WTC 7's compartmented demolition collapse sequence reveals human intervention.

reply to post by Cassius666


Could you explain what is so fantastical about the events? The make sense considering what happened. A combination of factors makes an interesting picture.

Originally posted by Varemia
reply to post by Cassius666

 

Could you explain what is so fantastical about the events? The make sense considering what happened. A combination of factors makes an interesting picture.

Well to stay on topic, the debries that managed to single out WTC 7 out of an area and take it down. That many of the buildings closer to WTC 1 and 2 which got damaged worse did not collapse. That WTC 7 collapsed due to fire with smart fires targeting just the right spots, Ground zero burning unusually long and hot, NORAD which routinely intercepts jets unable to shoot down airliners going for their targets even after the first attack

reply to post by Cassius666


But I showed you the LiDar. The building between WTC 7 and WTC 1 was severely damaged. It didn't collapse because after the bombing in '93, those buildings were reinforced, from what I remember. The designs were fairly different and one was MUCH taller than the other. That means weight, and lots of it.

Originally posted by Varemia
reply to post by Cassius666

 

But I showed you the LiDar. The building between WTC 7 and WTC 1 was severely damaged. It didn't collapse because after the bombing in '93, those buildings were reinforced, from what I remember. The designs were fairly different and one was MUCH taller than the other. That means weight, and lots of it.

edit on 18-11-2010 by Varemia because: typo

buildingwhat.org...

Half of building 5 collapsed the other half seems to be still standing. I guess 3 had no chance with both towers crashing on it. The others look in bad shape too. Then there is building 7 and the buildings to the left and right of it.

But like I said. If Ahminedschad wants to convince me that the holocaust story is different than what my teachers told me he has to convince everybody else first.

If you want to convince me that the NIST report is the real deal, you or the American experts have to convince the other American experts and the Europeans who know more about the topic than me first.

Untill that happens I am not gonna run around screaming NIST !!!

If I were to believe any doofus (by which I dont mean you) on a conspiracy site I might as well believe about any wild tale of UFOs and reptillians I find online.

OP : WTC 7's compartmented demolition collapse sequence reveals human intervention.

Let's return once again to the heart of this thread's matter.

The 2.25-2.28 seconds free-fall period in the onset of WTC 7's global collapse, so after the 8.3 seconds needed to collapse the eastern penthouse construction on the roof and to topple down into that roof, is explained in these three video's.


This next one is a video from February 20, 2009 in which a few things are explained, that fit exactly in the theory I have proposed in my OP from this thread.

Title : WTC 7 in free-fall, the consequences :
www.youtube.com...



This video's poster is Peterene, one of the members of that forum I lately promoted, because I found it to have a high quality of 911-research level. An example of a "WTC 7 South side views" thread on there :
the911forum.freeforums.org...

and an "Active Thermitic Material in WTC Dust" thread on there :
the911forum.freeforums.org...


These are excerpts of the video, so you will get curious to really view the above free-fall video.
Typed out by me, LT :

First (0 to 1:20 / 4:11) we see a video of WTC 7 lower floors at the north face from a period of 8 seconds, just before WTC 7 its collapse started, and we see a few, several floors high, flame jets leaking out of ONE 13th floor window in the lower north face. And a lot more smoke coming out the west and south face.

Then ( 1:20 to 2:56 / 4:11) comes some texts from peterene :

So, we have a very unusual jet of flames from the 13th floor, keep that in mind.
Last year (2008) David Chandler forced NIST to admit that there was a 2.25-2.28 seconds period of FREE-FALL at the onset of the WTC 7 collapse.
The height of one floor was 3.89 meter high.
How many floors did suffer the free-fall collapse?
A free-falling object would travel the distance of 25 meter, i.ex. 7 floors suffered a free-fall collapse.
Let's say that the 13th floor jet-flame was generated by a thermite charge which was used to destroy some core column....From that point would the building start to collapse.
But what about the free-fall? If the building started to fail here (13th floor), the zone where it would the upper block start to decelerate would be about the 5th or 6th floor (13th store minus 7 stories of free-fall).
Why are the floors 5 and 6 so interesting? These floors were mechanical floors. So some demolition preparation would go unnoticed. (LT : Peterene seems not to know about the whole row of floors above, which were not occupied by tenants, thus vacant, on 911)
So, my opinion is that there were cuts at the core columns at the 13th and 5th or 6th floor. (the upper floor is marked by the flames, the lower boundary is marked by the louvers of the mechanical floors), and the distance between these floors is 25 meter, which corresponds to the 2.28 seconds of FREE-FALL.

