Muslim leaders to abandon plans for Ground Zero community center

reply to post by seagull


Thank you, I wish more people would understand that point about the location. I did see something that is a little disturbing and that is the date they want it done by which is 09/11/2011 why would they want to have that particular date knowing how we feel about that day.

This would be a very good publicity move for Muslims in America.

Rather than anger many people about building so close to the site of the 911 tragedy they can use their funds to build somewhere else.

I applaud them for that decision.

[edit on 17-8-2010 by Wildbob77]

Originally posted by tsurfer2000h
Does anybody know when they plan on opening this cultural center? Now this is what probably upsets people. They plan on opening this place on 09/11/2011.

This is one of the many false rumors that has been spread about this issue.

It is not scheduled to open on 9/11/11. It will not even be constructed before 2012.

The simple escalation of this in the media by FOX exemplifies the sheer level of Ignorance of the American People.

This episode and the subsequent hysteria of the matter as well as level of "panties in a wad" pretty much sums it all up !

One would have thought that Al Qaida themselves were planning on building the thing , Right on top of the WTC site AND adorning it with Al Qaida colors and Flags !



But the unfortunate reality of all of this is the effectiveness and psychological impact of 9/11 and subsequent hatred by many Americans against a group of people. Solely due to their faith.

Whether they are terrorists or not. In the eyes of many, they're all the same and are undeserving of the same rights as those who are Christians.

This is the Hook, Line and Sinker that I often refer to in the Zionist doctrine of incensing hate amongst Americans, towards their enemies, the Muslims who happen to possess ownership of the middle east Oil wealth.

All in all things haven't really changed that much at all.
People apparently just Love to Hate. And as a poster recently said, They even have every right to do so !

This is the same type of motivation that actually created this country.
For the hatred of the Native American people is what drove the hatred to one bullet by bullet eventually remove the Natives from this land.

So I am not at all surprised by this episode whatsoever.

But I am saddened that we haven't evolved moreso as a group of people.

Especially for a Country that supposedly claims,fosters and promotes Freedom.

For that Freedom was originally intended for ALL. For ALL Americans and not only for a select few.

reply to post by tsurfer2000h


So far as I'm aware, that date is an internet fantasy. With little to no validity.

reply to post by ImaginaryReality1984


You may want to check again because this will be a cultural center and mosque. In fact here is a litle something from NPR about this center.

July 15, 2010

A proposed Islamic cultural center and mosque two blocks from the site of the destroyed World Trade Center has become a flash point of controversy.
The plan for Cordoba House has been in the works for a number of years.

You can check it out for yourself by looking here.


www.npr.org...

So, there is going to be a mosque at the site also.

[edit on 17-8-2010 by tsurfer2000h]

reply to post by americandingbat

It's becoming clearer and clearer why the polls numbers might be so skewed, eh?

When confronted with this fallacy, someone replied, "Oh well then it's the groundbreaking date."

It's neither. Never was. It can be sourced to a NY Post "reporter" who basically pulled it out of...well you know where.

There's a whole bunch of background information about this project in the Deconstructing Disinformation forum, in this thread.

[edit on 8/17/2010 by ~Lucidity]

Okay now this is funny. A Twitter war between Haaretz (the reporter of this false information) and Park51 (the developer of the land).

Ground Zero Mosque Organizers to Israeli Newspaper: 'Go Back to Publishing Yiddish Fables!'

[edit on 8/17/2010 by ~Lucidity]

Originally posted by tsurfer2000h
reply to post by ImaginaryReality1984

 

You may want to check again because this will be a cultural center and mosque. In fact here is a litle something from NPR about this center.

You might want to read your own article again, it states clearly that those who are against it call it a mosque and those who are for it call it a community centre with two floors for prayer. A mosque as i understand it (and here i admit my limited knowledge of Islam) is a dedicated place of worship. As this centre would include facilities for other activities, like athletics, it seems at odds with the description of a mosque.

Even so who cares? I'll never understand why people are upset about these, they need to move on. If people manage to stop this then all they will do is make a statement that Muslims are a special case when it comes to the law. That a single religion is not allowed to do something where all the others can.

This will fostor more hatred on the Muslim side.

reply to post by ~Lucidity


I get the impression that you think I am some kind of McVeigh supporter. I don't agree with any of the # he was involved in.

My original point was, that he was not killing in the name of Jesus or Christianity.

