Judgement on American Soil

As far as the porn you guys need to realize that it's just our technology thats showing mass people what has been going for ages. There has always been sick people, and there always will be. You just now get to see how sick there are by way of webpages and file sharing.

As far as America's problems, you guys need to get off the band wagon and stop blaming America for every problem this world has.

[edit on 26-6-2004 by d1k]

Originally posted by Ambient Sound
Yes, there is a change coming. The Human Race is growing up. We're being forced to by technology that has outpaced our social evolution. It doesn't matter as grow up we shall. As all do when coming of age, we are making many mistakes. It is inevitable that we struggle on this road. It's how we learn.

You religous guys are losing your franchises though and maybe that is what you are seeing that horrifies you so. Now that world history is available to so many, we can start to see the patterns of control. We can see what your churches have been up to. It is a slow process taking centuries, as humans vary as to how much freewill of their own they actually want to excercise. Some would rather have decisions made for them and that is fine for now. Those numbers are dropping in places where a higher standard of living gives the thoughtful time to take a good look around. The rest will follow eventually as they continue to be lied to, stolen from, and sent to die by those who claim to speak for God.

As we see the atrocities of fanatical Islam, we are reminded by their defenders of the atrocities of other various religions and we begin to face the undenyable truth. No religion is correct. No religion is sanctioned by God. All Religions do evil in God's name and the sooner we all give up ancient unprovable fables as justification for how bad we treat others, we'll all be a lot better off.

I'm amused that you presume to judge me (Hey! I look at porn!), as you are neither qualified nor have the authority to do so. I know right from wrong and trying to impress me with how grand your cathedral is isn't going to make me think you know better than I. You guys have been running that scam a long time now.

I'm comfortable with my spiritial well being. I wonder if you can ever say the same. Do you really think you are a sinner? Do you think you are evil and need to be forgiven? Ever thought about taking responsibility for your own actions and thoughts? Ever think about choosing not to sin? You dim your own light and entice others to do the same when you teach them this self-destructive mindset. I am sad for you and them. Have you tried forgiving yourself?

I'm glad the day is coming when people will stop letting others tell them what to believe and therefore what to think. Unlike weirdo, I don't respect Religions. I do respect your right and freewill to believe what you want, though, no matter how wrong I think it may be.

As you compose your flaming responses, if you bother, please keep in mind that you have predicted Judgement on American Soil. That is pretty flaming in itself. Getting mad at me won't change what I think. Throwing a bunch of scripture at me that I don't believe is the word of God anyway won't prove anything except that you know how to type some other human's outdated words. You seemed to be asking what was going on. I think your real question was why do fewer people believe what you believe? I thought I would tell you.

Hi Ambient Sound


let's start off on a good foot by comepletly forgetting the religious nature of this disccusion. You are absolutly rgiht that I do not have the right to judge you.

Secondly, I won't even try to convince you of the truth of my beliefs. I will simply say that I believe Faith in Jesus Christ alone is the only way to have a real relationship with God and all others are just man's attempts to have one with him on our terms. After all can you think of one religion that freely offers eternal life for simply believing in a substitue sacrifice? I can't. That is the beginning and the end of the message Jesus Christ preached and he didn't ram it down anyone's throat.

Unfortunately, what we see to day, the Christianity you hate so vehemently, is the product of evil men, men who calim to speak on behalf of God while sleeping a round and taking your money.

My challange for you is this: read the entire new Testament (even if you don't believe what it says) Afterwards, I truelly believe that you will come to the conclusion that you don't actually hate Christianity, but those hypocrites among the true believers. I hate Lawyers! Why? because I assume they are all the same. The truth is, there not.

At the risk of ruining any chances of a continuing dialogue with you I would like to give you two Scriptures- it won't offend you- they just sum up what I've said. They were written two thousand years ago and it just goes to show you that people don't change.

