir, I am not talking to you personally.

Who I am really talking to are the millions, tens of millions and hundreds of millions of people who, more or less, 'think' exactly like you do:

On more than one occasion, Jesus said something to the effect: "He who has the ears to hear, let him listen."

What that means is that not everyone has the ears to hear the Teaching of Jesus. There are some people who simply do not have such ears. And, I suppose, you believe these words of Jesus.

Similarly, there are also numerous Revelations referring to the secrecy of the Revelations themselves. And what that means is that the meaning of those Revelations is not known by everyone. (It is of the very nature of a "secret" that not everyone knows it.) And, I suppose, you believe those Revelations as well.

So far so good. You are 'happier than a clam' because you 'think' that you have the ears to hear the Teaching of Jesus and that you are one of the ones who 'knows the secret'.

Then someone come along and says "You, Sir, do not have the ears for the Teaching of Jesus; nor do you know 'the secret'."

Then there is a problem.

Then you get your panties all in a bunch and begin to whine, like a typical 3-year old or a teen-ager (they sound remarkably similar), about there 'not being any evidence' to demonstrate that you are wrong, or that someone is trying to take away your belief that 'makes you happy' without 'replacing it with anything else', etc. etc.

The problem, Sir, is that there are hundreds of millions of people who believe what you believe about the Doctrine of "resurrection"; and there are hundreds of millions if not billions more who are aware of the doctrine that you believe in but who do not believe it. In total, there are billions of people on this planet who are at least aware of the doctrine of a physical raising of a dead body from the grave.

And then you try to 'argue' that I have provided "no evidence" that the Teaching of Jesus on the "resurrection" is a secret?

That is not any 'argument'.

What that is is a whine because you have heard something that does not bring you pleasure.

This is what 3-year olds and teen-agers do when they are faced with the responsibility of having to grow up and deal with an unpleasant reality.

You don't have either the ears to hear the meaning of the words of Jesus in the Gospels--I could quote them to you, but it would make no difference. Neither do you have the eyes to see the evidence that you are in error.

But, what is worse, is that I know these things not because Jesus said so, but because I have personally received memories from those previous lives.

Now you can whine or pout all you want. Or you can accuse me of all manner of evil if you want.

But none of that will change the fundamental reality here: that you are deaf and blind to the Teaching of Jesus, and that you do not know the secret.

Sometime before you die, if you are fortunate, you will finally realize that reality does not prostrate itself to the desires of the "self' or the 'thinker'.

Mi cha el

reply to post by Michael Cecil


Knowledge can be obtained, Understanding cannot. You are understanding the shape of the logical construct you are dealing with, but the parts are misidentified. Belief is not knowledge, it is relative assumption and may or may not be Truth. More specifically, your quote should be that Faith is Understanding.

Likewise, Charity is Expressing. Understanding and Understanding Expressed is the image of Life (just as The Word and The Spirit of the Word came to us, our connection to Our Heavenly Father is also physically expressed and spiritually expressed), and in this is Hope.

Faith, Hope, Charity = Understanding and Understanding Expressed result in Comfort that is before, now and after.

Likewise, Pride and Chaos are the same as blindness (arrogance) and confusion (ignorance) and there is not Comfort in them. Seek first the unseen kingdom.

I am sure that many of you need to tend to your own lives more than you need to be concerned about eschatology. This would be true about any servant. Would it matter whether the Master returns or enemies come? Would your conduct be much different in either case? It should not vary greatly. Animal-men are easily scattered, so the Children of God must remain steadfast. Do so.

Originally posted by Dasher
reply to post by Michael Cecil

Knowledge can be obtained,

The Knowledge received through the "Vision of Knowledge" cannot be obtained. That Knowledge is Revealed. And only the Creator of the universe has control over who receives that Vision...

And who will acknowledge that Knowledge after having been informed.

The vast majority of people simply disregard that Knowledge as being "unsure", as is mentioned in the Thanksgiving Hymns of the Dead Sea Scrolls.

The knowledge that can be obtained is the knowledge of the 'thinker' or the knowledge of the "self".

Mi cha el

Originally posted by Michael Cecil
Now you can whine or pout all you want. Or you can accuse me of all manner of evil if you want.

But none of that will change the fundamental reality here: that you are deaf and blind to the Teaching of Jesus, and that you do not know the secret.

Sometime before you die, if you are fortunate, you will finally realize that reality does not prostrate itself to the desires of the "self' or the 'thinker'.

