Conspiracies and women

Personally I feel most weman are faith driven and more religious. These people deep down feel ignorance is bliss and rather beleave in somthing that is fake just because they are spoon fed it. All in all they make better suckers... no pun intended.

Originally posted by SheeplFlavoredAgain
I think the board just ate my post. I typed a whole response and went to add one last sentence and the whole text just vanished out of the box. Great. I didn't have much spare time today to post and now to have to retype makes me want to slam my head on the desk.

That's happened to me a few times in my days. If you don't mind, let me offer you a tip.

Next time you think you might be writing something long, open up a text editor (like Notepad if you use Windows), save a text file to your desktop, then type up your post in there. Save frequently.

Then when you're ready to go, copy and paste, post, and delete the file from your desktop.

Generally, trusting the browser (which doesn't let you save your work and can be affected by all sorts of things including its own bugs or sloppy coding of website's scripts or what-have-you), to not take your masterpiece and tear it to pieces and swallow the pieces, is a bad idea.


[edit on 6-7-2010 by NewlyAwakened]

Originally posted by MarlboroRedCowgirl
Woman are conditioned and brainwashed from an earlier age than most men, so they are the gender that is usually deeper in the stupor. As a little girl I did everything possible to rebel against the media of images of little girls: I wore skate shoes and t-shirts, skated, surfed and fought just like a little boy. Woman are STILL conditioned to be bare-foot and pregnant.

I hope that I'm not considered to be spamming the thread replying to you immediately after making my other post.

But something just happened as I was typing my previous post, and reading yours, that made me think of something else to contribute to the discussion.

I am a bit like you. I was quite the tomboy as a child. I'm now a girly-ish mother and housewife, having done what I wanted to do in the wider world and finding even a tomboy can enjoy this role very much. But still in my heart of hearts I value individuality and resent society pushing anyone to conform into anything and remember how I hated having my grandparents endlessly foist dolls off on me. Finally my grandpa "got" who I was and gave me soldering set that I still have and treasure 30 years later.

While I was typing my last post, my 6 year old daughter walked in and asked what I was typing about. I told her about what was going on in this thread. I told her how some people were saying that girls who are very interested in fashion and girly things seem not to place importance on other things that are going on in the world. My daughter is a very feminine girly girl. She's into princess everything and color coordinates her clothes and has worn jewelry since she was 4. She has little interest in playing with boys and prefers to nurture and feed her dolls and stuffed animals. My inner tomboy sometimes cringes at how neatly she fits the feminine stereotype, but I have to accept that this is who she is and that there can be incredible strength in it if I figure out how to properly nurture her nature.

Still, my husband and I do what we can to keep her open to an interest in engineering and math and science and all the subjects that traditionally have seemed more oriented to boys. We try to do so in a way that fits in with her personality, because I don't want to kill the princess any more than I wanted my past tomboy killed because of what other people thought I should be. I used to be in marketing and have taught her how ad campaigns target the different genders and can contribute to perpetuating gender stereotypes. For instance, ads for microscopes and electronics kits usually depict boys and the colors are more masculine. Toy high heels, cosmetics and kitchenware are marketed toward girls. (Bless my nephew for speaking up loudly at age 7 that boys can like kitchen sets, too!) I encourage her to embrace her feminine side but also cast her interests far and wide and to be aware of external influences on her thought. I told her she is free to be what she wants to be, but to be sure that she is true to herself and not what the "Jedi mind tricks" of advertising and pop culture tell her she is so they can sell more junk to her.

I think it's paid off. Because you know what the little princess who loves pink tutus and fussing over doll hairstyles said to me? "Mommy, you tell them we ARE interested in the world. Tell them I know all about all the fishes and turtles dying in the oil spill and I am going to see if any creatures got sick when I go to the beach next time. Tell them I know all about bad chemicals and when I grow up I am not putting that stuff on my lawn and kill nature."

I think we can let girls be girls and boys be boys and still steer them toward the important issues that impact us all.

