Preteen on No Fly List

Preteen on No Fly List

video.foxnews.com

There was no actual story, a video only, so no news story snippet.

(visit the link for the full news article)



Related AboveTopSecret.com Discussion Threads:
Administration Seeks to Keep Terror Watch-List Data Secret
TSA Looks to Expand Use of Full-Body Scanners at U.S. Airports
Is your name on the no-fly list? Smith, Williams, Johnson, Hussein?
Here comes the fist - Napolitano: Domestic extremism is top concern

My apologies, there was no story, just video for this story.

This video is in regards to a 12 year old having his name on the TSA Watch List, as a suspected terrorist.

I think this is silly as Hell because this child is a Boy Scout, and now is being harrased at school by other children, because of his name, not him specifically, but the same name as a suspected terrorist, is on the Terror Watch List.

I tried finding stories to this and was unsuccessful, so if someone else finds this particular story, and links it I would be grateful.

I find it already difficult that America uses this arcane system, because it is incredibly fallible, and once someone's name is on this Terror Watch List, there is no recourse to get it off of it, if it is incorrect.

I have read many books on this topic and once it happens it is a nightmare.

video.foxnews.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

I had to share this video because I felt it was relevant to so many stories of lunacy when it comes to some of the things our Government puts people through in name of protecting our nation.

Having read the book No Place to Hide, there were many stories of the horrendous treatment people recieved because of a name, not necessarily their name, just a similar spelling, and being put on this list.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/0021270bff44.jpg[/atsimg]

Amazon Review :

George Orwell envisioned Big Brother as an outgrowth of a looming totalitarian state, but in this timely survey Robert O'Harrow Jr. portrays a surveillance society that's less centralized and more a joint public/private venture.

Indeed, the most frightening aspect of the Washington Post reporter's thoroughly researched and naggingly disquieting chronicle lies in the matter-of-fact nature of information hunters and gatherers and the insatiable systems they've concocted.

Here is a world where data is gathered by relatively unheralded organizations that smooth the way for commercial entities to find the good customers and avoid dicey ones.

Government of course too has an interest in the data that's been mined.

Information is power, especially when trying to find the bad guys.

The mutually compatible skills and needs shared by private and public snoopers were fusing prior to the attacks of 9/11, but the process has since gone into hyperdrive.

O'Harrow weaves together vignettes to record the development of the "security-industrial complex," taking pains to personalize his chronicle of a movement that's remained (perhaps purposefully) faceless.

Recognizing the appeal of state-of-the-art systems that can track down a murderer/rapist with heretofore unimaginable speed, the author recognizes, too, that the same devices can mistakenly destroy reputations and cast a pall over a free society.

In a post-9/11 world where homeland security often trumps personal liberty, this work is an eye-opener for those who take their privacy for granted.

--Steven Stolder

Just how much control are we willing to sacrifice because of stupidity?

[edit on 5-3-2010 by SpartanKingLeonidas]

If I was his father I would raise hell. This is absurd but really does not surprise me that much because power causes corruption and the people with the power become paranoid

That's just crazy. I mean come on, he's a kid?

But these days you just never know. I hear the horror stories about kids being strapped with bombs not of their own choice or decisions? I have had vets tell me stories that will raise your hairs on your back.

So... perhaps a paranoia is a good thing, or perhaps not? Perhaps it's going too far?

[edit on 5-3-2010 by Deaf Alien]

I heard about this ,

Ya think they could go hassle some real criminals or something?

Agreed. Insanity at work. I don't mean the name on a list, I can understand that it could happen with confusion and mix-ups, but the fact that there is NO recourse to have name removed? (Is there really no recourse?) What kind of sense does that make? None. I bet if someone made enough noise in enough public media outlets, their name would be removed... But, we are talking about the US govt. of which sense, seems to be in short supply. Frustrating is not the word that comes to mind...

____________________
ETA: I can start a fire bow-drill style, didn't learn it in Scouts though...




[edit on 5-3-2010 by LadySkadi]

Boy Scout hum...
they can make a fire just by rubbing a couple branches together right?
Just imagine what they could do with a pair of swizzle sticks taken off the drink cart!!!