As I have told you before, Michael, I do not consider you evil (apart from your predilection for lying, but that can be put off to confusion, rather than intentional malevolence,) I simply consider you wrong. Your claim that you know "the secrets" and no one else does has every bit of credibility as anyone else who makes the same claim.

The problem is that you think that's all that you need to enlighten people, but it convinces no one but yourself, or someone so vacuous or so gullible that they'll believe anything that they hear that might correspond to something that they already believe.

For all your bravado of "I don't care what you think," you demonstrate that you desperately do care what others think. You post the same thing, over and over here on ATS, you wrote your book, you send out your press releases and other dire missives, because you've come to the realization that you're getting older, you're not going to be around forever, and if things don't start turning around, your 34+ years (or whatever it is) of tilting at windmills has been for naught.

Unfortunately, what you fail to grasp is that no one cares what you say because of the combination of your attitude, your ineptitude and the unlikely nature of what you propose. "I was Jesus in a previous life, so listen to what I say!" The madhouses are filled with similar proclaimers, whose lot in life is more a result of their level of societal functionality than the nature of their claims.

If you wish to be taken more seriously than every other proclaimer of "secret knowledge" who knows nothing beyond his own fantasies, you would need to stop making claims which are counter to existing evidence, OR provide some concrete answers to why that evidence is incorrect. And concrete doesn't mean more of your psychobabble about "self", "thinker" and "other terms" that you toss about in the belief that if something is confusing, it has merit.

Michael, in my many years of attending concerts, I am almost always followed about by a drunken arm waver, who stands in front of me and spoils the show. Doesn't matter if I'm in Canada, New York City, Los Angeles, he always shows up. I went to see Roger Waters' "The Wall" last month, and during the intermission, my daughter texted me to ask how the concert was, and I replied that at least the drunken arm waver had missed the show.

Not five minutes after that, here comes an inebriated guy, staggering up the aisle on the arm of his wife, with an usher in tow. After arguing for about five minutes, he convinced the usher that the hippies sitting quietly in the row ahead of me were in the wrong seats, had them ejected and took his seat (until intermission was over, of course, then he spent the remainder of the show on his feet, safe in the knowledge that Mr. Waters could now perform at his arm waving direction.)

I, and others, am your "drunken arm waver", Michael. We show up in your threads to ask simple questions that spoil your show and discredit you, because you fail to answer them. As I wrote in the thread "Get out of my thread!" this is the price that you pay for the exposure that you receive in a well travelled forum such as ATS. What you don't seem to realize is that, but refusing to answer simple questions, or responding in a meaningful way to your critics, short of attacking them personally, or spewing forth yet another tiresome pseudo-psychological jambalaya, all you're really doing is establishing a nice track record of evidence that you cannot possibly be correct.

I've said it before, I'll say it again. If there was anything to what you say, anything at all, you'd be a heck of a lot more effective in delivering it.

reply to post by adjensen
You really do need to ‘get out’ more often, Sir.

You need to read several dozen books on the Dead Sea Scrolls (from the early 1950s through the 1990s) and some books on the Nag Hammadi Codices.

You need to read a few hundred books on Jewish, Christian and Muslim theology.

A few dozen books on Jewish mysticism, Islamic mysticism, the Sufis and Gurdjieff.

A few dozen books on Freudian psychology, Jungian psychology, parapsychology, about people who have received memories of previous lives, and of the history of the Albigensian Crusade and the Holocaust.

A few dozen books on Buddhism, Hinduism, the Egyptian religion, the Eastern esoteric traditions, kundalini, Greek mythology, the American Indian religions, and the writings of J. Krishnamurti.

A few dozen books on Western philosophy and science, the history of physics and philosophy, and the “science of consciousness”.

A few books by Kierkegaard—perhaps the most brilliant Christian theologian/ psychologist who has ever lived—and several books by Nietzsche.

You need to read Genesis, the Book of Daniel, the Book of Isaiah, the Book of Ezekiel, the Gospels (including the Gospel of Mary and the Gospel of Thomas), and the Revelation of John at least dozens of times each.

And this will take you no less than 35 years (with no time off for ‘good behavior’).

Oh, but before you read most of these books, you need to receive the “Vision of Knowledge”, the Vision of the “Son of man”, the Revelation of the Memory of Creation, and the revelation of the memories of previous lives in order that you can determine what information contained in these other books can be useful in describing and explaining the Knowledge that has been Revealed to you; although it is highly unlikely that more than a very few will be able to understand what you are talking about.

