ATS the new Terrorist Training Camp!!!

The pieces are coming together, a pattern is beginning to emerge.

It has begun.

Joe Stack and John Bedell are now the new face of terrorism.
Radical Islamic terrorists are stereotypically easy to spot. They generally come from a different culture than most Americans.

This new breed of terrorist though is not so easy to point out or spot. Middle aged, middle class, white, male, 'intelligent(?)'.

Wow, that description is pretty vague huh? It fits a ton of people.

Given the two most recent events, we simply never know who might be the next terrorist, he could be living next to you, he could be going to your church or in line behind you at the grocery store. It will be hard to tell though because he looks just like you.

This is what they want us to believe.

These last two events are doing a great job of creating an environment of paranoia. The new breed of terrorist looks just like you and acts like you, maybe it is you!!!

These events are creating a scenario where they can both be used as examples of how modern terrorists do not fit our previously accepted stereotypes of what a terrorist is supposed to be.

The next terrorist could be anyone, they look just like everyone else, they are hiding in the shadows.

The new stereotype of terrorist now looks like your average white guy.

We saw what happened to American Muslims after 9/11 when we started stereotyping them as terrorists.

This is just what the powers that be are wanting....Now EVERYONE is potentially a terrorist. We must profile everyone. We dont know what they typically look like so we must assume that everyone is a terrorist.

What is the one thing That John and Joe had in common? A 'truthers' sentiment? An anti-government sentiment?

So, from all this, our society is learning that the new terrorists are middle aged, middle class white men and that the new terrorists hold very generic 'truther' sentiments.

Is this the beginning of the 'truthers' witch-hunt?

Everywhere you look in the media it is "conspiracy theorist", "9/11 truther", "anti-government", "conspiracy, conspiracy, conspiracy, truth, truth, truther". "They are crazy", "mentally unstable".

We have known for a long time that the powers that be have been waiting for the perfect opportunity to classify a huge chunk of Americans as terrorists. It is starting to appear as if this is their opportunity and they are taking the ball and running with it.

Watch your words my friends. Now, the next comment you make while riding the public bus might land you in a detention center without your lawyer or any charges.

This is the beginning of the powers that be turning Americans into their own enemies.

Any of you could be a terrorist. Therefore, for the safety of the country we must implement much tighter security, the police state is your friend.

Fellow ATSers: they are turning US into our own enemies. These events will effectively turn US into terrorists. ATS is the biggest online community of 'truthers', you can now assume that the FED's are now considering it to be the largest 'training camp' for these new terrorists.

We are now thought criminals, the new terrorists. It has begun!!!!!!




[edit on 7-3-2010 by Brahmanite]

Considering a large part of membship here is from outside the US, I doubt anything will come of this.

Sure they might try to paint the website as a radical one which is expressing terrorist ideals, primarily domestic I would thing, but there's nothing they could do about it really.

~Keeper

Originally posted by Brahmanite
Is this the beginning of the 'truthers' witch-hunt?.....

........Everywhere you look in the media it is "conspiracy theorist", "9/11 truther", "anti-government", "conspiracy, conspiracy, conspiracy, truth, truth, truther". "They are crazy", "mentally unstable".........

...........It is starting to appear as if this is their opportunity and they are taking the ball and running with it.........

...........We are now thought criminals, the new terrorists. It has begun!!!!!!

did you expect them to put the hands up and say "ah shucks, you caught us, we would have gotten away with it if it wasn't for those pesky kids"?

if the stuff we discuss on ATS is real and if it looks like CT'ers are convincing the sleeping populace to wake up, calling us names like terrorist or nut case is about the best we can expect.

reply to post by tothetenthpower


"Legitimately" or "Justly" doing something about it, you're right, 'they' likely will not. However, in the U.S. governments history, how much can you recall that they have 'legitimately' or 'justly' done things like intelligence gathering?

I could give a bunch of examples of thought crimes that were prosecuted based entirely on things the individual did 'online'.