Peter is addressing the believers in a letter: But there were false teachers among the people, just as there shall be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them- bringing swift destruction on themselves. Many will follow their shameful ways and will bring the way of truth into disrepute. In their greed they shall make merchandise of you with stories they have made up. Their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction has not been sleeping 2 peter 2:1-3

Pauls farewell speech in Ephesus:...Terefore I declare to you this day that I am innocent of the blood of all men. For I have not hesitated to proclaim to you the whole will of God. Keep watch over yourselves and all the flock which the Holy spirit has made you overseers. Be shepards of the church of God, which he bought with his own blood. I know that after I leave, savage wolves will come in among you and will not spare the flock. Even from your own number men will arise and distort the truth in order to draw a way disciples after them.. So be on your guard! Remember that for three years I never stopped warning each of you night and day with tears. Acts 20:26-31

I simply submit to you Ambient that the church you see today is fulfilment of the words you read above. AD 40?-to present!


Lets continue this discuusion with out cutting each others heads off; that includes my remarks as well!!!

Originally posted by d1k
As far as the porn you guys need to realize that its just our technology thats showing mass people what has been going for ages. There has always been sick people, and there always will be. You just now get to see how sick there are by war of webpages and file sharing.

As far as America's problems, you guys need to get off the band wagon and stop blaming America for every problem this world has.

Absolutely!!! But I'm not blaming America it definately is a world problem, but i just choose to focus on America because I live here, that's all

[edit on 26-6-2004 by Graystar]

Why start in America?

hmmm, let's see.. Islam= strap a bomb on some kid tell him to go kill as many as u can and GOD will have 70 virgans waiting on you in hevan...


Christians= Look @ porn on the world wide web and GOD will send these kids to America to blow us all up...


Very Intersting times we live in indeed.. It's great to be alive..

US bashing again? Europeans are forgetting the crap they themselves have done to the world... Last I remember the last true genocides were allowed and with the direct consent and help from Germany and France in Sudan and Rwanda, so please do not come here telling us all the problems in the world are because of the US. i am not talking about the holocaust, but the 1990s, and even now. Look around in the world, there are worse things happening and there are countries that are really bent on suppresing freedom and the US is not one of them.

I know that Europeans would have preferred if we had just let another UN sanction Iraq again, while their own countries keep swimming in their earnings at the expense of another 500,000 children in Iraq under the age of 5 die like in the last sanction the UN put forth and Clinton agreed with.

You want to see suppresion of freedom and free speech? Look at what China is doing with Taiwan and who was helping in a show of military Force to supress the independance of Taiwan? France. Some European countries seem hell bent on suppressing freedom in favour of not having a war between the oppressor and the oppressed. (ie China, Taiwan)

Do not put the blame on the US because there are countries that have done and are doing worse than we have done.

I'm going to kindly bow out of this discussion...it's just not fun anymore.

Adian

Originally posted by Adian00
Why start in America?

Because no where has God's blessing been so greatly given than in America, and yet in spite of these continued blessings we are becoming the most immoral people on the face of the earth. Not since Ancient Isreal has a nation prospered so greatly because of there faith in God. But Just like ancient Isreal we have forsaken the blessing giver. It is absolutely Amazing, but American History is almost Parallel to ancient Isreal. take a look at the Old Testament and you will see exactly what I mean. Also check out this one verse its mind blowing Deuteronomy 31:15-18.

You may ask, why now? Its not because its 2004. Its because so many are being swallowed whole by this flood of filth. not only does Pornography enslave its users it destroys families, which are the foundation of every society, leaving in it's wake broken homes and broken lives. It is also the initiator and promoter of every kind of immorality on earth.

But perhaps the greatest reason is that it has totaly infected the church, and I believe that it is at this point that God must act. God can tolorate those who do not know him to live this kind of life it is their free will, but He will not tollorate those who parade his name around and drag it through the mud. The truth is then brought into disrepute and many who would be saved will never believe. It's a domino effect of the worse kind.

I hope this has given you your answer in a nut shell.

[edit on 27-6-2004 by Graystar]

Greystar


let's start off on a good foot by comepletly forgetting the religious nature of this disccusion.

