Where are the Positive Threads about the Free World, Democracy or Christianity?

First off I like to say that no country is perfect, no race or peoples are perfect or sinless or going to be right for everyone.

We complain so much about the West and the Free world and yet we do not know how lucky we are, we are so lucky compared to some people if not spoilt by comparison. Some of it I believe is down to being blessed and choosing to be good people, a society with chaos and intolerance will only hinder social progress and cause more violence and oppression.

Everyone likes to have a ramble like they do every week in the houses of parliament but I guess that is down to being able to have an opinion which is good, better than being put to prison for saying something wrong.

When are the people of the internet age going to say, look we are okay we should stick up for our values rather than complain and complain like it is under some NWO when it is not.

Maybe we have to fight for our freedoms now and then and keep those in power in line, maybe they have stopped listening to us and they do it their way and we as a free people need to complain and let society have a voice and that is what freedom is all about.

Yet I find some double standards are being lost where all that people do is complain about the negatives and never give credit when it is due. If we listen to ourselves in this nonracist way where does it lead? Are we then going to allow those who hate democracy, freedoms and heritage Christian values and culture get their way to oppress us because we think we are the bad ones after all?

It seems like people are siding with the devil lately and are giving credit to the wrong side of the fence and even sticking up for it.

There are a lot of wrongs in all society but compared to some we should be thankful for where we are and the freedom of choice we have in this present time. If someone from another distant country read about us on ATS they would hate us even more if not they will think they are the right ones and feed their own ignorance about our culture in the English speaking part of the world.
We need to what is good now and then instead of complain every minute, some I know on ATS do like to complain about every word one writes or you never hear the good things coming out of their freedom to express, now and then I feel we to change the song.

I don't expect a great respone to this thread.

[edit on 19-1-2010 by The time lord]

Originally posted by The time lord
First off I like to say that no country is perfect, no race or peoples are perfect or sinless or going to be right for everyone.

Obviously.

We complain so much about the West and the Free world and yet we do not know how lucky we are, we are so lucky compared to some people if not spoiled by comparison. Some of it I believe is down to being blessed and choosing to be good people, a society with chaos and intolerance will only hinder social progress and cause more violence and oppression.

From what I gather, you think we are lucky but are also blessed and also choose to be good rather than bad?

Kind of a weak point, and there is nothing behind these words so far. Support is needed.

Everyone likes to have a ramble like they do every week in the houses of parliament but I guess that is down to being able to have an opinion which is good, better than being put to prison for saying something wrong.

Right. Man has a natural right to freely express himself. Government needs no pat on the back for recognizing it, because government only has one tool in it's toolbox: force. The natural counterbalance to force is the people, so it stands to reason that public discourse (complaining often times) and vigilance against abuse is required to maintain the balance and stem encroachment.

When are the people of the internet age going to say, look we are okay we should stick up for our values rather then complain and complain like it is under some NWO when it is not.

That is a powerful assumption that you must back up. What values, specifically, do you propose to support?

Maybe we have to fight for our freedoms now and then and keep those in power in line, maybe they have stopped listening to us and they do it their way and we as a free people need to complain and let society have a voice and that is what freedom is all about.

Right, I said this previously.

Yet I find some double standards are being lost where all that people do is complain about the negatives and never give credit when it is due. If we listen to our selves in this narsacist way where does it lead? Are we then going to allow those who hate democracy, freedoms and heritage Vhristian values and culture get their way to oppress us because we think we are the bad ones after all?

Wait, Christianity is the bane of oppression now? I think secular societies are better than homogeneously religious ones.

It seems like people are siding with the devil lately and are giving credit to the wrong side of the fence.

What position, specifically, is the side of the devil?