My name was once on the no fly list, not me personally just my name, me and a US state Senator a Doctor and a News reporter all with the same name couldn't fly for almost two years... never never said why not even after they dropped that name from the list...

seem more like a pick a name out of a hat rather and based on real intel

[edit on 5-3-2010 by DaddyBare]

Sad what the world is coming to these days but it is to be expected.
All part of the plan, man.

Plus I think I would be on the 'No-Fly' List as well due to my name.
en.wikipedia.org...

I could be wrong though but at the same time I wouldn't doubt it.
Luckily I don't fly or even have the money too fly. LoL

Originally posted by Kurt Turner
If I was his father I would raise hell. This is absurd but really does not surprise me that much because power causes corruption and the people with the power become paranoid

The only problem with what you're saying, and I am agreeing with you, is that raising Hell is liable to get the parents on the list.

There needs to be a simple recourse for action to get a name off this list.

Originally posted by Deaf Alien
That's just crazy. I mean come on, he's a kid?

But these days you just never know. I hear the horror stories about kids being strapped with bombs not of their own choice or decisions? I have had vets tell me stories that will raise your hairs on your back.

So... perhaps a paranoia is a good thing, or perhaps not? Perhaps it's going too far?

[edit on 5-3-2010 by Deaf Alien]

You are right, it is crazy, he's a kid, twelve years old.

If this were a case of the child having a bob strapped to him, I might understand.

However, it is not, and I am finding it hard as Hell to understand, let alone condone.

Originally posted by Stormdancer777
I heard about this ,

Ya think they could go hassle some real criminals or something?

This type of event is just to scare the populace into complacency.

Of all the advertisements fo Identity Theft, this will become propaganda.

Think of the people who will be terrified, needlessly, because of this stupidity.

Originally posted by LadySkadi
Agreed. Insanity at work. I don't mean the name on a list, I can understand that it could happen with confusion and mix-ups, but the fact that there is NO recourse to have name removed? (Is there really no recourse?) What kind of sense does that make? None. I bet if someone made enough noise in enough public media outlets, their name would be removed... But, we are talking about the US govt. of which sense, seems to be in short supply. Frustrating is not the word that comes to mind...

____________________
ETA: I can start a fire bow-drill style, didn't learn it in Scouts though...

[edit on 5-3-2010 by LadySkadi]

From reading the book I suggested for everyone to read there is no recourse.

Well, not a simple one, some of the people in the book, took years of going through hassles, getting told they could not fly, and continually harrassed, just because their names were similar, let alone if it was the same exact name, as a known terrorist, all because scare tactics being used.

The book is definitely worth the read because of the stories alone.

As well, the amount of information being tracked, and this nonsense happening.

It makes you wonder if this is a pure terror tactic being used to scare us to accept an alternative solution, just to sell us into a worse system, that seems simpler, like the R.F.I.D./bio-chip system of Verichip.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/338cc3d8b0fa.jpg[/atsimg]

Originally posted by DaddyBare
Boy Scout hum...
they can make a fire just by rubbing a couple branches together right?
Just imagine what they could do with a pair of swizzle sticks taken off the drink cart!!!

Yes, for survival purposes, not to create terror.

Originally posted by DaddyBare
My name was once on the no fly list, not me personally just my name, me and a US state Senator a Doctor and a News reporter all with the same name couldn't fly for almost two years... never never said why not even after they dropped that name from the list...

seem more like a pick a name out of a hat rather and based on real intel

[edit on 5-3-2010 by DaddyBare]

You sound like one of the many people described in that book.

I believe Ted Kennedy was on the No Fly List for a while.

And I have to wonder why his name or anyone similar would be on there.

Possibly, to sell the idea, to make the Senator go along with passing a Bill?

Originally posted by EnemyofMan
Sad what the world is coming to these days but it is to be expected.
All part of the plan, man.

Plus I think I would be on the 'No-Fly' List as well due to my name.
en.wikipedia.org...

I could be wrong though but at the same time I wouldn't doubt it.
Luckily I don't fly or even have the money too fly. LoL

Is that you on you just have the same name?

It is an inefficient means to deal with something which is allegedly important.