I would not assume that just because its on the internet it is 'safe' or 'harmless' in the eyes of authorities.

Oppression is not new. This has been going on forever.

The powers that be just seem to be trying to expand and expand our notion of what a terrorist is until it includes EVERYONE.

reply to post by Brahmanite


Yeah I can agree with that.

However, I do think that the more they cover ATS, the more popular it will become, simply because of the ridiculous range of ideologies and news stories that we cover in the run of a day.

People like a place like this, they like the format, they like that nobody is really trying to tell them what to do and there seems to be a real sense of community and responsibility here.

So as far as I concerned it's just free advertising.

~Keeper

In no way am I trying to suggest that these attacks were anything but the work of lone terrorists. I do want to make that clear.

I just feel that it plays very well into 'their' hands to have as many forms of stereotypes or typecast's included in what we think of as what a terrorist is.
These two guys were clearly crazy and irrational and they also may have believed the government lies about things.

All I am trying to say is that the media and other individuals are now trying to associate both of these attacks together and that the major associating factor is a distrust of the government.

'They' are trying to create a 'dangerous trend and potential political movement' out of two separate attacks.

What are the signs of being involved in this movement? well, it appears that the signs of being involved are a belief that the government lies, may have lied about 9/11 and potentially believe some conspiracy theories.

Come on people, how many individuals express some form of those 'symptoms' at some point? Everyone.

All I am trying to say is that the specific sensationalism that the media has been employing is one that creates the perception that ANYONE who has EVER expressed a distrust in the government could and should now be considered a potential terrorist.

The connecting factor between these two attacks is not that these two guys didnt trust their government. The connecting factor is that they were either crazy before hand or finally lost it right before the attack.

We should not be trying to create some connection between these two individuals' supposed 'political philosophies' and thus looking at it as some potential trend.

The only thing that these guys really had in common, the only thing that REALLY connects these two attacks to each other is that they both flipped their lids and went crazy right before hand.

They should not be trying to create some new enemy or new threat out of all this but, thats what it seems they are doing.

[edit on 7-3-2010 by Brahmanite]

Originally posted by tothetenthpower
they like that nobody is really trying to tell them what to do

if only it were true.

i really believe that there is an awfully big wedge of the population that feel utterly lost when confronted with nobody telling them what to do.

the prescribed entertainment offered by television and manufactured pop music, the "rote learning" orientated education system and the highly regulated public interaction offered by malls and entertainment complexes have all combined to create a highly instatutionalised society.

the psychological wrench that free interaction provides will be more than enough to convince many people that ATS and other conspiracy forums are dangerous influences.

[edit on 7/3/10 by pieman]

reply to post by Brahmanite


Good thread. I agree with waht you said. It'sz the media propaganda machine lumping everyone who who denys ignorance into the same crazy basket as those two terrorist. It's really ashame.Hopefully ATS doesn't get shutdown.

Actually, there is nothing to hide or fear. If it is the govt these 2 misguided murderers are after, so be it. Let the media run the story. We are living in a more educated era, to know realities.

Did these 2 murderers succeeded in anything? Nothing, except snuffing out others life. And thats how others see it. As to the agendas they were seeking, do you think others bother? Perhaps a few dissatisfied who may seize the opportunity to throw some stones, but that's about it.

As for categorization, it will be good to be more aware of who these people are, NOT to shun them, but to reach out to them, and help them in anyway we can within our limits. They too, are fellow humans before turning into crazed beasts.

What others are more concern is the realities they face day to day. Questions will always linger, but till substantative evidences are clearer, will the tipping point be reached for mass call of action, such as this financial crisis with calls for solutions, which is more critical today.

Originally posted by tothetenthpower
reply to post by Brahmanite

 

Yeah I can agree with that.

However, I do think that the more they cover ATS, the more popular it will become, simply because of the ridiculous range of ideologies and news stories that we cover in the run of a day.

People like a place like this, they like the format, they like that nobody is really trying to tell them what to do and there seems to be a real sense of community and responsibility here.

