Columbian Rebles Say They Are Holding Americans

BOGOTA - For the first time, Colombian guerrillas Saturday acknowledged seizing three U.S. government contractors after their plane went down in the southern mountains on Feb. 13.

In response to the kidnapping, scores of U.S. troops have poured into the South American nation, bringing the number to record levels and drawing the United States further into Colombia's prolonged civil conflict.

Rest of Story

I saw on TV that the Columbian's are claiming the contractors are actually CIA operatives.

Lovely more hostages being held by rebels, the same old scenario too.

for some reason i wouldn't want to rely on the opinions of miami, it's well-known for being heavily right-wing...

Colombian lawmakers concerned by report US troops will join hostage hunt
Colombian opposition politicians have voiced concern at a report that the United States plans to send 150 troops to Colombia to rescue three US government employees kidnapped by leftist FARC rebels. The men, who the rebels claim are CIA agents, were on board an aircraft which was shot down ten days ago in the southern province of Caqueta. The other two passengers, an American and a Colombian soldier, were found shot dead at the crash site. The US military provides technical assistance and training to the Colombian armed forces. However, a resolution by the US Congress, aimed at preventing a Vietnam-like involvement in the country, has so far prohibited US troops from taking an active role in Colombia's ongoing civil war.

src: www.dw-world.de...
src: www.dailytelegraph.... co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2003/02/24/wcolom24.xml&sSheet=/news/2003/02/24/ixworld.html

src: www.voanews.com... 7AF60AB1C3FFA8

[Edited on 2-24-2003 by echelon]

Veitnam-like? Ohhhh you mean tunnel technology, dealing with that problem has already been figured out.

In the end, both the contractors and the rebels will be killed.

As I understand it the Monroe Doctrine is still in force as well, the only real tie the FARC has with the Communists is in relation to the mob. Now that would be the Chinese Mafia, which is currently ruled by the Chin family (as in Chin-a). Of course there is also Castro
but he has never really ever said anything in relation to
the FARC.

Again, these folks really do not present themselves in relation to political goals its more of a facade. Looking at the planet as a whole its clear that the climate in Columbia is unique. Essentially growing coc aine ideally is grown within that Temperate Zone.

The best example of the how the FARC operates that I know of goes like this. A Colombian citizen is waiting in traffic on his way home; two men approach his car.

One puts a gun to his head while the other places a computer on the hood of his car and turns it on (cell phone being used to access Internet). The man with the gun at the citizens head demands the victim in the car he give him Columbia�s equivalent to a Social security number. Once the victim affords the information it is inputted into the computer and his current employment status and income is accessed. The victim is then told that given his income he will be required to pay taxes to the FARC (over and above what he pays to the Colombian government).

The amount he is required to pay is then given to him and the two men leave.

There was about 2 years, ago an incident in which a woman refused to pay. It was presented in the local media as well as was presented in the Internet. A bomb specifically designed to be attached to the neck
was placed on hers.

To make a long story short the bomb ended up detonating, it killed three other people, which were
present trying to defuse the weapon (police officers).


TC I can present roughly about 300 separate reason why this group is a threat to this country (US). Most of them Relate to issues, which are much, much closer to home.

The news just announced that the three hostages are considered prisoners of war by the FARC. As far as I am concerned Columbia is our next problem. In so far as dealing with them, while the US will not engage in Genocide Columbia is due for a haircut.




[Edited on 25-2-2003 by Toltec]

