A Random Call To Gym Rats

Okay. this is a weird one, but bare with me on this as it is just a conspiracy lol and have no evidence to back it up and all science goes against the idea. However looking at the financial aspects of things, well you'll see.

SO..

according to the weider principles the best method is to train;

1. no more than 45 minutes a day.
2. eat 1.5g protein per lb of bodyweight.
3. between 8-12 reps per set.

These will be what we are mainly looking at. So heres the conspiracys lol.

1. TRAIN NO MORE THAN 45 MINUTES PER DAY.

basically what i believe here is that although there is such a thing as overtraining the muscles you are entitled to spend up to 3 hours per day in the gym.
imagine if you were told you should train 3 hours per day, are around the world would be packed, because people who would normally be there for 40 minutes will be there for 3 hours. lets do the maths.

1 o'clock until 4 o'clock 40 minutes per day

10 enter at 1:00
10 enter at 1:30
10 leave at 1:40
12 enter at 2:00
10 leave at 2:20
9 enter at 2:30
12 leave at 2:40
6 enter at 3:00
9 leave at 3:10
13 enter at 3:30
6 leave at 3:40

if this is how people enter and leave the gym then the max in the gym at any time would be around the 20 mark.

however incorparate this into 3 hours and there would be roughly 100 people in the gym at any given time. Gyms would have to be huge to hold this many people at any given time, specially the more popular ones. There would be no such thing as a small gym lol. im sure you can workout for yourself which is going to make the gym more money.

EAT AT LEAST 1.5g PROTEIN PER 1lb OF BODYWEIGHT.

Now imagine all these people trying to build muscle. Theres no way on earth they are going to do it by eating food. They need aid from other sources, i.e. protein shakes. Think about how much the industry has made by selling protein drinks alone. Now although protein is essential for building muscle there's no way you would need the amount that is being advised to you.

Imagine if you only needed 70g protein per day max. that would easily be digested in natural foods without even having to diet specifically for building muscle. And if that happens there no making money. They try to pressure you into buying drinks also by telling you that you need at least 50g at least 45 minutes after a session, this makes you head straight to the protein bar to buy a shake. Which means they make money.

im sure you've figured out for youself the point im trying to get across here. Basically the protein business is a scam, they are trying to tell you that you need more that you actually do need in order to convince you to buy your supplements.

3. THEY SAY ITS BEST TO DO BETWEEN 8-12 REPS PER SET

okay this is kind of the same conspiracy as the first.

basically if your doing 20-25 reps per exercise then the person waiting to use the dumbell or machine after you is going to be getting pretty ticked off about how long your taking. lol.

I dont actually follow these principles myself, just a general conspiracy i thought about. Suppose i was just thinking outside the box, wayyyyy outside the box lol.

can anyone think of anything else to add? lol

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[edit on 12/20/2009 by semperfortis]

Ha, I read your post. You put great thought into the "Iron Pumping Conspiracy".

One question; Where do people with home gyms fit into this equation?

S&F for your effort and thought provoking ideas...

Originally posted by Dookie Master
Ha, I read your post. You put great thought into the "Iron Pumping Conspiracy".

One question; Where do people with home gyms fit into this equation?

S&F for your effort and thought provoking ideas...

lol

people with home gyms buy the equipment, pumping money into the financial market of gym businesses, once you've bought the equipment they dont really care how you train aslong as your still buying the supplements lol.

Your drawing assumptions that people actually workout for the 3 hours. The majority of gym rats, at least at my gym, are pathetic cro-magnon types (read tow truck drivers) who are there for the social market. Most of these knuckle draggin cave dwellers are attempting to mate so the concept of actually using equipment is generally out the window. The remaining 40% of the time is spent on their cell phones.

I figure I'm reimbursed for my workouts by all the hot water I use in my 15 minute showers.

brill

[edit on 19-12-2009 by brill]

reply to post by emayarsh


Great job. I am one of the masses that decided to put together a home gym. I thought I had gotten out of the "scene to be seen" crowd at the gym. But, only now did I realize I was feeding the beast

reply to post by Dookie Master
Dookie,
You have to be fairer in analysis since you said you put together your home gym. You realise of course that just putting it together is a mighty effort of muscular power and mental dexterity! I know that, because I put together my grown-up son's gym!

When Lou Ferrigno made his come back years ago and topped out at around 300 pounds, he said even his body could only handle 80 grams of protein per day.

It depends on the type of work out you are going for, but over all the "weider" system is over simplified. For example, for building muscle 8 to 12 reps is an ideal range. But for toning a higher number of reps at a lower weight is actually the recommended work out.

Im not even going to dig into the "time" equation except to say that 45 minutes is not leaving much time for warm up and cool down. Also to add that my gym does pretty good for its self, and I dont think I have EVER seen 100 people in it at once.