So as far as I concerned it's just free advertising.

~Keeper

I have seen online forums quickly go to trash when an overpopulation arrives. Gaining new members would be nice... but not by the thousands. This is one forum I don't want to see trashed.

reply to post by SeekerofTruth101


Logistically? No, neither of these two guys succeeded in anything with these ridiculous attacks. I am sure that it did make them both feel very righteous for themselves. Thats what all the Islamic suicide bombers are all about too. Silly in my book.

What others are more concern is the realities they face day to day. Questions will always linger, but till substantative evidences are clearer, will the tipping point be reached for mass call of action, such as this financial crisis with calls for solutions, which is more critical today.

First, I must say that I am honestly not completely clear about exactly what you are trying to say.

I often ponder this myself: "what will it take for people to wake up and organize together to demand change?"

One might think that this financial crisis would have been a tipping point but it hasnt been yet. There have been a ton of instances throughout history where I have thought "how could the people accept this any longer" but, we always do.... Given all the atrocities that have occurred already and we havent organized; it is going to take some serious suffering....

I feel that thats all besides the point.

These two crazy attackers have nothing to do with some movement of people standing up and demanding change. These guys were crazy before hand or lost it and then attacked.
The very problem is that they are being looked at as part of some movement and not as the lone soloists that they were.

Originally posted by Brahmanite

I feel that thats all besides the point.

These two crazy attackers have nothing to do with some movement of people standing up and demanding change. These guys were crazy before hand or lost it and then attacked.
The very problem is that they are being looked at as part of some movement and not as the lone soloists that they were.

I understand your point. It is perfectly alright for others to presume they are 'part of some movement'. Sadly, they are, even though they are acting alone and not on command by anyone.

It is perfectly ok for movements to be known. They are plenty of other movements around, more so in a democratic state. Freedom is a right but it comes with responsibilities. As there are 'truthers' movements, so too are there 'anti-truthers' movements. And it will be through robust discussions and debates can issues be resolved, with time and patience.

The suthorities and the media should be happy that there is an ATS here, with a large membership, that engages in robust debate and outreach. Many are practically doing their job for them on our own free will and time, efforts which goes unrewarded nor seeked.

Democracy believes in transparency in all issues, has no fear nor seek to hide anything. Only repressive regimes does that. Whoever shuts down one site, another site opens, either in the virtual world or the real world. There can be no way to suppress humanity's voice. Better to confront it , debate about it and find solutions, fearlessly.

That can only be done in democratic states, and US is still a democracy, even though flirted with a shadow capitalist facism that almost caused doom.

"The SHAC7 are 6 activists and a corporation, Stop Huntingdon Animal Cruelty USA Inc., that have been found guilty of multiple federal felonies for their alleged role in simply campaigning to close down the notorious animal testing lab, Huntingdon Life Sciences. Five of the individuals are currently in federal prison (the sixth, Darius Fullmer, has been released, after completing his one year sentence). They are not accused of actually smashing windows, liberating animals or even attending demonstrations, rather reporting on and encouraging others to engage in legal demonstrations and supporting the ideology of direct action."

It has been going on for a long time already. The reason anyone still believes that we have the 'right' to say anything we want without consequence is because the media never reports on what they dont want you to hear...

Dont get fooled in to thinking that you are allowed to say whatever you want. Now, we must keep in mind that if you publicly question the government or suggest that they might lie or anything like that, you will be grouped right in together with the two guys that carried these attacks out.

This is an information war, a war on our perception. It plays very well into 'their' priorities. The more stereotypes they can include in the Terrorist Banner the more control or 'security' they can say is needed.

One day we will all be looked at as potential terrorists and treated accordingly.

Mainstream Media are mostly Corporate hacks and they themselves are spewing conspiracy theories. Bobble head twins Beck and Hannity do it on a daily basis. Wanting to know the truth does not make you a conspiracy nut.

