Finger printing of Children: Is it a Scam?

My nephew attends karate classes locally.

This school has been fantastic and he has really enjoyed the classes.

However, about 6 weeks ago the school announced that it would be taking the fingerprints of all the children and parents, of course they would be encrypted, with their names, addresses and dates of birth, to track attendance on a new ocmputer system.

On asking for more information from the Master, he said he had been approached by a computer company to 'help' him to simplify his paper work. The door would be locked, instead of the free entrance to the class we had all enjoyed (this is a low crime, safe area of the UK), and each person would only get in with their fingerprint reading on the scanner. The only persons with access to the computer would the Master and his staff. He said that if we wished our finger prints to be removed at any time we could.

The computer company were claiming to offer a 'massive discount' on the system, much as any new window salesman would, and they would show case the karate club as one of their 'success stories'.

At this point, I should have asked him if he wanted to 'buy a bridge'!

On reading www.bigbrotherwatch.co.uk I read that many schools had abandoned their finger printing schemes. But apparantlhy this company sold their scheme as fantastic, and not open to any abuse as only the Master would access the computerand used by schools.

Call me thick, but surely, a finger print can never be removed from the hard drive of the computer.

Also, surely a company that wrote the encryption code would be able to decode it easily.

All they would have to do is set the computer system to fail after say a year, come to 'repair' it, stick memory stick in and remove all that lovely, valuable information.

This would be like money in the bank in a few years time. If the banks manage to digitalise all our accounts, make them accessible only with our finger prints, millions of finger prints will be for sale on the black market and their names and addresses and ages, so easy to match.

All those people could, in theory lose their savings and there would be nothing they could do about it as it was done with THEIR OWN fingerprints.

If I was a diabolical criminal genius, this is what I would be doing!

If someone knows better.....please inform me as until I know this is impossible I will continue to support my sister and brother in law in their refusal to allow their son to have his prints taken!

So! Anyone know bette?


[edit on 18-8-2010 by Elliot]

reply to post by Elliot


I think you'll find this is illegal and without your authorisation your child won't be fingerprinted.

A similar move was made here at one of the schools until some parents took it up with both the school and the Dept of Education; they put a stop to it immediately.

reply to post by bluemirage5

Thank you.

We certainly have not given permission for our child to be finger printed, but all the parents and children walked in willingly to have it done. No signature was required, no questions were asked and NO ONE even raised an eyebrow at what they were being asked to do.

I am wondering if the Karate Club were in fact paid to have the system rather than paying to have it. Personally, I find it an odd thing to do but others did not and I am suspicious of the long term consequences.

of course it's a scam. What possible reason could there be for it not to be a scam? While you're at it, you might as well microchip your children in case they get lost if you're so scared.

reply to post by Elliot


Don't do it, what they are doing is morally and ethically wrong on all counts.

Not for one moment am I and mine going to give our finger prints.

BUT, I cannot understand the actions of the other parents.

In the past, when this finger printing malarchy started we refused to allow our children to given their prints, and this was a good 8 years ago in the local schools. It was so that they could 'buy' their lunch with their finger prints and the money would come straight out of our bank account.

We could see the craziness of this and so we refused but we were virtually the only parents to refuse.

In the long term, I believe people will rue the day they gave their prints and what really horrifies me is that apart from ourselves everyone else that I am aware of rushed off to give their prints.

When I watched them all practicing their karate kicks later all I could see was kicking sheep!!!

Crazy!

reply to post by filosophia

Filosophia - But what do you think is the REAL reason for this scam, except for getting children used to giving away their most intimate information?

I believe there is more than just control of people involved, but also a financial reward in the long run for the perpetrators.

I just hoped that some computer security expert might drop by and be able to give some answers to the above questions.

But I suppose it's a touch subject as no one wants to 'touch' it!

Thanks all!

Questions? What questions?

Is this possible? YES obviously
Can encryption be broken? YES obviously
Is the information safe? NO NO NO obviously
Is it a scam? YES and NO - POTENTIAL is HIGH
What's the difference between a scam and an overzealous capitalist?
Perspective. It could be that this security company, like many needy
roofers or paint contractors in the US, really DO need success stories -
so they deep discount a service that they typicall overcharge 1000%.

What kind of scam?
That's the real question. Is the Home Office contracting with private firms to get the id information on all UK residents without their knowledge? Could it be a covert MI5 activity? Or is it a massive id theft ring with time and resources to keep the data on the kids until adulthood - or steal the parents identities now? The possibilities here are endless.
Most likely, it's unbridled capitalism, selling their systems, generating a service fee income for the future, pedaling the id information to other "information brokers" - like selling your email address to marketing companies, much more abuse potential here.

gj
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reply to post by ganjoa


Thanks Ganjoa!

Why do you think people think nothing of giving their information in this manner?

I literally saw parents and children alike queue up as if lemmings ready to jump off a cliff and not one questioning this.....only little old me.

Why would anyone give their finger prints in this manner and worse still comprise their children's security?

Unbelievable!

reply to post by Elliot


I haven't a clue why anyone would willingly - BLINDLY - give up any identification information. My fingerprints have been on file forever so it just doesn't matter (to me) to have another copy at an official repository. BUT NEVER a commercial institution! My bank got into the fingerprint to cash checks racket a while back - but I never utilized the service. I won't even use my ATM card except at a "real" bank location.

Seems like with all the surveillance already in place, it'd be an easy matter to match up all those fingerprints with the photos of the people in line to have them taken. Next they'll be data mining through the national id database (sorry, that was a couple of decades ago).

gj