Originally posted by robbinsj
Personally I feel most weman are faith driven and more religious. These people deep down feel ignorance is bliss and rather beleave in somthing that is fake just because they are spoon fed it. All in all they make better suckers... no pun intended.

Oh my. Oh my.

Okay, for starters I'm a Christian and I am attempting to live by my faith. I believe in Jesus as my personal savior. I respect that other people have their own faiths and choose other paths. I judge nobody but myself. I'm also, as stated previously, a woman.

I just can't get with the ignorance is bliss part. It's actually my faith that drives my curiosity about the world around me. I do question aspects of my own religion. I feel so much of our shared human history has been hidden from us. I believe there are conspiracies that keep the truths of ancient civilizations from us. My Christian faith also fuels my desire to learn about religious conspiracies because I have experienced some "odd" experiences in life that very traditional forms of my religion dismiss or cover up entirely. So I am intensely interested in the Conspiracies in Religion topics. Yet I retain the very basic tenets of my Christian faith. I hope that makes sense. This aspect of my interests and personality is difficult for me to articulate.

Being a woman definitely fuels a large part of my interest in the more politically tinged conspiracies. I'm a mother and very concerned about the poisons and toxins children are being exposed to. As primary caretaker to elder family members I'm alarmed at what I'm observing in autoimmune disease and cancer that did not crop up in previous generations of my family or my husband's. My eye is on the corporations for this reason. My eye is on the goverment for this reason. My eye is on the Codex for this reason. My eye is on globalization for this reason. And so on and so forth.

I'm not arguing with your position, per se. I just think that there is a very valid flip side and that faith and femininity can be powerful catalysts to drive a continuing interest in conspiracies.

reply to post by SheeplFlavoredAgain


Wow, you type a lot! Not saying it's bad, I'm thankful to read what you have to say. I very much value your opinions and ideas, even if I disagree with some of them.
Now I'm going to type a lot.

Originally posted by SheeplFlavoredAgain
It's easy to say rise above it or ignore it. But I try to read all the posts in a thread to make sure I'm not missing a gem of wisdom.

Fair enough, if a thread is more than a few pages long I usually still skim read all the posts for the same reason and to ensure I don't add something that has already been added and also to make sure I don't comment with a lack of information. So I certainly don't hold that against you, I think it's a good thing.

Originally posted by SheeplFlavoredAgain
Also, when it's your own specific group you feel is under fire and being hit with generalizations and boxed in, it's not just that easy to "rise above it" and let it all pass without comment.

Ok, fair enough. I can see how a person might feel that way. I believe there was value in our exchanges, for us and other participants.

Now I understand your intentions. And I understand what you saw in the direction the discussion was going. I'm glad we can now get it on the right track.

I agree that while generalisations are useful, expectations are not. I think that's a point that is specifically important for everyone to be clear on and I believe it's a point every one can agree on once it's been brought to the foreground.

Originally posted by SheeplFlavoredAgain
Everything seems to be coming to some sort of head at this point and even generally preoccupied people seem aware things seem purposely mismanaged to herd us into a drastic change from the existence we have known.

Yes, I've definitely seen some evidence of a general acceptance of acknowledgement. I actually think that's were the hope for our future lays. I believe the people of the developed world are evolving mentally and deeper. I hold to the belief that we are all connected somehow and we are literally a part of each other. That's another topic for another thread.

I find it interesting and maybe a little revealing to the topic of this thread that you talk more freely about things like conspiracies when you have the "relative anonymity of the internet" or when you active in your community or when you feel you're in safe, well familiar company. Do you suppose that many females who do have an interest in things like conspiracies behave in a similar way?
I think my wife may be a bit like this in that she might seem to some to be interested only with where she is and what she is doing and what she needs to do next more than what's going on around the world, but she only seems that way to most people and I and others close to her know her mind is both where she is and also what's going on in the world. And it affects where she shops, what she buys, what she allows our kids to be exposed to and lots of other little things. She has as much info about conspiracies and corruption around the world as I do, and she isn't getting it from the mainstream. I don't really know what she's looking at and chatting about on the Internet from looking over her shoulder because it's all in Japanese. I can speak that language OK(ish), but my 4 year old daughter easily out does me when it comes to reading and writing it.