I have bitched about far right Christians, insane Muslims, and any one else who thinks you have to destroy a faith or person to "save them". As a Christian I don't advertise it, but try to act towerd others in a way that will demonstrate what I believe. Also, I'm Christian because thats the way I was raised. Raised with another faith, I most likely would follow that. Sad to say, but I do think some people who in the practice of their faith, condem others who don't believe what they do. That demonstrates a lack of critical thinking. And thats always dangerous.

reply to post by The time lord


They have been taken over by the 2012 doomsday forum, see people are now in a "doomsday mode after the 2000 didn't come"

I got to love the doomsday enthusiast.

Originally posted by KrazyJethro

Originally posted by The time lord
First off I like to say that no country is perfect, no race or peoples are perfect or sinless or going to be right for everyone.

Obviously.

We complain so much about the West and the Free world and yet we do not know how lucky we are, we are so lucky compared to some people if not spoiled by comparison. Some of it I believe is down to being blessed and choosing to be good people, a society with chaos and intolerance will only hinder social progress and cause more violence and oppression.

From what I gather, you think we are lucky but are also blessed and also choose to be good rather than bad?

Kind of a weak point, and there is nothing behind these words so far. Support is needed.

Everyone likes to have a ramble like they do every week in the houses of parliament but I guess that is down to being able to have an opinion which is good, better than being put to prison for saying something wrong.

Right. Man has a natural right to freely express himself. Government needs no pat on the back for recognizing it, because government only has one tool in it's toolbox: force. The natural counterbalance to force is the people, so it stands to reason that public discourse (complaining often times) and vigilance against abuse is required to maintain the balance and stem encroachment.

When are the people of the internet age going to say, look we are okay we should stick up for our values rather then complain and complain like it is under some NWO when it is not.

That is a powerful assumption that you must back up. What values, specifically, do you propose to support?

Maybe we have to fight for our freedoms now and then and keep those in power in line, maybe they have stopped listening to us and they do it their way and we as a free people need to complain and let society have a voice and that is what freedom is all about.

Right, I said this previously.

Yet I find some double standards are being lost where all that people do is complain about the negatives and never give credit when it is due. If we listen to our selves in this narsacist way where does it lead? Are we then going to allow those who hate democracy, freedoms and heritage Vhristian values and culture get their way to oppress us because we think we are the bad ones after all?

Wait, Christianity is the bane of oppression now? I think secular societies are better than homogeneously religious ones.

It seems like people are siding with the devil lately and are giving credit to the wrong side of the fence.

What position, specifically, is the side of the devil?

Of course I can expand but you won't like the answer, I say that with early Christian values we have developed the tolerance and unity within society it has brought common values that all can read and agree on, with justice and law. Blessed through spiritual blessings, the gifts of development and learning like a revelation to the soul or like brightlight that switched on the mind and gave blessed anwers to. I need to go deeper with this issue of course if one can not relate to inventors who have faith in their hearts. Look at the Jews for example how little their population numbers are, yet they have influenced modern science and technology more than any other minority. The Bible says that those who bless Israel will be blessed also, America is feeding off that blessing, but when they have strayed away that blessing has turned into a curse like some pattern graph.

We have good values of tolerance that includes charity work and helping others, having people like the red cross or oxfam and environmentalists missionaries who want to help people and save the planet, we try and bring peace to nations who need help, although the war in Iraq has a double meaning to it and still says oil rather than liberation for the people.

No doubt these are good things and people will say if they have the background in Bible prophecy and the NWO that these things are a precurser to the global adgenda to bring people towards a one world government totalitarian system. I know that will probably happen but in the mean time what about the good things we do before that scenario, does it not count any more or are we going to complain about everything we do?

As for the internet all I hear these days are offensive language threats and disorder, everything is so negative in how we address each other, people are losing their values, maybe their own spiritual selves, I would not say having at least some Bible knowledge of the good things it says and say that our ancient ancestors had more sense than what we do today in how to conduct our selves, if the ancients did it, why can not we? That is a good example where this caveman ideology says we once thick skulled apes and people have no spiritual inspiration.