Originally posted by Brahmanite
What is the one thing That John and Joe had in common? A 'truthers' sentiment? An anti-government sentiment?

...they probably had lots of things in common - history of anti-social behavior, habitual failures, inability to take responsibility for their own actions, lack of empathy, grandiose perception of self - but - imo, at the bottom of the "stack" is narcississtic personality disorder...

Originally posted by Brahmanite
Fellow ATSers: they are turning US into our own enemies. These events will effectively turn US into terrorists. ATS is the biggest online community of 'truthers', you can now assume that the FED's are now considering it to be the largest 'training camp' for these new terrorists.

We are now thought criminals, the new terrorists. It has begun!!!!!!

...thats paranoid...

...lets not forget that the report that started this broohah was nothing more than an opinion that was stated as legitimate fact... for the most part thats all news is today - personal opinion, not unbiased investigative journalism...

Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101
It is perfectly alright for others to presume they are 'part of some movement'. Sadly, they are,

...yep... thats how it goes with movements... cant control who participates or the pyschological impact on participants...

Originally posted by Brahmanite
The reason anyone still believes that we have the 'right' to say anything we want without consequence is because the media never reports on what they dont want you to hear...

...no, the reason why some people think that way is because they've never read the constitution or bill of rights - and - they believe msm reports factual info...

Originally posted by Brahmanite
Now, we must keep in mind that if you publicly question the government or suggest that they might lie or anything like that, you will be grouped right in together with the two guys that carried these attacks out.

...you're only giving credence to a very small portion of the picture - and - by doing so, you're helping to spread paranoia, imo...

...there are many extremely intelligent people in "the movement", some of which had been very vocal for decades prior to the creation of the 911 movements...

...should you choose to question the government, how you are perceived has everything to do with how you behave - not how others behave...

...in contrast, theres the "do as i say, not as i do" movement, led by people like alex jones who cant control his own behavior but rants incessantly about the government's failure to behave properly...

Originally posted by tothetenthpower
Considering a large part of membship here is from outside the US, I doubt anything will come of this.

Most of the other half are from the UK, so i'd take that one with a pinch of salt!

You know how our beloved government like to keep their beady little eyes on us all here.

CX.

I don't really think there is anything paranoid about saying that the media is clearly reporting these stories with a sentiment that is portraying these guys as part of some movement whose 'members' at any moment might commit similar acts.

These types of accusations lead to the same mentalities that are behind racial profiling and # like that. Instead of focusing on the aspect that they were mentally ill, which probably lowered their rationality and led them to commit their acts, the media is focused more on their 'connections to 9/11 truth and conspiracy theorist stuff' as if that is the major cause of their actions and not their apparent mental illness.

I am not a paranoid person at all. Paranoia is a matter of perception and is determined by the character of your 'ego'. I am not interested in the topics found on ATS because I am 'worried' about anything or whatever. I am interested in this stuff because I like to push my imagination as far as I can. I like to analyze as many 'theories' about things as I can. This stuff is fun to me. I am interested in all kinds of obscure things.

I do consider myself a political person but, my politics are likely very far away from the typical people you might assume to be involved in conspiracy theories and what not. I am actually quite opposed to most of the politics involved in the 'tea bagger' 'movement' and also the 9/11 truth movement.

I say this because I certainly do not consider myself to be personally or philosophically associated with the 'movement' or 'community' that I have been referring to therefore, I really have no reason to personally be paranoid about these accusations.

If I were going to get paranoid and think everyone was after me it would have happened long ago.

I am a rational enough thinker and mentally stable enough to know that I am not nearly important, special or unique enough for anyone or 'anything' government or whatever, to be paying any real attention to me.

Actually, one of the biggest reasons I find myself involved in the conspiracy theory community is because I get a kick out of observing and interacting with paranoid types of people that think reptiles run the world and that they are Mantauk experimentees.

I do think this is an important issue though. The police state IS a very real thing. I have enough real world experience to know that.



[edit on 7-3-2010 by Brahmanite]