A princess your little girl may be. But if she said she knows about the gulf spill and the consequences and she's thinking about how she might act if faced with those consequences, then she's showing she's not just interested in who Barbie's currently going out with (if she she is at all, I just pulled that out of the air as an example). So maybe, as parents, we need to harness that tendency in many or most girls towards broader thinking before the corporations and TPTB do.
I seen some things to suggest there are many, many woman who are concerned and vocal over things while their efforts seem counter productive towards lasting freedom and bettering the future, you know, very non-conspiracy very pro-officialdom in their motivation. What I'm getting at is maybe what the OP noticed is woman who have had their powers of conspiracy like thinking (for lack of a better term) harnessed and directed from a young age towards things that don't gel with conspiracies.
But of course, as you say, are not males just as easily directed in their development?
Maybe males have less tendency to think about broader things when they are young and so would be less affected by such an effort, thus when older they are less bound by that. I say that because I can imagine young boys getting distracted by flashy gizmo like stuff in their hands and in their imagination and not staying focussed on national, global, societal issues as much as young girls. Has anyone had experience with young children that might deny or confirm that?

You used to be in marketing and know how add campaigns target the different genders? Well, what insight does that give you on this subject? I would guess your more qualified on the subject of this thread than most here.

Originally posted by SheeplFlavoredAgain
I think we can let girls be girls and boys be boys and still steer them toward the important issues that impact us all.

Perhaps that's all there is to this. Maybe we just need to do some well thought out steering. Not half hearted, but a real effort to guide the powers of thought our children of both genders have. Is that it? What do you and others have to say about that?
I went through a Steiner school, right through, so I understand the need to let children be with children in a child's world and then help them build that world as they grow through their first several years of life so they can go through that child stage properly. But that world is now so polluted with corporate junk and agenda driven infiltration that perhaps we need to taint that child's world a little bit with our adult concerns to ensure they stay the owners and drivers of their own minds.

What's all 'des wo-men doin' in dis here thread? Wheres my Samick!?

Nobody dun makin me dinner!!!!? Dis here is men's only territory. We get little fuzzy hats and talk about our secrets wit won-nuther.

Now scram missies!

I had just the same thought as the OP, but have been so busy these last few days doing a full time job (which includes IT), caring for a disabled daughter, cooking the dinner, keeping my website up to date etc, I didn't get around to it. And I just burnt the onions because I was too busy reading this thread. And I have got so engrossed in it, I am missing my favourite reality show.

Have to agree with posters with androgynous names like mine - people always think I am male (I am 58 yr old female). I find it mildly amusing and I have never really thought of myself as anything other than HUMAN.

There's plenty of evidence out there about the difference between men and women - just googling it, and I found

homestar.org...

and

www.baainc.com...

But then there are plenty of differences between cultures, generations, and of course the genetic makeup we were all born with.

As to why there are more men than women on ATS - and I don't doubt there are - it is an interesting question. Short of doing a personality test on everyone I am not sure there is an answer.

I have to agree with you, i find women to be much less interested in these subjects and thats a shame hehe

Ive been in the world of conspiracies for a number of years now, and i am never shy of speaking about these things to people, men and women.

Most women i know kinda brush it off, not really agreeing, just listening to be polite i figure. The usual reply is :

"Well you know, life is too beautiful to think about these crazy things"... or something along those lines...

But then again, just based on the people around me, men dismiss and shrug off just as much lol. People in general are concentrated on their personal daily lives and nothing more really... sucking on a "blue pill" milkshake.

Sorry i know this doesnt really give an answer as to why there are more men that women in this field... maybe this conspiracy world stuff stimulates the part of our brain that likes hunting/gathering... but not for food.. for information!

Peace.

Originally posted by ReAlIzAtIoN
reply to post by HarmonicNights

 

That's exactly what I've noticed as well, why do you think this is so? Why aren't women interested in regarding the world in general?

Of course, I'm not implying that all women are the same, but majority that I've noticed seem to be a bit lethargic towards the world events/conspiracies.