I aint touching the protien deal with a 10 foot pole. I don't touch the stuff except as a part of my normal diet, no supplements. If I can't get it from my normal diet, my work out routine is well beyond what I should be doing

reply to post by smurfy


I "put together" a dumb-bell bench and yes it was a stretch of mental acuity. I hate to say, but the wrong side inclined and declined. I didn't realize it until I tried to move the darn thing. "oh wait, my legs shouldn't be moving like this..."

Sorry if off topic...

Or you could train the Arthur Jones way ( Nautilus founder ) & do 12 reps on each body part & then move on, making your workout 30 minutes approximately....


I personally could not figure why anyone would want to do 20 reps of anything, especially 2-3 sets of 20 reps! Boy, you'd be in the gym all day trying to make gains.

Best rep range for hypertrophy ( enlargement ) is 8-12

Best rep range for strength is 1-6

etc, anyway, here's a link to explain why people WOULDN"T do 20 reps!

www.ironmagazine.com...



So what are you trying to ask us? Whether a gym membership is just a grab for cash because most people sign up, pay ( or get direct debited for a year ), & go only a few times........$$$$$ for the Gym owners? If so, then yes!!

Uh, no big conspiracy here. Of course there are always companies coming up with ways to sell products, but not all gyms are public or crowded - there is no conspiracy there.

I used to pump iron many years ago and I never really got into the products and shakes. I just ate allot more then - though I never worked out for beach muscles, I lifted weights to improve my athletic performance and reduces injuries.

Anybody who's ever worked out seriously has tried many different methods as far as time & reps.

Again, It has nothing to do with how many people fit in a gym at a time, it has to do with how your body reacts to pumping iron or working out and of course what you are trying to accomplish.

If I want to stay fit, but not get stronger I would lift light weights with higher reps. 3-5 sets or more & 10-15 reps.or more . If I wanted to get stronger I would do heavier weights and fewer reps. 3 sets & 5-10 reps. If your building with max weight you won't be able to do all reps in the last set. If you can you need to increase the weight.

When you want to get stronger you would do a brutal max weight low rep workout that would break you down and make you sore one to three times a year. Breakdown, buildup - plateau and repeat. You have to take time off to allow your muscles time to heal and then you rebuild them bigger & stronger. Too many days or too many hours a day and it doesn't work because your body wont recover enough to rebuild , too few days or hours and your body doesn't think it needs to get stronger.. It's something you have to experiment with, but the guidelines given in books and by trainers give you a starting point. You have to find what works best for you.

Obviously bodybuilders overdue it, so they need the extra products like protein & even steroids for some in order to recover faster and build faster.

BTW - I was never a gym rat. Gym rat was a dirty word for weirdos that spent allot of time in the gym, were usually not athletic and would primarily do bicep curls or bench press only and never did anything for their skinny weak legs. They would also, gawk at women, wouldn't shower before or after their workouts, would wear wife beater shirt if any but never put a towel down or clean up after themselves.



[edit on 20-12-2009 by verylowfrequency]

Originally posted by emayarsh
According to the weider principles the best method is to train;

1. no more than 45 minutes a day.
2. eat 1.5g protein per lb of bodyweight.
3. between 8-12 reps per set.

These will be what we are mainly looking at. So heres the conspiracys lol.

First off, I am NOT knocking your thread at all. I used to lift all the time. Until I realized I was chasing the ever-elusive body. Without steroids, I could never gain what I wanted. And I never wanted to bow down to steroids.
I hate the image that TV has created. Its getting ridiculous.

BUT in one sense: I don't see a conspiracy at all. You found THE business model that is based on manipulating the customers into buying their products to gain profits.
Sounds like Capitalism?

All businesses are like this. If you didn't have demand, there wouldn't be supply. So, in order to create demand, you create a market. Advertising in magazines for "Bigger Muscles" to increase your protein intake, to increase the sales. The conspiracy in magazine's is the fact that all the pictures are from guys on steroids. Not natural bodybuilders. I know a guy who posed for pictures in a certain MuscleMag. He even admitted the intake of steroids. He said, "You can't be in a mag unless your shredded. Everyone I know can't get shredded without 'roids."

Same with gyms. Advertise all over the world that you have to look a certain way, and have huge muscles to be cool or on TV, then gym memberships will be up.
Ever notice how MTV only has ripped up dudes with more steroids than brains on their shows? Everyone of them? If you create an image of what people should look like, you will create a sense of desire in young men. That's where there is some conspiracy.
But, that's the MAIN STREAM MEDIA for you. And its been going on for years

By the way, Your body can only digest 30-35 grams of protein per serving. So everything else is a waste. Just a FYI.
The original list of training system works fine, too. Its almost exactly what everyone I know uses. Even me, I just never consumed that much protein. Never thought I needed it.

[edit on 20-12-2009 by havok]

Hi havoc,

Just wanted to disagree with you about what you said about the only way to become shredded. Not true, that the only way you can become shredded is by the use of steroids.

Body fat% is based on the amount & QUALITY f calories consumed every day. Being shredded begins in the kitchen, not the gym.

