The war with self! Please read.

Originally posted by chiponbothshoulders
Changing is an interesting concept,to change into what is the real question.

I can understand righteousness,but everything is relative.

The truth to you may not be the truth to me.

There is only complete selflessness in death.

We only surrender ourselves completely in death,we spend our entire lives trying to find balance,while causing the opposite.

A Conundrum,paradox?...................................

Balance will be struck regardless of how hard we try to achieve it,or destroy it.

Just enjoy the ride.

Yes everything is relative but only to the duel nature of you as a person.
What happens in the external world is viewed and then placed. Where it is placed is down to the individual but none the less it falls into the spectrum between light and dark.

A child losing his limb in war would be looked at by most of the world and sadness or anger may begin. Those that are doing the killing may look on this as a profit, a means of expenditure. So yes you are correct it is all relative. Standing from the god perspective this would be deemed wrong or bad. Standing from the perspective of the ego or the system it could be construed as a means to an end with no room for compassion or regret.

So then we must discern for ourselves that which is good and that which is not good.

This is where consciousness plays its part.

A child at first may not be conscious that a fire burns. The child then puts his hand to the flame and from then on knows not to do this anymore. I wouldn’t say this is common sense but more instinctive within us.

So our instincts are telling us there is a problem with the world or an inner problem within us which the consciousness tries to address.

Yes balance is needed, co-existence up to a point.

I honestly do not know if we as humanity are able to co-exist with a cancerous tumour? Perhaps we need to cure this cancer first and then look at balance. Or realise there is no cancer thus balance is restored.
In doing this we only address the individual. I would like for the world to address this together.

So do we just not interact with anything society offers or is there an alternative?


[edit on 5-7-2010 by Spirit777]

Originally posted by polarwarrior

By resolving the external you have to be stronger than the system is.
No easy feat for any one person let alone armies.

Yeah and also if the external is resolved without the internal then in time, the internal problems if they still remain will again manifest into the external world and we would just be back at square one again. Humans have been trying temporarily successfully or unsuccessfully for eons to make the world a better place by removing the tyrant oppressor or enemy from the world, but I think now its time we take a good hard look at ourselves.

Very much so. My question to myself at this present moment in time is how do i do that by internalising or do i just let go and if so how?

reply to post by Spirit777

I find a lot in your list "System/Devil/Ego" relating to Bible passages...... so how does one differentiate between the two?

Unless ofcourse, Government and Religion is the same thing

Your categoric presumptions are really boggling.

If humanity needs to improve its mind,

Honey, you need to do some work girl.

First & foremost chaos is essential for healthy life.

The alternative is sterilized death.

humanity seems hopeless

[Just a side note i am quite sure there is relatively uniform (bounded? conceptually bounded?) chaos as well as non-uniform chaos. Most chaos needs containment (which can be asymmetric) to keep it relatively sustained.]

Originally posted by Village Idiot
reply to post by Spirit777

 

I find a lot in your list "System/Devil/Ego" relating to Bible passages...... so how does one differentiate between the two?

Unless ofcourse, Government and Religion is the same thing

You can choose to view it as either.

My take is that it is both. The system has been put there by someone or something. The bible tells pretty much the same story as the torah and koran and many ancient scriptures pre religion. It is the same story of yin and yang, good and evil or God and the devil.

The reason i refer to the bible more so is that its story is telling.

God makes angel, god then makes man, angel feels unloved and rebels. angel is cast to earth, angel uses his sytem to lead man away from god proving to god that man is not worthy.

Two possible outcome follow:

Man awakens and becomes godlike, living on parradise on earth or man does not awaken the system collapses into chaos and anarchy and the system begings to rebuild.

That is why i refer to the bible.

The truth is we are not dealing in ideals but energies. You can associate any name to that energy, be it god, nature, love, devil, destruction, evil.

Originally posted by slank
Your categoric presumptions are really boggling.

If humanity needs to improve its mind,

Honey, you need to do some work girl.

First & foremost chaos is essential for healthy life.

The alternative is sterilized death.

humanity seems hopeless

[Just a side note i am quite sure there is relatively uniform (bounded? conceptually bounded?) chaos as well as non-uniform chaos. Most chaos needs containment (which can be asymmetric) to keep it relatively sustained.]

We have the power in us to create chaos and discord or the power to create harmony and balance. Removing chaos from everyday life will not result in sterilized death at least i don't believe this. Instead i choose to believe that without chaos in the world peace will manifest in place of it.

Humanity are far from hopeless they are only sleeping.