He was killing to 'try' to bring about some kind of warped ideology, attached to Christianity. Much like previous nut jobs before him. And he didn't agree with the governments actions at Waco.

That's about the only thing I agree with him on.

I't could have been handled better.

[edit on 17-8-2010 by Darkrunner]

reply to post by Darkrunner

No. I didn't get that impression at all, and I hope my post didn't reflect anything of the sort. I had just never thought about his connection to the Christian fringe, if that even exists, until his name started cropping up again constantly in these discussions. I was merely asking you, since you seem familiar with it, if there is a connection with him and that fringe.I'm sure it's probably been discussed in ATS before though, so I can look. Just thought you might know offhand. Really off topic anyhow.

reply to post by ~Lucidity


No worries. He was a lost individual.

As I said before the only thing I agree with him on is the fact that Waco went wrong.

Koresh was another Jim Jones. No doubt about it. But the way that went down makes me think it could have been handled a little better..

Originally posted by SpectreDC
There's a mosque near WTC already; 4 blocks away. And it has been there years before the WTC was even built.

Good, then they don't need another one even closer to ground zero.

Otherwise we must question their intentions, and lack of caring about sensitivities to this issue. After all, they threaten (and carry through, remember Theo Van Gogh) death to people who make cartoons (South Park, Facebook) and throw huge fits to get their way.

They KNOW they are offending people here, but don't care. It's the narcissistic attitude of this death cult who think they are better than everyone else. And so many people bury their heads and pretend it's ok.

Well, it's not ok. This invasion will be resisted.

Originally posted by ModernAcademia
So THIS ISN'T EVEN A MOSQUE TO BEGIN WITH???????

The amount of misinformation is amazing, isn't it? I knew there was a community center planned along with a mosque. I was unaware that it doesn't technically even qualify as a mosque though.

Originally posted by wutone
It makes me laugh that the same people who are "defending" the constitutional rights of muslims to build a mosque on a particular site ( when there are a zillion other places to build a mosque) also support zoning laws and regulations that limit the personal use of private property.

I think we're defending the constitutional rights of Americans who happen to be Muslim. There aren't a zillion other places to build a mosque in NYC to serve an existing community practicing their religion. What's the difference between supporting zoning law and supporting constitutional law?


reply to post by americandingbat

Excellent post!

Originally posted by proteus33

 

well i hope they are right because the bastards who did these attacks did them in the name of islam should not be glorified by putting a islamic temple at ground zero.

Out of curiosity, if I were to create a cult and murder people, in the name of ATS, would you blame ATS as a whole because of my actions?

Originally posted by Soloist

Originally posted by SpectreDC
There's a mosque near WTC already; 4 blocks away. And it has been there years before the WTC was even built.

Good, then they don't need another one even closer to ground zero.

Otherwise we must question their intentions, and lack of caring about sensitivities to this issue.

So it appears you didn't know one already existed but the thought of a second one creates fear even though you didn't fear the unknown one? They've wanted one for some time as the current one isn't a sufficient size for their congregation. They purchased a long term vacant building in the same neighborhood. Their intention appears to be a larger building with a community center and a place for prayer.




And I'm still looking for an unanswered question. If a few block is too close for comfort, how far away is acceptable? 10 blocks? 20 blocks? A mile? Outside Manhattan? Outside NYC? Outside New York? How far?

[edit on 8/17/2010 by Three_moons]

Originally posted by ModernAcademia
Olbermann is an idiot
But thoughts on this:

Thoughts?

So THIS ISN'T EVEN A MOSQUE TO BEGIN WITH???????

I thought everyone knew that...

The whole building wasn't a mosque. ONLY ONE FLOOR OF THE BUILDING WAS GOING TO BE A MOSQUE.

The whole building was thirteen floors, but one floor was a mosque.

So, let me ask... How much of ATS didn't know that? Hmm? How many actually thought this was a thirteen floor Mosque?

Originally posted by Three_moons
Out of curiosity, if I were to create a cult and murder people, in the name of ATS, would you blame ATS as a whole because of my actions?

If it were just you, no. If it were tens of thousand of ATS members, killing over 50,000+ people in less than a decade... then yes.

So it appears you didn't know one already existed but the thought of a second one creates fear even though you didn't fear the unknown one?

Wrong.

Their intention appears to be a larger building with a community center and a place for prayer.