But I do agree that there are people out there who take steriods to maximise their results. I personally believe the challenge is in shaping your body NATURALLY, & many of us out there also believe this. Thats why there are Natural Bodybuilding Associations across the globe, & no trophy is awarded until the winners are tested & the results come back clean.

Yeah, I know there are masking agents too, but you can only be as good as your testing body hey?



Weider isn't the only one to have theories on training, there's Mike Mentzer who should also be considered. ( his Heavy Duty is still used today, & Arnold Schwarzenneger is also up there & his theories are also sound.

Anyway, good post, & a light relief from all the doom & gloom of life!

reply to post by emayarsh


The 45 minutes can be anything. It dosent have to be done in a gym. As long as it gets your heart pumping like walking to work, or just going out for a strole in the evening. Even going up and down the stairs in your house 50 times.

The protine per pound of body weight is a bench mark for people who want to bulk up and put on mucle. The protine shake is just a supplement thats used when its inconvinient or impossible to get protine from foods, unless you have a well planned diet. Which is the Main thing and place where a lot of people go wrong in there trainning regime. IF ANYTHING, the huge amount of protine you consume will give you bag guts, make you bloated and cause wind... PARP! And also, trying to get protine can get expensive thats why some people revert to using anabolic supplements.

8-12 is also a low rep range with probably low sets too, to help bulk up again. Usually done inconjunction with a heavy weights. It dosnt matter if people are waiting to use the equipment your using. It may be courtious, but still, you are trying to do a work out. The worst thing i find is when you use dumb bells and the grip is coverd in sweat from the previous user.

Usually i find the gym packed with certain people at diffrent times of the day. For instance, you get 20 - 40 somethings at 6am in the morning, the old aged people are usually there at midday and then usually the youngsters turn up at about 4pm onwards. Then the hard workers at about 7ish and onwards till closing time (10.30pm)

Okay i think people are missing the point here lol..

the whole principles work.. however what i am trying to get across is the fact that everything that the books, internet w.e tells you, seems to be in conjunction with the gyms and supplements making the most money.

a gym would not make as much money telling a person to train 6 hours per day for example as they would have to purchase more weights & machines to meet the needs of the amount of people that would be at the gym at any given time.

Originally posted by SpinifexPrincess
Hi havoc[k],

Just wanted to disagree with you about what you said about the only way to become shredded. Not true, that the only way you can become shredded is by the use of steroids.

I actually never said that. My buddy did. Oh well.
But we all know the results of using bull testosterone.
Of course alot of people can be lean and achieve nice results with a good, proper diet.

I should've wrote with less haste. I've seen good results with just proper diets and good routines. I've also talked to those who are on steroids and wouldn't lift without them. They are huge, too. Almost to big to scratch their own back. And all for vanity.

Back to the OP:

the whole principles work.. however what i am trying to get across is the fact that everything that the books, internet w.e tells you, seems to be in conjunction with the gyms and supplements making the most money.

Making the most money isn't a conspiracy though, my friend.
Its capitalism. Pure and simple.

a gym would not make as much money telling a person to train 6 hours per day for example as they would have to purchase more weights & machines to meet the needs of the amount of people that would be at the gym at any given time.

A gym wouldn't make any money if you could get maximum results at home, with no supplements either. Its a social environment, and you learn new things from others there. The gym is a business too. They have to make money somehow.
(I am not taking sides here, as my buddy owns a local, small gym)

I've been in gyms for over 20 years, sometimes training peak times, sometimes quiet times, & the bottom line is that it doesn't matter how many people they can squeeze into the gym they are still not going to get more equipment if they don't want to spend the money. I'm afraid that it is just how it works in busness, trying to keep your head above water.

New / more machines would be nice, but you really only ned a few staple pieces of equipment to get a full body workout & even to work hard enough to get "ripped". You just gotta know what you are doing & how to get the best / most out of your training session.

No conspiracy here, but definately a refreshing change from the doom & gloom that's usually in here! Thanx!

lets see if i can put this into different terms..

the consipracy...

THE BASIC PRICIPLES THAT MODEREN BODYBUILDING HAS BEEN BASED UPON, ARE LIES IN ORDER TO MAKE THE THE INDUSTRY MORE MONEY.

I'm not a big fan of Weider, ... but his principles are basic rules for beginner's to live by untill they discover their own routine. That is all.

People should not work out over 45 to 60 minutes because your testosterone and growth hormone levels fall through the floor, ... and any weight lifting done past this point will be in vain.

1.5 grams of protein a day seems a little excessive, ... and your right, they do it to sell more protein, ... however when building muscle, there is almost no such thing as too much protein, and 1.5 grams a day is just a way for beginner's to ensure adequate consumption.

Why 8 to 12 reps ?? because this range is most effective at building muscle. .... or so they say, I think it should be 6 to 10.

If you want to really find conspiracy's in the bodybuilding world you should look at supplements. false advertising and labeling, you almost have to be a biochemist to know what your actually getting these days. They take common supplements like DHEA and relabel it under its chemical name to call it some kind of new magic prohormone.