After that text (2:56) came some more videos.

First an excerpt of Barry Jennings his uncut interview with Dylan Avery, where he explains that in the early morning, before both towers fell (at the end of this video part we hear him say "both buildings were still standing"), he and Hess reached the 6th floor, and were blown back upwards by an explosion from under them, which let him hanging on the side rail of the stairwell, and the rest of it under it was gone by the explosion. Barry managed to crawl up to the 7th floor landing, and Hess asked what to do now. Barry said to proceed further up to the 8th floor, and go as far north to the last window on the corner, where he smashed a window out with a fire extinguisher, for fresh air, since the whole floors were packed with dark smoke, and also to alert rescuers down on the north side in the streets.

That's the 8th northeastern floor window we later in another video I posted already, see Hess shouting to rescuers on the ground standing near the loading dock, at the back (northeastern side corner) of WTC 7. The south face of WTC 7 looked out on the north face of WTC 1, the second one that collapsed, and had the huge radio mast on top. We see debris from WTC 1 seemingly impact WTC 7, but we have only video views looking from north to south, so perpendicular on the north face, we don't have views from the west or east, so in that case we could see if in fact, debris hit the CENTER south wall face. We have pictures of damage to the south western corner but that was only a few floors high, and not really deep. Some people liked to use that damage as the one that caused WTC 7 to collapse.
Well, even the NIST report end-editors did not dare to use that, and even explicitly stated that the WTC 1 debris hits did not caused the building to collapse. They said only fire caused WTC 7 to collapse, combined with minor south face damage.

We all are on an unstoppable road to prove then wrong.
David Chandler, and these guys from the911forum like Achimspock and his friends and many others, f.ex. on ATS, PhysOrg, JREF (only the real truthers there!) are nailing one by one the death-coffin closed for the NIST report conclusions.

By the way, the latest FOIA released video of Barry Jennings interview on the street on 911, together with the little brown guy who was one of those that rescued him and Hess, let us hear exactly what this rescuer said. He clearly says that they tried to get into WTC 7 a few times before 12:00 AM, and found BOTH stairwells totally damaged at the lower floors, so they had to find their way through the demolished inside, to reach Jennings and Hess on the 8th floor.
But no WTC 1 debris ever got so deep inside to cause those both stairs to be wrecked totally, while also elevator cars were blown out from their shafts. Look up, how deep in the building all these events took place. No way that debris could have caused that.

And remember, there's a NIST and Firefighter magazine report from a FDNY firefighter who reported back to his Chief early in the morning, just after WTC 1 fell, that he inspected all the length of floor 9 along the south side facade to find it to have no damage at all, only at the office room in the south western corner.
The corner we have those few NYPD chopper photos from, which looked in the first years released photo as an immense gash, but later, when we got the other photos, turned out to be mostly smoke covering undamaged floor's corners, and only a few corner parts 2 windows deep max, were ripped away by a WTC 1 Vierendaal outer wall debris piece, laying on the street below at the southwestern corner. Not at all the huge damage NIST tried to impress us with in the first years of their predesignated campaign, they clearly had the order to convince the world that there were no explosions in all three towers, and that all carnage was caused by fires and plane and debris impacts.
The biggest bunch of official lies ever tried on us since the Oklahoma City and first WTC garage bombings.!

Secondly, a part of the famous POLICE US INS guy on the phone-boot video, with that loud explosion sound in it.

