Microsoft Behind Recent Wikileaks & Cryptome Closings?

Originally posted by Portugoal
Any thoughts on the fact that Microsoft is forcing sites that try to inform the people to shut down?

reply to post by MemoryShock


Yes that's very interesting, I guess Microsoft figured out that their strategy was backfiring, by attempting to keep people from seeing the document, they were really drawing attention to it! I probably never would have read that document had it not been for Microsoft shutting down Cryptome so I'm a perfect example of how their strategy backfired.

On the other hand, I'm not surprised by what's in the document, but I don't think I'm typical in that respect because I think many people don't read all that "by checking this you agree to our terms and conditions" stuff that you have to click to use the Microsoft services. So people who haven't read that stuff might be a little surprised, but I wasn't.

reply to post by MemoryShock


So Microsoft realizes they actually made their document spread more on the internet by asking for cryptome to be shut down. And they have to embarrisingly ask for the site to be restored.

Does this request not show that Microsoft does indeed have the power to shut down and restore sites?

Originally posted by Portugoal
Does this request not show that Microsoft does indeed have the power to shut down and restore sites?

Sort of but not exactly.

What it shows me is that if you wrote and published a copyrighted work covered by the DMCA, and cryptome published it, little old you could send a letter to the DMCA department of cryptome's ISP and if cryptome refused to comply with your takedown notice, their ISP would shut them down for your request also, at least the correspondence from network solutions implies that that's the standard procedure specified in the DMCA legislation which they were following.

Now would it really play out that way if you wrote the letter instead of Microsoft? I don't know, but I don't see why not, except you're not a big bad big brother so Cryptome would probably take down your article if you asked so it would never get that far. But that's just my guess, I'm not a DMCA expert.

I finally got a hold of the document today, as cryptome is back up.

It doesn't really have much in it that you wouldn't expect. It's also from 2008, which is rather old I guess considering recent changes in policies from both microsoft and the gov. I feel like we're missing something here. Why was there such a dance over this?

If anything, I feel better about microsoft after this.

Microsoft‘s systems only store the e-mails a user has
elected to maintain in the account. Therefore, the
only e-mails provided in response to legal process
seeking stored e-mail content will be the e-mails
stored in the “Folders on MSN” section of a user’s
account.

Be aware that users may also store e-mail content
on their computer’s hard drive. Microsoft will not
be able to disclose e-mail content stored on a user’s
computer – only e-mail content stored on
Microsoft’s e-mail servers

Thanks microsoft, thats actually nice. Also, there is this in relation to it's MSN chat service:

Microsoft servers authenticate users, but Microsoft does not log the content of
communications between users

This document is a little strange in only one way that I can immediately see. It doesn't show ALL of the information that it retains. It just sets a process in which information can be obtained with some examples of the information that can be provided.

For instance, the xbox live section shows a small table with data in it that includes what video game was being played between what period of time, yet the pdf doesn't directly link that information as available. Which isn't a big deal, but it makes me wonder what other information is obtainable through the other other services that isn't listed.

Also, this document is only for it's internet based services. Where is the OS related one?

Would it be a stretch to say that Microsoft has something within this "COFEE" and document that are linked and part of a grander scheme which they don't want you to see?!??!!?

I think it could be a very valid argument.

Originally posted by patmac
I For instance, the xbox live section shows a small table with data in it that includes what video game was being played between what period of time, yet the pdf doesn't directly link that information as available. Which isn't a big deal, but it makes me wonder what other information is obtainable through the other other services that isn't listed.

Also, this document is only for it's internet based services. Where is the OS related one?

There is none.
Thats it & thats the point.

The fact that the document even exists should tell you everything you need to know.

(the fact that they have had to produce a kids guide to MS data retrieval for law enforcement bodies says more about law enforcement than it does about MS)

If you are law enforcement and have a warrant you 'may' be able to get access to the information listed in the document depending on restrictions and even then no guarantee and THATS ALL.

MS are a company in the business of selling software and software services.

They don't store anything they don't need to. The data they store is only to facilitate that process of selling you new stuff and keeping the services they have already sold to you running.

Anything else is a waste of time and money.

Edit:

Originally posted by Erdna
Would it be a stretch to say that Microsoft has something within this "COFEE" and document that are linked and part of a grander scheme which they don't want you to see?!??!!?

I think it could be a very valid argument.

It would be rather large stretch unless you think that MS are conspiring with the government to sell you windows 7 and an Xbox.

As some of us have said before the cofee app set is a joke to anyone who knows even basic operating system architecture.

[edit on 25-2-2010 by Absence of Self]

Originally posted by patmac
Also, this document is only for it's internet based services. Where is the OS related one?

that's the one I'd like to see.