Following that you talk about religion why? To constantly quote religion as a way of punishing people is so old testiment.If we are to be judged by our actions on this planet by a god who disagrees why porn when the human race is constantly killing people and abusing them.Please clarifiy what would make porn more important then any other attrocities

Originally posted by weirdo
Greystar


let's start off on a good foot by comepletly forgetting the religious nature of this disccusion.

Following that you talk about religion why? To constantly quote religion as a way of punishing people is so old testiment.If we are to be judged by our actions on this planet by a god who disagrees why porn when the human race is constantly killing people and abusing them.Please clarifiy what would make porn more important then any other attrocities

i was speaking to Ambient Sound but your right its hard to seperate the religious part because that's how I started this thread.

Originally posted by Adian00
I'm going to kindly bow out of this discussion...it's just not fun anymore.
Adian

Oh, I see....so, Its fun to poke at the US when normally people don't respond back with evidence....but when information is presented that other countries are doing worse than the US, the US bashers don't want to deal with it?

Hi Muaddib,

Please read my previous posts before you say such things. As a matter of fact, I have been in aggrement with you. Don't jump the gun man.

Adian

Originally posted by Adian00
Hi Muaddib,

Please read my previous posts before you say such things. As a matter of fact, I have been in aggrement with you. Don't jump the gun man.

Adian

My apologies then Adian, I mistook your post as another US bashing....its late, i better get some sleep.

Actually...you did agree with wierdo and he was bashing the US.....oh well, i still need sleep.

[edit on 27-6-2004 by Muaddib]

Ok...hah..I agree with both of you
You've both made excelent points and as an American, I still do have a certain sense of pride. However, It's not as if we're blameless.

Adian

[edit on 25-6-2004 by weirdo]

.

As for Pearl Harbor we would not have entered the war, except for the unprovoked attack on pearl harbor by the Japanese kamakazies( Who by the way were stoned out of there minds.


Who is justifing America's actions, not me. She ain't perfect, I know!
And who is imposing our beliefs. Stop watchin CNN and get the real story about Iraq.

Unprovoked attack?

Youve reccomended that we stop watching CNN and get the real story, how about the real story from pearl harbour?
At Paris Peace Conference in 1919, Japan's proposal of amending a "racial equality clause" to the covenant of the League of Nations was rejected by the United States, Britain and Australia. Racist arrogance and discrimination towards the Japanese had plagued Japanese-Western relations since the forced opening of the country in the 1800s, and were again a major factor for the deterioration of relations in the decades preceeding World War 2. In 1924, for example, the US Congress passed the Exclusion Act that prohibited further immigration from Japan.
America also stopped trading with japan cutting off the japanese oil supplies.During that time japan was (although minorly) involved in defending europe from the germans and using alot of oil in that endevor while the states were doing nothing.

If we want to talk about countries being unprovoked why dont we talk about the US in relation to Iraq as displayed in this artical www.commondreams.org...
or maybe this one
www.thenation.com...




[edit on 2-7-2004 by kastinyque]

thank you for opening up your eyes, welcome to the real world.

But, seems to me, that if God decides to pass judgement on America, it's not gonna be because of the porn. That's just a symptom of a bigger problem. God heard the prayers of our predecessors and saw their desire to be free, to worship God according to their own beliefs. He led them to america, where they could find their own way, without the Church's "God ordained" infallicy and without the wars that those ideas pervoked. God took the chains off these people and freed them to worship him how they desired. Well, it's been a few centuries, and still, we haven't really passed that freedom down to all of our members. We pass laws proclaiming that freedom and equality, trying to alleviate the symptoms with welfare, affirmative action, ect. But, in our hearts, we still don't see all as being equal, and thus some's freedom should be curtailed. Even the churches will not extend that equality and freedom to women. God will judge the greatest amoung us, according to the treatment we give the least of us. The least of us...hmmm.....even with laws saying otherwise, many employers will not give a fair wage to women. Men have families to feed, women don't, so they don't need it. Many husbands find it hard to see their wives as equals...this leads to divorce. Employers don't feel the need to pay their lower skilled workers a living wage, although they pay their upper management 5 or more times as much. All of this has led to a massive welfare system that is breaking the backs of our state governments. But, still, the thought that we should all be considered of equal worth....deserving of a day's pay for a day's work (enough to sustain him and his family for the day)...still seems to be unthinkable. It's much better to shift the burden to where is doesn't belong...our gov't. So, since the gov't is paying for the healthcare, paying for the housing, paying for the food, ect....of so many people. Shouldn't they have a right to monitor the habits of others, make sure they aren't doing anything that might cause that heathcare cost to rise? Should they have some say as to what they eat, since hey, they are the ones feeding them? And, shouldn't they have some say as to who visits those subsidized housing units, since, again, it's them footing the bill.
Sorry, it's not the porn....
it's our ability to look at another person, judge them as less than us, and then come up with a million reasons why we should be allowed to live a life of luxury while they live in desparate proverty! And, then finding that utterly disgusting, so ya, we'll give them enough, demeaning them all the way...through welfare programs.
But, make no mistake about it, the churches refuse to grant that equal status to women...they plant the seed.