(Here's some more on WTC 7 explosions before WTC 1 collapsed : )

www.youtube.com...



And that's the end of this Peterene video.


Here is a series of 5 videos by Achimspok, The NIST predecisional WTC 7 Report, where he explains a lot of discrepancies in the by NIST chosen temperatures and durations of fires at several floors of WTC 7 for their Fire damage reports and these same data filled-in in their secret collapse-sequence software program (no source code, no public access), and the actual observed fires durations and possible temperatures derived from videos filming the northern and eastern face of WTC 7. Only a few photo's and videos exist on the WW Web from the western and southern face of WTC 7 in the afternoon, up till collapse.

These 5 videos show to exponent that NIST upped their computation data for fires at certain lower floors to such idiot long durations and high temperatures, that they could reach a point in their software, that an animation came out which very faintly looked like the real collapse as we all remember from the 911 WTC 7 collapse videos, but it still had not those later proved 2.25 to 2.28 seconds of free-fall and its POSSIBLE CAUSE calculated and animated in it, and did not show the smooth facade shifting down as can be seen in all collapse videos. They extended basic office fires expectations to minimal 90 minutes and longer, while the Part 2 video evidence show all registered fires to have died down within 30 minutes :

Part 1 : www.youtube.com...


Part 2 : www.youtube.com...


Part 3 : www.youtube.com...


Part 4 : www.youtube.com...


Part 5 : www.youtube.com...


============================

This is a video by femr2, another member at the forum I find so much new information from logical thinkers lately :

WTC 7 Drop the Facade :
www.youtube.com...



Femr2 explains that we have to understand the important implications, now that NIST has been forced to accept and include free-fall in their Final WTC 7 Report.

Text in video :

A body of mass in free-fall is by definition facing no resistance, other than air.

This means that for 2.25 seconds of the descent of WTC 7 the entire facade dropped vertically without facing any resistance.
A 2.25 seconds free-fall equates to about 81.5 feet.

Roughly 7 floors of WTC 7.

NIST would have you believe that a cascade of internal column failures enabled this event to occur.
So, we will assume the core of WTC 7 has or is collapsing and focus on the external facade.
To free-fall, no vertical movement of the facade is possible until these supports fail. (shown are the 7 lower floor facades removed under the rest of the facade.)
So, what mechanism removed all structural support, instantly, for all of these columns, over a vertical distance of 81.5 feet ?

Some of the comments on this video, first to last :

Page 2 : Skeptic121 :
For those who forgot high school physics:

Distance = 1/2 x Acceleration x Time squared

D = 1/2 x 9.8 x 2.25 x 2.25 = 24.8 meters = 81.3 feet.
That means 81 feet of the vertical support beams were suddenly gone.
Not weakened gradually by fire, but GONE. Suddenly.
Not only that, but the event happened at the same time all over the visible facade.
A controlled demolition would explain the observed collapse perfectly, but there might be other explanations. Anyone?

Page 1 : swu880 :
Your analogy is a false comparison. (LT : skatepeak's balloon-popping comment, further down.)

First, fire is an ORGANIC process. Very wild & random- difficult to control. It burns unevenly&gradually thus causes ASYMMETRIC DAMAGE. It is impossible for fire to cause a constant smooth & instantaneous & symmetric collapse. That goes against the very nature of fire! In order to achieve such a smooth symmetric collapse, you MUST remove the supports of the building in a very controlled manner.

I have yet to see a fire burn instantaneously, evenly & symmetrically. (LT: WTC 7 fires were chaotic)


Page 1 : femr2 uploader comments :

skatepeak, 8 months ago :
The facade wasn't intact as the collapse was initiated.
Huge chunks of the 1WTC hit the southern facade of 7WTC, as 1WTC was demolished (I think it was).
So, only the northern, eastern and western facade was holding up the entire building (7WTC), at the base, as the structural elements collapsed inside.
As we can see in the videos of 7WTC's collapse, the north facade leans south.
If I stand on a pallet, and lean forward, the point where my feet touches the pallet will disengage.

femr2 8 months ago :
Not according to NIST. They have the period of near free-fall occurring during the same time within which roughly two thirds of the internal support structure is still intact.