The side of the devil means people who would rather ban their routes in favour of a more oppressive system, people who wish to ban religion, especially anything that looks to show it was once Christian in favour for the rights of other oppressive minority groups that demand their own spiritual spaces but take you to court over your own freedom of expression for that ultimate oxymoron. For example the government would ban crosses in all schools but they will build a special prayer time room for the sensativities of another sect. Allow one rule for a minority and ban all the reminders of the majority, playing devils advocate.

Originally posted by The time lord


Of course I can expand but you won't like the answer, I say that with early Christian values we have developed the tolerance and unity within society it has brought common values that all can read and agree on, with justice and law.

Perhaps not. What early Christian values have developed tolerance and unity. What Christian values have brought common values that did not exist before Christianity?

Blessed through spiritual blessings, the gifts of development and learning like a revelation to the soul or like brightlight that switched on the mind and gave blessed anwers to.

Actually, I've found that religion has been the natural bane to development, learning, and knowledge. What answers has religion answered?

I need to go deeper with this issue of course if one can not relate to inventors who have faith in their hearts. Look at the Jews for example how little their population numbers are, yet they have influenced modern science and technology more than any other minority.

That remains to be seen. Do you have anything that might prove it?

The Bible says that those who bless Israel will be blessed also, America is feeding off that blessing, but when they have strayed away that blessing has turned into a curse like some pattern graph.

Again, do you have any evidence that coincides with your ideas? I have a hard time believing that considering the Jews are the ones who've got it wrong according to Christianity and stand a reasonable chance of burning in hell because of their refusal to acknowledge Jesus.

We have good values of tolerance that includes charity work and helping others, having people like the red cross or oxfam and environmentalists missionaries who want to help people and save the planet, we try and bring peace to nations who need help, although the war in Iraq has a double meaning to it and still says oil rather than liberation for the people.

Good works do not prove the right of any religion, and it is hard to say that charity would not be done in equal measure if religion was not present. It's also hard to paint Christianity with a single brush considering the sheer number of disputing factions of this one true religion.

You say we like we are all Christian, when we are not. Do you mean America, England, France, etc. If you are speaking about America, we are a secular nation.

No doubt these are good things and people will say if they have the background in Bible prophecy and the NWO that these things are a precurser to the global adgenda to bring people towards a one world government totalitarian system. I know that will probably happen but in the mean time what about the good things we do before that scenario, does it not count any more or are we going to complain about everything we do?

I don't think anyone would dispute that good works are done, but that doesn't require a pat on the back does it? I don't see many religious putting forth the good works of non-religious groups and people as any kind of evidence of the truth of atheism.

As for the internet all I hear these days are offensive language threats and disorder, everything is so negative in how we address each other, people are losing their values, maybe their own spiritual selves, I would not say having at least some Bible knowledge of the good things it says and say that our ancient ancestors had more sense than what we do today in how to conduct our selves, if the ancients did it, why can not we? That is a good example where this caveman ideology says we once thick skulled apes and people have no spiritual inspiration.

Are you seriously claiming that ancient people knew how to treat each other better than we do today or that the bible claims this?

You really are pushing a large bolder uphill with this one.

As for the "losing values", that is garbage and has never been shown to be true on the whole by anyone I've seen or heard of.

The side of the devil means people who would rather ban their routes in favour of a more oppressive system, people who wish to ban religion, especially anything that looks to show it was once Christian in favour for the rights of other oppressive minority groups that demand their own spiritual spaces but take you to court over your own freedom of expression for that ultimate oxymoron. For example the government would ban crosses in all schools but they will build a special prayer time room for the sensativities of another sect. Allow one rule for a minority and ban all the reminders of the majority, playing devils advocate.

I'd prefer a system of coexistence, but while the non-religious seem capable of doing it, I have very serious doubts the religious can simply keep it to themselves.

If Christians, Muslims, Mormons, among others, could keep their weird, and often times backwards, dogma to themselves things might be a bit nicer all around. While religion might cause someone to hold a particular idea, logic and reason are still the avenue to a more civil discourse and a better pattern with which to create laws.

I do not support any law that applies only to a group of people and not the whole.