In any case, there is a Prophecy in the Book of Zechariah 12:2-3 of “all the nations of the earth” (including the Israel) ‘massing against Jerusalem’. This Prophecy is a manifestation in the space-time reality of the retaliation of the Sons of Darkness against the Sons of Light; the retaliation of the thoughts of the ‘thinker’ and the “self” against Revealed Knowledge; and of the ‘fallen’ consciousness of the “beast of the sea”-“self” and the “beast of the earth”-‘thinker’ against the consciousness Created ‘by and in the image of God’.

And the consequences of that conflict can also be read in the Book of Zechariah.

Mi cha el

Originally posted by Michael Cecil
reply to post by adjensen
You really do need to ‘get out’ more often, Sir.

.. snip ..

Oh, but before you read most of these books, you need to receive the “Vision of Knowledge”, the Vision of the “Son of man”, the Revelation of the Memory of Creation, and the revelation of the memories of previous lives in order that you can determine what information contained in these other books can be useful in describing and explaining the Knowledge that has been Revealed to you; although it is highly unlikely that more than a very few will be able to understand what you are talking about.

Once again, you respond to simple questions with an attack on the questioner, claims of knowledge that you clearly do not have (you demonstrate a lack of understanding of some basic tenets of Judaism, Christianity, Islam and Gnosticism, so it's hard to believe that you have actually read any of that stuff -- you need to read the lines before you can read between them, lol,) and sum it up with your elitist "no one can understand it anyway, because only I have the visions."

The whole of your process seems to be nothing more than "I had these visions, and I've spent the whole of my life looking for reasons to validate them." As I've said, that's fine for you, but anyone else with an IQ above their body temperature is going to want to know why your visions, unsupported by anything other than a creative reading of 2,000 year old documents, is supposed to have them dismiss everything else in favour of your enlightenment, particularly when you answer any question with "only I can know these things!"

Is everything in Luke to be second guessed? Luke is an associate of Paul, who you demonize, why do you accept his account of the cross to be accurate?

Originally posted by Michael Cecil
Briefly, Paul was a Pharisee who believed in the Egyptian doctrine of the physical raising of a dead body from the grave; the doctrine that Jesus was murdered for contradicting.

Paul's contradiction of the Teaching of Jesus on the "resurrection"--specifically, that it is a Doctrine of 'Rebirth'--led to the creation of an anti-Semitic theology which, 1900 years later, resulted in the slaughter of millions of Jews during the Holocaust.

Hmm...I'm struggling with this one. If Paul contradicted Jesus, why then was he able to stand side by side with Peter, and be welcomed and respected by those who had known Jesus in life, and be called 'Apostle'? This is what I don't understand.

Originally posted by Michael Cecil
This is not at all a complicated doctrinal issue.

That should be sufficient evidence to demonstrate the errors of Paul's teaching.

Do you think? Nah! I think it is evidence that Paul's teachings may have been corrupted, just as they have all been corrupted. Funnily enough, I have just come back from the new exhibition of The Egyptian Book of the Dead at the British Museum. I found out something amazing that I need to think about before I start wittering on, but also, it is actually called, The Book of Passing Forth into Day. It is on until December 6th I think, well worth it, these things spend centuries in the dark and only come out for the briefest time.

www.britishmuseum.org...

I also stopped by the Victoria and Albert Museum and saw the tapestry cartoons by Raphael of the Acts of Peter and Paul. It seems, that Paul was seen, and most particularly respected, as the prophet to the Pagans, or Gentiles. That Peter was in charge of the Jews, and Paul the Gentiles. Where does Paul speak of resurrection? If none of the Apostles had a problem, other than perhaps a stylistic one, why should you?

Here's a link to the cartoons, not my cup of tea, but interesting in the respect of how the texts were 'interpreted' by the artist, and that part and parcel of that was reflecting the vanity of the patron...the Renaissance is not necessarily regarded for it's sound understanding of the classics, and most of our understanding of it dates from this rather murky attempt at awakening.

www.vam.ac.uk...

Evidently, then, most of what we knew of the Egyptians was from writings by Plato and other Greeks, and it was from those that early interpretations of hieroglyphs were taken, it has since been shown that Plato didn't have a clue and we have a different picture developing of the meanings of the 'Spells', and the earlier ones are very different from the later mass produced papyrus and chronologically, show a class division in knowledge or understanding of those practices that transforms into superstition lower down the social strata you get. Alot of the spells are clearly ways of preventing death. Anyway, one would presume, that if Plato didn't know the true nature of the Book of the Dead, then how could the Pharisees or Paul have...other than by direct revelation, which certainly appears to be what he speaks of in the epistles. To my ear anyways.

Sorry to go off topic. Please don't sigh at me.