All it takes is time-aligning the simulations they released to their velocity graph descriptions.

I engaged in direct dialog with NIST until I pointed out that rather severe contradiction, at which point they severed contact and have since refused to acknowledge any correspondence.
(LT : The same experience, but even more dishonest behavior, after they saw my seismic charts time-stamps comparison with the Cianca photo timestamped by NIST themselves, they suddenly removed all their online references to seismic event reports, dated after Feb 2005.)

skatepeak 8 months ago :
Doesn't NIST say that one third of the internal support fail, then the entire building falls ~ 81,5 ft in 2,25 seconds?
And wouldn't the majority of that third, of the internal structure, be the lower part of the building?
The part that was scraped out by falling debris from 1WTC, and weakened by "fire"?

Exactly like standing on a balloon?

It pops, you fall at free fall speeds, hit the ground and slowly decelerates till your ass touches tarmac?? Am I totally lost in logic here?

femr2 8 months ago :
They seriously contradict their own results when you compare the model behavior to their written descriptions.

The *free-fall* phase is a serious problem with 2/3 of the core intact.

The best thing for you to do at this time I think is to familiarize yourself with the visual model behavior...

Title : WTC 7 NIST Model Reality Check :



(Read the uploader comments.!.
femr2 : The easiest way to orient yourself is to look at the penthouse. The NIST model view shows the North side. ALL videos of WTC 7 descent also show the North side. Viewpoints show part of the West face.)

Have you read the final report in full ? If not, then it's important to read it whilst having the model behaviour in mind.

Contradiction extremus.

===============================
Read all 57 comments, at least on page 1.
The best comment in my opinion is the latest one :

STRANGEtownVIDEO 4 days ago :
Why doesn't somebody use the software NIST used with a model of WT7 and blow out 18 floors in a controlled demolition sequence?

Bet you it looks like the real life video.

===============================

The problem is, if you read this exponent, that software has never been released by NIST to this day, for public scrutiny and use for own experimenting.

A TAD BIT strange scientific behavior, to say the least.
I say, a bunch of politically pressed liars, those NIST reports end-editors.

reply to post by LaBTop


While I contest a good deal of your evidence, I appreciate the work you've put into it, and I find your conclusions reasonable. While I do not feel it fully discredits the possibility of the OS happening, it does offer a possible alternative.

The first link to those three video's is broken (User retracted). The best there is on the subject is :

David Chandler's own YouTube channel :
Title : WTC7 in Freefall: No Longer Controversial.

Here he defends his measurements regarding the 2.25 to 2.28 seconds free-fall :

The WTC7 series has elicited a number of questions from people unclear on the details of how I did the measurements, compared to how NIST did them and how the representatives of NIST described their measurements. I have therefore created a WTC7 Measurement FAQ page:
www.911speakout.org... .

I will also use this FAQ as a place of reference for other questions that arise as well.

EDIT : Have a look at their home page, Jonathan Cole the thermite/thermate experimenter, and David Chandler as the physics measurements researcher :
911speakout.org...
Here you can also find back the original three videos link, in the middle of the page. It automatically loads parts 1, 2 and 3.
And Cole's thermate demonstration.

you can clearly see the squibs on the right side of the building going verticle starting mid way up you'll see the black squib smoke rise up out the windows as it falls down. They probably kept all of the doors shut in the buildings to contain the blasts within to keep people from noticing the squibs blowing out some of the windows, and for the towers to turn to dust as they fall makes me believe that whoever did it wanted all of New York to choke on the asbestos dust and they knew the people would and can't do nothing about it. So all those that are affected by this dust and will die soon because of it, your social security money will be going to those that caused this, because thats what they want. There's too big a population and not enough money to cover social security so they are creating ways to keep the money by killing you!