Western/urban women want fantasy and security as long as it doesnt interfere with leisure activities. Unpleasant reality is not appreciated at all, if anyone offers any better ie easier alternative they go for it. While they are competitive creatures, they compete primarily against other women for whatever seems important at the moment. Women by and large are liberal with their desires and goals and conservative with what they contribute, assuming that in any event they can just lie down any buy their way out with favors. They tend to judge men by the degree men play their game and are willing to pretend everything will be just fine
Few are even willing to contemplate survival beyond more than a temporary inconvenience.
Yeah, I'll be assailed as an evil evil mysogynist, but thems the facks jack for the majority. IN MY EXPERIENCE, WHEN IT HITS THE FAN, THEY FOLD and start bargaining with whichever male is in the power position at the moment and accept anything if the(ir) children are rendered 'safe'. It's just what I've seen is all. Children are the priority, not exactly the initial male of the group. Often one guy in charge is as good as another and stockholm syndrome kicks in early..
Sorry for an honest appraisal, I'm sure that all the ultra rad sarah connors will chime in on how wrong I am.

reply to post by Recouper


About marketing manipulation, I don't even know where to begin. That's a full topic unto itself. To start with--the best marketing ideally comes from the customer--you assess the needs, build or obtain the product the customer wants and in that way the product sells itself. Marketing is simply then just efficiently distributing the information that the product is available --"It's here, it's what you wanted, come and get it!" When you think of how intrusive commerce is these days with everyone wanting our data, you would think that we'd be the most satisfied consumers in the world.

Look around though--does it really work that way? What's going on instead? We find that we are filling our lives with crap that doesn't work right, doesn't really do anything for us, isn't the quality we asked for, or is downright harmful. We can blame ourselves and in fact partly should. But we are all faced with a very focused, determined, resource-rich industry that now revolves around MAKING the customers think they want or need what the industry DECIDES they damn well better want or need.

Look at the interconnected webs of pop culture--music, movies, games all with tie ins to one another and product placement. Even if no products are specifically being placed IDEAS are being placed to create the customer who will want the things to be sold. It's now about creating the customer for the product, not the other way around. If there aren't enough vapid ho's to buy $500 spiked heel shoes that deform women's feet if worn longer than ten minutes, make sure you create them. If there aren't enough boys or grown men hooked on video games when they should be studying or engaged with their peers, create them.

Look at the de-evolution of the music industry over the years. It has largely ceased to be a reflection of the desires and artistry of genuinely gifted people and instead has become a very formulaic hard sell of canned imagery. (And have you taken a look at the imagery being sold?)

Why is that? What is the agenda? It's not hard to figure out. Look at the objectification of women in movies, music, fashion. In its extreme forms, often seen in the very lucrative horror film industry, women are just a collection of sexual organs to be violently brutalized. Look at the depiction of men. They are being encouraged to be buffoons (explaining the ridiculous fad of boys hitting each other so hard in the nuts that they need castration), violent predators, or conversely, ineffective jerks who don't seem to know their own minds.

Now more than ever, more than even in the pre-women's lib days, the marketing, the pop culture is filled with elements that not just magnify the differences between men and women but actually pit us AGAINST each other! To see how effective this has been check out some of the derogatory sentiments against women here on this very topic. Think of the endless male bashing in society at large. New blogs are heavy with gender bashing.

Of course any attempt to censor this kind of exploitation of both sexes is usually met with "Parents need to be parents and censor their $%* kids and not infringe on MY right to see what I want." And that's not a bad point. Unfortunately once all this stuff is EVERYWHERE, it brings everything down to an increasingly lower common denominator that demands to be catered to above all others.

I have again overspoken, oversimplified and perhaps gone off topic. The heart of the matter is we are ALL being dumbed down.

BTW, as I peruse ATS, I see loads of women here. What about the huge stands against strong adversaries being taken by women like Kindra Arnesen. Omer Goldman. Cindy MacDonald to name but a few. Gee, what does a gal have to do to get recognized around here?

I am noticing something a little unfair in this.
Somebody further back in this thread said that they aren't talking about the women in the ATS message board.