Do any of you remember the big stink when some Adobe users were reporting odd behavior when they scanned currency? Adobe admitted that at the request of TPTB, they installed some big brother monitoring bloat in their software which would cause the observed behavior if people were working with currency. The intent to prevent counterfeiting is noble enough, but the end doesn't always justify the means, and I don't think it did in that case.

slashdot.org...

described a curious 'feature' with Photoshop 8 (also known as 'CS'). Seems this latest version of Adobe's flagship product has the built-in ability to detect that an image is of American currency. Something has been built into Photoshop's core coding that can detect something in images of currency and will prevent the user from opening the file. Apparently it will also do this with Euro notes; info on other currency is pending.

Now if Adobe is doing that and they have admitted it, then what is Microsoft doing, that we don't know about? Some have speculated they are putting backdoors in Windows 7 and while that's just speculation as far as I know, given what we know Adobe is doing, I wouldn't call it wild speculation to think that Microsoft could have incorporated features requested by government agencies, like Adobe did.

If anyone's got information on the other Microsoft document, dealing with their OS, I'd be interested too.

There is no 'document' on their operating systems.

They explicitly state in the sourced doc that they can't provide access to information on peoples computers.

If you want tech info on MS products go here: Technet.

If you want really weird arcane stuff on something like the RPC protocol stack look it up on their dev blogs or just phone up and ask them.
(though in my opinion some of their departments leave a lot to be desired)

If you want to know how to break the OS go buy and read most of these: Hacking Exposed Series

Comparing an OS to Photoshop is apples to oranges.

Think about it: how many organizations run windows operating systems and what would happen if those organizations discovered there was a deliberate back door left into the system by the people who supplied the software?

Originally posted by Absence of Self
Think about it: how many organizations run windows operating systems and what would happen if those organizations discovered there was a deliberate back door left into the system by the people who supplied the software?

I have thought about it. What would they do, get mad and switch to the competitor's product? Oh wait, there is no real competitor for the windows OS, even less competition for the OS than for photo editing programs. Well, versions of Linux are free but there are reasons people choose to pay for Windows instead of using the free OS, it's really not direct competition, not yet anyway.

Well I hope there isn't a backdoor, but if there is, I suspect it's classified, and not just confidential like the online services document. Like maybe only certain people in the CIA and FBI or NID know about it.

reply to post by Arbitrageur


Why would anyone need to know about?

Becuase privacy matters to them I'm guessing is your answer and they want to inform the government? I'm sure if the government knew they'd just turn a blind eye.

Originally posted by Erdna
Would it be a stretch to say that Microsoft has something within this "COFEE" and document that are linked and part of a grander scheme which they don't want you to see?!??!!?

I think it could be a very valid argument.

That's what I was wondering at the beginning of this thing starting. The two whistle-blower sites defending the document's release could make people see that.

Maybe Microsoft's invasion of people's privacy does go farther than this and Microsoft fears it can only be the begining of leaks of this nature.

Originally posted by Portugoal
Maybe Microsoft's invasion of people's privacy does go farther than this and Microsoft fears it can only be the begining of leaks of this nature.

That's kind of what I was getting at. Now first of all, I'm not saying I believe all this article has to say, but this is a conspiracy site, right? So if you want to read the article and decide for yourself if it's just a wild conspiracy theory, or if there might be something to it:

Microsoft Discloses Government Backdoor on Windows Operating Systems

Microsoft may have inadvertently disclosed a potential Microsoft backdoor for law enforcement earlier this week.

What is the nature of this backdoor?

Well most windows users get updates and one of them that comes out once a month is called: "Malicious Software Removal tool". And that's the one part of the article I can confirm, is that's a real tool installed on most windows PCs.

We then have the following wording: “Microsoft had not previously talked about its botnet tool, but it turns out that it was used by police in Canada to make a high-profile bust earlier this year.” So again, thinking logically at what has been said so far by Microsoft; “We have a tool called Malicious Software Removal tool…”, “we can’t tell you the name of this tool since it would undermine our snooping…”, “it’s been used by law enforcement already to make a high-profile bust earlier this year.”

Any way you’d like to market this, it reeks of a backdoor: (again pointing to the definition) A backdoor in a computer system … is a method of bypassing normal authentication, … obtaining access to … , and so on, while attempting to remain undetected. There’s no beating around the bush here on what this tool is and does.

reply to post by Arbitrageur


Has a thread been started on this yet? It's from 2008 but still... If not, you should start one.

reply to post by Portugoal

I thought about that, actually I'm doing a little research since I don't want to post a thread with unreliable information, but the admission by Microsoft that they used a botnet tool they can't talk about involved in a major bust in Canada is interesting, that seems to be true.