Water is chaotic,
Air is chaotic.
For all we know space &/or time are/require chaos.

You have some plastic idiocy view of how the world is supposed to work.

Let's see, 'rebellion' is bad?
What if you are enslaved under the 'Devil' you mention,

wouldn't rebellion be supposed to be good under that circumstance?

Your candyland simpletism is just stupid,

and worse,

it is Dangerous.

God preserve us from all the high minded stupid people.

You expect everyone to be subordinate & compliant.

To me it makes vastly more sense to make integrity & evaluation & sometimes action distributed which makes it more robust & preservable.
The thing stands from all parts, dependent on none.

You want some toxic centralized dictation.

It is all this juvenile icky sticky nonsense.

I think cool, logical, efficiency is so much more real & effective.

Nice, sweet, agreeable fascism is still fascism & still has all the inherent LOGIC flaws of unsustainable fascism.

Aren't most religions just sugar coated fascism?

Originally posted by slank
Water is chaotic,
Air is chaotic.
For all we know space &/or time are/require chaos.

You have some plastic idiocy view of how the world is supposed to work.

Let's see, 'rebellion' is bad?
What if you are enslaved under the 'Devil' you mention,

wouldn't rebellion be supposed to be good under that circumstance?

Your candyland simpletism is just stupid,

and worse,

it is Dangerous.

God preserve us from all the high minded stupid people.

You expect everyone to be subordinate & compliant.

To me it makes vastly more sense to make integrity & evaluation & sometimes action distributed which makes it more robust & preservable.
The thing stands from all parts, dependent on none.

You want some toxic centralized dictation.

It is all this juvenile icky sticky nonsense.

I think cool, logical, efficiency is so much more real & effective.

Nice, sweet, agreeable fascism is still fascism & still has all the inherent LOGIC flaws of unsustainable fascism.

I can understand your frustration. It looks as though what i am offering is my own ideals for a new world however you couldnt be further from the truth. I hope to help people just like you rise up out of the system you describe. The only way to do this truely is realise none of it is really there. Just chose to live inside a reality where those things hold no effect over you. You can project your anger on to me it is ok because i do understand your frustrations. We can fight, exchage heated words and see who wins the argument but then what are we left with, inflated egos, the liking of wounds? I prefer finding a common ground that serves all parties. There is always a universal solution to mans dillemas we are after all universal beings.

Originally posted by slank
Aren't most religions just sugar coated fascism?

I believe the two are seperate athough i can see why someone would join the two.

reply to post by slank



I have to say that I totally disagree with your viewpoint.

If the path you have chosen during your time here has led you to stay firmly planted in the physical plane around you then that is your choice. I will refrain from calling you stupid or dangerous.

If people took a step back from this physical plane more often they might see how close we are to wiping humanity off the planet.


Water is.

Air is.



peace.

Seems to me that you're describing virtues. You're describing an ideal human being. These may be the goals we should be heading to. But - I don't know if being "work orientated" is a virtue, slaving at work, or being a workaholic. I guess it's OK if you're really interested in what you do.

I'm lazy and bad at setting goals. It takes me helluva lot of energy to get my # in order. Lots of good stuff there, and I hope you'll able to live by your virtues (and not letting the surrounding atmosphere get you down).

Originally posted by Tryptych
Seems to me that you're describing virtues. You're describing an ideal human being. These may be the goals we should be heading to. But - I don't know if being "work orientated" is a virtue, slaving at work, or being a workaholic. I guess it's OK if you're really interested in what you do.

I'm lazy and bad at setting goals. It takes me helluva lot of energy to get my # in order. Lots of good stuff there, and I hope you'll able to live by your virtues (and not letting the surrounding atmosphere get you down).

Indeed. When i say work orientated what i mean is being able to get active around areas that need activity but only in the sense that it directly sustains life. Working an office job is the most robotic demoralising thing you can do to your self. Your body and mind are subjegated into a system of conditioning whereby you no longer act in concordance with nature but with the system itself. Something i do not promote. I understand that people need to work to sustain their lives indirectly ie producing money to by food and shelter however this is still existing within and from the system. We honestly must go back to living with the earth. Walking barefoot on the grass, migrating from land to land with the changes in season, feeling and being intune to mother nature and communicating with it. When you have a personal realationship with nature it will provide for you. On wednesday last week after working two years in my post i got up and walked out. I no longer wanted to be part of a system. Now i am on state benefits until i can find a solution to sustaining my own life. This may involve relocating to an area which has the properties to sustain me and setting up my life there.