Wouldn't the same apply to the men outside the board? Isn't that where the term Awakened and and Un-Awakened (sheeple) come from? Isn't the whole purpose to try to 'awaken' the masses to different conpiracies?
Considering how many men vs women there are in the military where they blindly follow what most of this board considers to be the evil conspirators- doesn't that say something about men? Seems this topic could be turned around if need be, but it seems that the women here dont feel the need to vent frustrations via bashing on the men in their lives on an online (where the rules are 'lolz there are no girlz on the intranets') website.

Another point I would like to make that was being made before is about the type of females the males here slagging on them surround themselves with. I imagine most (most not all) of you wouldn't even bother with so much of a friendship with a female if they weren't the oh so pretty-pretty girly-girl portrayed as being the only type of female worth bothering with.
My question to you is - What did you expect from somebody that makes themselves look this way?

reply to post by mordant1


You just described why women tend to survive where others do not. And you did it as if it is a bad thing.

Survival of the fittest. You don't like it, breed out.

Originally posted by Aeons
reply to post by mordant1

 

You just described why women tend to survive where others do not. And you did it as if it is a bad thing.

Survival of the fittest. You don't like it, breed out.

Women survive crisis, tis true, but only at service of men who lust for them, and in return women tend to give up what they were and convert to what they are expected to as part of the evident social contract. There is no society conceived (ha) and built and run by women. Cant do it, dont want to do it, why bother when men do it on spec? WOmen function to divert the efforts of men and exchange 'access' and procreation.
Does that mean anything else of significance? Yes, the DNA may survive to some degree, but the history and culture of the previous man, culture and life disappear if a woman accepts cultural concubineship and submission to the new boss. Personally, any woman I'd defend unto the death must understand that with the privilege come responsibilities. For the western gals out there, perhaps they may benefit from a refresher as to the meaning and intent of 'responsibilities' as for the most part I see no evidence that most understand the word anymore as it applies to themselves.

reply to post by jean59


My point was .......

(1) I was very precise in my wording. I said VOTE.

(2) I am a Man but know about Woman's issues better than you. Why is that ?


Indeed the suffrage Woman would roll over in their graves if they saw the frivolous and brainless bunch they left their legacy to.

reply to post by SheeplFlavoredAgain


What a solemn picture.

So the customer is created. That's pretty creepy. And you know, I'm starting to think that what the OP noticed is largely just a symptom of marketing in media.
I've been thinking about it over the weekend and I now actually suspect that marketing and mass media in general is a little more focussed on females. But I also think that's starting to change, and the commercial exploitation of the two genders is quickly becoming more balanced as time goes on.

Originally posted by SheeplFlavoredAgain
Gee, what does a gal have to do to get recognized around here?

There are a lot of wonderful girls on ATS. The biggest thread I ever read (every post, all of it) was authored by theRiverGoddess. You should check it out... if you have a month or two spare: www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by MarlboroRedCowgirl
Woman are conditioned and brainwashed from an earlier age than most men, so they are the gender that is usually deeper in the stupor. As a little girl I did everything possible to rebel against the media of images of little girls: I wore skate shoes and t-shirts, skated, surfed and fought just like a little boy. Woman are STILL conditioned to be bare-foot and pregnant.

If you think that the images of little girls in the media are "stereotypical", then so are the images of little boys. Stereotypes exist for a reason. You say you "fought like a little boy"....see this is what is so disturbing to me. Feminists are ashamed of femininity and encourage females to be more "boyish" or masculine. You speak of being pregnant like it's a shameful thing. How can anyone be conditioned to be pregnant? Reproduction is a natural process. By feminists being so shameful of and actually discouraging motherhood and femininity, THEY are the ones who are sexist. The role of a mother is the most honorable role a woman can have. Feminists are just insecure and somewhat envious. They think they are a victim just because they are born female and have the reproductive parts to give birth.