[edit on 19-1-2010 by KrazyJethro]

by The Time Lord Are we then going to allow those who hate democracy, freedoms and heritage Christian values and culture get their way to oppress us because we think we are the bad ones after all?

It seems like people are siding with the devil lately and are giving credit to the wrong side of the fence and even sticking up for it.

In that much of the Western world is fashioned upon the political pillars of the Roman Empire, it should be noted that the strength of its rise depended largely upon freedom of religion and the acceptance of every belief of those conquered nations which it subsequently adopted as a province within the empire. The pagan sects and their priests were even given a place of worship within the old city of Rome itself. The polytheistic paganism which both the early Romans had in Hellenism and that which the vanquished retained (Pantheism) were combined and promoted at the very heart of ancient Rome.

Toward the end of that great empire came the various and conflicting sects of Christian monotheism which could allow nothing beyond their own beliefs. This led to the eventual destruction of that freedom of pagan religion, particularly from the death of Julian to the present time. It was the suppresion and eradication of polytheism which was the death knell of the Roman Empire. It's greatness then came into a long period of decline until the city of Rome itself was the only remnant and the Catholic church its only power.

In many ways, it is the greatness of America that it grants its population the freedom of religion, but once again it seems there is a growing desire to restrict that freedom to those who only accept the One True God (this time not Catholic, but Baptist), if not yet by force, then surely through derision of all other faiths.

You would do well, The Time Lord, to read through Edward Gibbons The Rise and fall of the Roman Empire and consider the similarities and perils outlined within its pages.



[edit on 19-1-2010 by Lug]

I have decided I have nothing to add, it is good I am glad that I can confirm how seperated from each other people are from their views reflected here and to the views of a divided society, as far as I know God exists and the whole picture has been turned upside down. I hold my own cards when I know God exists in his many different ways, I leave it for faith like the faith I gained to find it, the step must come from within.

It gets sadder by the day looking at it, I'm having a break from it all for a bit as it is so negative here these days, trying to explain everything is like going through every thread I have already created here, in the end it gets a bit tedious I wish more people would gain the courage to turn it around but I see that the inevitable is at hand here, not just on ATS but the general public opinions around the world like something brewing from the ancient times once predicted. The seed of a Godless world has been set for the virgin minds to accept any God that comes along, either that or they will reject his messengers first anyway.

The divide has been set and only a Monstrosity will be accepted in favour for it, it is sad pciture of the future, we will be volunteering to be scanned at airports and having IDs under our skin, people would be none the wiser in a few years time and I feel sorry that no one will know if it is good or not. But of course there is time to change aswell in all this once people unravel the yoyo effect of the spunout knowledge.

[edit on 19-1-2010 by The time lord]

So if people hate the West so much why they don’t move to Russia or Saudi Arabia or Africa if life is that bad.

I feel that sometimes people in the English speaking world complain about too much, people are so at ease these days they complain about silly things and take people to court over nothing. Even foreigners have got used to freedom to a point that they think freedom to stop freedom of speech is part of the same rules, when in fact it is only what they have been taught elsewhere that freedom is a threat to their controlling intolerant views to wipe-out your religion and culture.

I know a lot of English people are moving out of the UK because they are fed up with the country so it’s not like that does not happen.

Everyone complains about how the West is turning into a NWO, compare that to some places it has already arrived there, they have no freedom to practice other beliefs, religion is banned, couples are only allowed one child, women have different rules applied to them when they are attacked or raped, Christians have half the value and authorities allow them to be treated unfairly in trial, separatist movements in countries with ongoing terror and yet people complain about the West so much, with a little research you will see how lucky you are, but at the same time at least they try and help when they can when a country is in crises due to disasters. Either one half the world develops or none of it does, wave these computers good buy and lets go back to farming in our own gardens if one feels so guilty or ashamed of this technological lifestyle.

But I do wonder which race or religion people are who will be negative about this thread. No country is perfect it all has some problems but some have more than or attacks.



[edit on 18-2-2010 by The time lord]