"Appears to be" is what the problem is.

how far away is acceptable? 10 blocks? 20 blocks? A mile? Outside Manhattan? Outside NYC? Outside New York? How far?

Off the face of the Earth should do just fine.

I'm amazed in this day & age that this type of bigotry is flying around, in America, no less. It should'nt be tolerated anymore. Our world is too small to allow this bigotry and hatefulness.

Our fore-fathers came to this country to escape religious persecution & now we're denying Muslims that same right. Our country was founded on freedom, freedom of religion in particular, or is it just the religions you agree with? Don't bitch when it's your freedoms that are being infringed upon & dont bother singing the National Anthem. You know, that part that says...'and the land of the free...'bcuz you'll be a dirty hypocrite.

The community center will be built 2 block from ground zero, not on it. That's what it is too, a community center, not a mosque. It will offer a performing arts center, after school programs and cooking classes...oooh, how evil to give back to the community, the community who so obviously hates them

9/11 was horrific, it's forever burned in our minds, our souls, but nothing can change that. What can be changed is the mindset on this matter. American Muslims died that day as well.

Are you going to hold hold all Muslims responsible for wrongdoings of a few? Just bcuz they have the religion? You plan to penalize them all, right, guilt by association.How utterly ridiculous, bigotry at it's finest. Shame on you for fanning the flames of hate. The real terrorist are fear, bigotry and hate my ats friends.

Kim

.

Originally posted by Demetre
Are you going to hold hold all Muslims responsible for wrongdoings of a few? Just bcuz they have the religion? You plan to penalize them all, right, guilt by association.

How about guilt by inaction? Where is the outrage from Muslims towards the mass killings around the world BY Muslims?? We are not talking about just a "few" here.

Maybe, just maybe if they own up to their own mess and clean it up, and somehow magically become a "peaceful" religion, then perhaps the world will trust them.

Until then they have no place trying to infiltrate and corrupt a civilized society. We will not allow it, not everyone is completely blind to their demands and underlying motives.

reply to post by Soloist



Paranoid much? What would you have them do? Please enlighten us. True Muslims speak out against terrorism of all kinds. True Muslims carry out the command of The profit Muhammed's promise to Christians. Why dont you stop all the molestors, rapists or murderers? Why? because you cant control what others do, it'd be idiotic to think different. The fact that you call Muslims uncivilized shows that you hate just bcuz you can. You dont know any Muslims do you? You dont care to either, I'm sure., because your a bigot. It'll eventually eat you from the inside out and what then? You will die a bitter hateful old man/woman who's closed themselves off to some of the most wonderful people you may ever know. We cant learn or experience everything there is on our own, we should rely on others to share their knowledge. There's not a person on the face of this Earth that you can not learn from, it's your choice to participate or not. For instance, I'm learning from you that we're far from where we're truely meant to be. You also remind me that with every passing generation diversity is becoming more accepted, even embraced. That within time, ppl like you will eventually be bred out and humanity will love regardless of race, religion or sexual preference. Thank you for the lesson.

Kim

www.islamicity.com...
www.unc.edu...
www.unc.edu...
www.theamericanmuslim.org...
Bismillah Ar-Rahman Ar-Rahim (In the name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful):


This is a message from Muhammad, ibn Abdullah, as a Covenant to those who adopt Christianity, near and far;


We are with them.


Verily;

I, the Servants, the Helpers, and my followers defend them because Christians are my citizens, and by Allah, I hold out against anything that displeases them.

No compulsion is to be on them.

Neither are their judges to be removed from their offices, nor their monks from their monasteries.

No one is to destroy a house of their religion or to damage it, or to carry anything from it to the Muslims' houses. Should anyone take any of these, he would despoil God's Covenant and disobey His Prophet.


Verily, they are my allies and have my secure Charter against all that displeases them.


No one is to force them to travel or to oblige them to fight. Muslims are to fight for them.


If a female Christian is married to a Muslim man, it is not to take place without her approval. She is not to be prevented from visiting her own church to pray.


Their churches are to be respected. They are neither to be prevented from repairing them nor (maintaining) their sacredness.


No one of the Ummah (community of Islam) is to disobey this covenant until the Last Day (Judgement Day).


Muhammad, ibn Abdullah (his mark)

____________

reply to post by Soloist


...besides my bigoted friend....


wonkette.com...

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