Oh, put their name on a list, and nothing stops them from getting a false I.D.

reply to post by SpartanKingLeonidas


No, that David Lane died in 2007.
I'm a different David Lane.

Originally posted by EnemyofMan
reply to post by SpartanKingLeonidas

 

No, that David Lane died in 2007.
I'm a different David Lane.

Thank you for clarifying that.

One has to wonder why some similar names get on the list.

And others do not.

reply to post by SpartanKingLeonidas


Stories like this certainly make you shake your head. But it calls into question a larger issue; the war on terror (I really don't like that term, by the way). Look at the failed Christmas bomb attempt. Look at the reaction that drew from the public. People asked, how could this have happened? Why wasn't he on a terror watch list? I don't have those answers. But responses like that demand action. So what happens, the screeners try to tighten things up. They err on the side of caution; sometimes to the point of apparent lunacy. But can you blame them? Look at what happens when the system fails. People cry bloody murder. And at the same time, they get upset when they feel they are being inconvenienced or worse.

How do you win this fight? What is the magic balance? As long as the public demands results in a difficult task, the resulting restrictions will further upset that very same public. "Do your job better by tightening security; just don't inconvenience me in the process or make any mistakes".

As for getting your name off the list, that should be addressed. Some common sense should apply.

reply to post by JWH44


I agree with you JWH44, there needs to be a balance, however I feel we might be having ourselves played as fools, by those in Congress and elsewhere.

If you read my post above about the Verichip tracking system, I believe that we are being pushed, as a political agenda, to demand this system.

When events happen like 9/11 or the Underwear Bomber politically those currently in power over-react because of public demand for safety, and people being as an over all collective demand various things for our safety and Congress is more than happy to drive that home.

But what if this is all a charade charaterized as a means to push and sell the eventual system of the R.F.I.D. chip system through Verichip and the sister organization through tracking, Digital Angel and the Real I.D. Act?

Before you answer, that was rhetorical, because I already know that answer.

I've tracked this all back a long way through many thousands of books, laws, and vast research information, and it all tracks back to information databases.

The organizations like Destron Fearing and I.B.M. have been building this system, testing it, and slowly creeping the law changes in under the wire, via lobbyist groups, as a means of ultimately tracking our every movement, via a continual Census.

Quote from Destron Fearing

Destron Fearing is a global leader in innovative animal identification.

With presence in over 40 countries worldwide we seek to provide real world ID solutions to match the ever increasing complexity and opportunities related to animal identification.

Since 1945 we have provided innovative products addressing the needs of livestock producers, companion animal owners, horse owners, wildlife managers and government agencies.

It is through this that our own Government is using technology found during WWII.

The end goal is to have us implanted with a device to track our locations, eventually.

As each event happens the laws of our nation are subtely changed.

[edit on 6-3-2010 by SpartanKingLeonidas]

Yeah I see the problem Spartan.

When I adopted my youngest about six months ago, we had a hassle at the airport cause his name is also on the now fly list.

He was 3 at the time...

A word of advice, smart ass remarks apparently aren't welcome.

I told the security guards he was actually a midget I was using to import explosives..you'd think the smile would have given it away..

No dice...

8 hours later, I had learned my lesson.

~Keeper

reply to post by tothetenthpower


A 3 year old was on the No Fly List?

I wonder why that is because it smells funny to me and it isn't the diapers.

And no they do not take jokes lightly about this stuff in an airport.

Which is why I hope the Air Traffic Controller who took his son t o work and had him calling to planes is permanently terminated after the investigation is through.

reply to post by SpartanKingLeonidas


I agree, and yup a 3 year old. Mind you it was less HIM and more his NAME which was on the list.

New passport and everything and first time out of the country I guess it raised some flags, but then again my little joke which was more in the sense of " Are you serious?" didn't help the situation either.

~Keeper

Originally posted by SpartanKingLeonidas
reply to post by JWH44

 

If you read my post above about the Verichip tracking system, I believe that we are being pushed, as a political agenda, to demand this system.