Originally posted by Graystar
I'm not going to spell out aother doom and gloom message here about an end of the world senario involving comets or nukes, rather I would like to discuss present day America.

I don't consider my self to be a prophet or a saint, but i do believe in Jesus Christ, so my prespective is a christian one.

I'll get right to the point. I believe that very soon, (and no I don;t know when) there is going to be a major shaking up in this country. So major infact that our lives as we know them will no longer be the same. You will have to put on some srt of blinders to pretend that they are.

I have seen (regretably) the terrible pornography on the internet some of which is so vile that it makes my skin crawl. I Have seen how young people have comepletely given themselves over to the most unbelievable practices imaginable.

I feel that if God does not punish this, (and I know that he is patient) that he will have to apoloize to Sodom and Gommorah.

I'm just as guilty as the people I saw on there and deserve the same punishment that's is coming, as I 'm sure as many of those reading this.

As unbelievable as this stuff (porn) is, this is just the beginning of it. We are literally going to be bathing in it in a few short years. So while we can we need to resist it so that when the punishement (after God's longsuffering has wained) finally comes we won't be so shocked.

I know that Al-Queda is evil and a spwn of Satan, never the less I believe God will hand this country over to them to be chastized and to awaken it. God has always used a few to conquer the many. Now I don't want anyone to misunderstand me here Al-Queda does not work for God but God's Soveriegn Hand is allowing them to strike at our heart.

This truely is a time to take an eternal perspective because the wolf is no longer at the door, he is inside hiding behind it!

Mock, scoff, or just pass this off as the rantings of some supposed sexually frustrated man, but I'm telling you, just as surely as I'm rwriting this, its here. Tic -toc tic -toc tic- toc tic- toc tic- toc!

Your statements are very well placed, however as a Christain Chaplain I do agree that every man shall receive some kind of judgement for one thing or another, but you have to understand Jesus Christ has already taken the punishment for our sins and if we accept him as our savior that we are forgivin our sins and know that we the saved in Christ shall be left out of the tribulation because of that. I would also tell you that does not however exclude the fact we need repent for continued tresspasses a good example 5 of the 7 churches now by churches I mean those established by God while and after Jesus was on earth so they should be even more charished than us share this common facture with us they have sinned as well see the verses where the letters to the 7 churches in the first part of the book of Revelation these 5 of 7 churches are told to repent so please be comforted and make the correct corrections and repent and then pray that God put a wall between you and the sin committed and give you the strength never to look over the wall to look or dwell in it again.


God Bless and keep you

Greystar Granted There are Disgusting Porn Images On the Internet....Women doing Horses,Dogs,Ext........But Im not going to Sit here and Say I don`t enjoy Looking at A man and A women of Legal Age Going at it....... God Created Man and Women in his Image and I Worship her DailyI personaly think wiith all of the wrong in todays world GOD has other things to worry about other than Porn

Originally posted by Adian00
Ok...hah..I agree with both of you

You've both made excelent points and as an American, I still do have a certain sense of pride. However, It's not as if we're blameless.

Adian

Exactly what blame are you talking about?
If anyone is to blame, then the whole world is doomed equally...