Just look at some of the other posts by mothers. For some reason, they don't want their daughters to be feminine. They are angry that their daughters are actually into "girly" things. They want to mold them into a "tomboy" with boyish interests, as if masculine things are superior. Why force typically masculine interests such as math and science onto your daughters? It is YOU who is sexist and has an inferiority complex. A girl's natural femininity and nurturing should be embraced, not looked down upon.

[edit on 11-7-2010 by HarmonicNights]

reply to post by HarmonicNights


Good points. I know you weren't specifically replying to me by name but I recognize some elements of my post that you were addressing. Good points indeed. A bit of clarification though on why we are steering our daughter to an interest in math and science. It's not to make her more masculine but because we feel those fields of study are enriching and we don't want her to steer clear of them out of some mistaken idea they are for boys only. It could be an idea she might get when all she sees are boys's photos on the covers of certain products or science kits. That's all.

I only don't like the girly girl thing because I was a tomboy. I don't think there's anything wrong with it, it's just so different from what I valued that I have to readjust my own thinking to see the value in it and accept it's what my daughter is like. I don't think girly girls are inherently inferior to tomboys. It's just that the difference is so foreign to my own personality and what I liked and valued, I have to make an effort to see what's appealing about it.

I do have to acknowledge that radical feminism might have messed with my head a bit. I was a small child in the 1970's. I believe that it was just and good to fight for women's rights and an expanded place in our society. But I think some people with a dark agenda exploited that movement to make women reject the beauty and value of motherhood. As I recall that whole time period was one where both men and women got really into themselves all of a sudden and were like "to hell with anybody but me, me, me." I was a big fan of the show "One Day at A Time" and I remember coming off of that rabidly hating the idea of marriage and children.

Times have changed and I'm happy to be a stay at home mom now and I feel perfectly fulfilled and enriched. The only problem now I have is I'm damned if I do, damned if I don't where men are concerned. Some men seem to think women should be at home raising the kids and are selfish if they don't. Others say stay at home moms are nothing more than parasites and whores (saw comments like this on Newsvine in MSN) and that they would never marry a woman who doesn't have a job. I sympathize with men who get confused about what women want. Some say if they are chivalrous women get mad at them and call them chauvinists, but if they try to just be gender neutral they get blasted for being rude pigs. Again, I think it all goes back to everything is either by intent or by stupid human nature set up to make us all want to fight instead of work together.

So I try not to see "men in general" or "women in general" anymore. I will work very hard to see you, the individual. I don't always succeed but I do try very hard. Sometimes though I get exasperated and slap my forehead and say stuff to myself like "Oh those stupid men!" Sorry about that!

reply to post by SheeplFlavoredAgain


Sorry for the misunderstanding. I'd say I was pretty girly growing up, but also slightly tomboyish. I was always way more interested in literature and history than math and science (probably because I'm not good at those 2 subjects) lol.

I agree that too many people these days are narcissists. I think this has a lot to do with the sky-high divorce rate. I think it's important for a mother to stay at home with their children at least while they are really small. Family should always come before one's career. Raising children is a VERY important role. I don't know why so many people try to undermine it.

Men get confused by what women want because I have heard many feminists scoff at chivalry. Then there are women who like and appreciate it. Feminists should swallow their pride and show some appreciation and respect for courtesy and good manners. Some people just always have to play the victim.

A number of survey studies have shown that females typically score higher than males on measures of supernatural beliefs. In contrast, males tend to favor conspiracies, which are not supernatural. One recent study of more than 1,000 Austrian men and women found a correlation between the ratio of the length of the ring finger to the index finger, which is a marker for the amount of the masculizing hormone testosterone you were exposed to as a fetus: Males with a “higher feminized” digit ratio exhibited stronger paranormal and superstitious beliefs, even when controlled for age, education, adult height and weight, and birth length and weight. Shorter feminized digit ratios in women correlated with more superstitious beliefs, as did a woman’s lighter weight at birth.

link

Whether or not this is scientifically verifiable beyond this experiment... I don't know. However, anecdotal evidence says yes. Even though watching reality tv shows about the paranormal would say men are more involved, my personal experience with folks shows that women are more likely to say they have had some sort of spiritual or supernatural experience; men are more likely to laugh at the suggestion.