And isn't that the ultimate victory for those setting the plan in motion? To manipulate us into ASKING for the chip. It gives them perfect deniability. Of course, that is assuming that I believe there there are people smart enough and manipulative enough to contrive such a far-reacing, global conspiracy. I would like to think that something like that is just too far-fetched, but I really can't say that. There are a lot of compelling arguements that point to such a conspiracy, but I just don't know.

I have been asked many times why I even come to ATS. It is for this reason. I'm curious about these theories. Clearly, there is little evidence that can point one way or another. But if the evidence were out there, I imagine that it is in this setting where it might be brought to light. Or at least that someone might piece together the missing parts of the puzzle that lead to the evidence.

reply to post by JWH44


I happen to be glad you're on ATS.

I've uncovered many pieces of the evidence of a global initiative towards this and it ultimately is so spread out no one can track it, unless they are looking at both the bigger picture and the smaller picture, simultaneously.

The question is how deep are you willing to go and are you willing to do what it takes to uncover the plot, or will you ultimately become a part of it?

That remains yet to be seen because the people I see doing this are willing to buy people, financially or politically, they are willing to discredit people via various means, and or if they cannot do that they can and will destroy a person via their family, their jobs, and or an assisted suicide.

That is a euphemism about someone killing someone and making it look like suicide.

IBM and the Holocaust: The Strategic Alliance Between Nazi Germany and America's Most Powerful Corporation

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/3c9c27969530.jpg[/atsimg]

Amazon Review :

Was IBM, "The Solutions Company," partly responsible for the Final Solution?

That's the question raised by Edwin Black's IBM and the Holocaust, the most controversial book on the subject since Daniel Jonah Goldhagen's Hitler's Willing Executioners.

Black, a son of Holocaust survivors, is less tendentiously simplistic than Goldhagen, but his thesis is no less provocative: he argues that IBM founder Thomas Watson deserved the Merit Cross (Germany's second-highest honor) awarded him by Hitler, his second-biggest customer on earth.

"IBM, primarily through its German subsidiary, made Hitler's program of Jewish destruction a technologic mission the company pursued with chilling success," writes Black.

"IBM had almost single-handedly brought modern warfare into the information age [and] virtually put the 'blitz' in the krieg."

The crucial technology was a precursor to the computer, the IBM Hollerith punch card machine, which Black glimpsed on exhibit at the U.S. Holocaust Museum, inspiring his five-year, top-secret book project.

The Hollerith was used to tabulate and alphabetize census data.

Black says the Hollerith and its punch card data ("hole 3 signified homosexual ... hole 8 designated a Jew") was indispensable in rounding up prisoners, keeping the trains fully packed and on time, tallying the deaths, and organizing the entire war effort.

Hitler's regime was fantastically, suicidally chaotic; could IBM have been the cause of its sole competence: mass-murdering civilians?

Better scholars than I must sift through and appraise Black's mountainous evidence, but clearly the assessment is overdue.

The moral argument turns on one question: How much did IBM New York know about IBM Germany's work, and when?

Black documents a scary game of brinksmanship orchestrated by IBM chief Watson, who walked a fine line between enraging U.S. officials and infuriating Hitler.

He shamefully delayed returning the Nazi medal until forced to--and when he did return it, the Nazis almost kicked IBM and its crucial machines out of Germany.

(Hitler was prone to self-defeating decisions, as demonstrated in How Hitler Could Have Won World War II.)

Black has created a must-read work of history.

But it's also a fascinating business book examining the colliding influences of personality, morality, and cold strategic calculation.

--Tim Appelo

If you're serios about wanting to know the truth it is out there.

Just how willing are you to dig deeply and will you uncover it or will you become dirty?

The book above was written by a Holocaust survivor's child.

It is the birth of the information databases and the other book referenced is anothe good source for some of the information you can look into.

[edit on 6-3-2010 by SpartanKingLeonidas]

If a name pops up when using 'Echelon' or any of the other supposedly covert information gathering software and it is in relation to ANYTHING that might be considered terroristic in nature, that name is on the watch list. The list has been expanding by leaps and bounds. I would NOT be surprised that many names of individuals on this board are on that list. Your anonymity is not safe here or on any other board no matter what the PTB here on ATS tell you!


Zindo