Do you think the Americans or the CIA are involved in this drug running or not? I do think that certin people within high and low places in our government and military are involved in the drug trade, if not the arms trade. It is well known that many generals retire to become personal body guards, mecenaries or hit men, drug dealers and or arms dealers, and security training agents that advise the military. So this long and protracted war in Columbia must have drawn in at least some of these types of people. To say that this war has not done so, is a ridiculous conception. I personally don't think going into Columbia is worth it if we have this underground activity being committed on our people by our people. Because of that activity I believe we as a nation will be 'neutral' to this conflict because of the simple fact that we are already involved in a much more different way. What is that way? That way is the simple act of protracting the war to further seperate the people and the resources from the power of controlling those people and resources. It is just another simple tactic our government uses to further the Agenda. That Agenda is the New World Order. This war in Columbia is like a constant money machine. There is oil for grabs, and lots of drugs. That just makes up the hard to get stuff. Let's face it, we want that land, and won't make our move to get it unless the coast is clear. Is it clear now? Oh No. The government knows the power of the rebel. They know how powerful the terrorism can be against their resources. They have enough trouble keeping the precious Occidental Pipeline up and running. So putting in our own men when we have others to do the dirty work for us would be fatal. My prediction is that if the government doesn't want choas in it's own country then they will stay away from the Cartels. Those Cartles are ruthless and have alot of power. Some people say those Cartels are really our Cartles, but I have to be doubtful of that one. I want proof. Does anyone have it? This situation in Columbia has always been a favortie topic of mine, and I will love to converse with all who agree or disagree that this is one of our biggest problems in the world today.

The country is Colombia and people from Colombia are Colombians


Columbia is a city in South Carolina.. (I think...)

LOL Illuminati!

Toltec, Colombia has been in a bad position for many decades, FARC, isn't the onle rebel group, and they are in cahoots with the cartels. Their activities are as you describe, and alot more.

The Colombians are a fantastic people and do not deserve the fear they have to endure. Their new president has vowed to kill the FARC, our government has changed its position and now allows that government to use U.S. suppiled equipment on not just the war on drugs but also their civil police action against the insurgents that has terrorized the good people of that country. Obviously, we have troops there now taking an active role, and I hope we commit all the troops necessary to help rid Colombia of the affliction.

The Colombian civil war is a symptom of the Cold War one, which the US won. This is a very important point and we see the issue expressed in the Arab world. The same problem is going on in Columbia. As such there are groups, which represent a more right-wing orientation, and those, which identify themselves as leftist. The FARC falls into the auspices of the latter.

The Colombian Drug Cartel as it exist today (after the war on drugs conflict) did involve the US during the presidency of George Bush 1st. Carried no denouncement or reaction from the leftist organization in Columbia (such as the FARC) because they were never part of that organization.

The FARCs situation has been addressed by the UN, in fact the current lands they control was an arrangement brokered by the United Nations in exchange for stopping hostilities. This issue has not worked out and primarily because of the state of disorganization apparent within these leftist groups. In reality they have failed to adjust to changing times. The issue being that the US won the cold war and despite the fact that the are unwilling to accept that does not change the fact it happened.

This shift in world power caused a shift in how organized crime families operated through out the world. the Russian Mob for instance no longer holds power in the central government, all Warsaw pact nations as well changed in this way. As a reuslt of even recent events (Afghani war) a major shift occured. The FARC and its affiliates in Columbia and Venezuela, not having responded to this shift in world power.

They were adversely affected financially and in response have placed more emphasis in kidnappings, torture and threats to support their institutions. All of these countries are now democratic as a result those organizations which engage in illegal activities. Are as well obliged to seek their needs from organization which exist in democratic countries.

The truth is that the situation has deteriorated substantially from the days when the Cold War was the norm. My opinion is the FARC has time to normalize relations but this will require they enforce the centralization of control within their forces (that does seem to be their greatest problem). In reality China is not an ally to them in more ways than one, they consider the FARC more of a threat. As China is a communist nation this as well pertains to the Triads.

The only real power the FARC has is in relation to eking out a viable surrender through the UN. The United States of America is not interested in that land but rather the stabilization of the post Cold War world. Kidnapping, Torturing or Killing US Citizens will only make war very real for the FARC.

The Game is Over!


What are your thoughts?

You seriously underestimate FARC, and the backing FARC has from not only the cartels, but from non-democratic countries in the Americas

TC...

In the 1970s the US changed the way it recorded its conversation from maintaining the information in Tapes to Digital recordings. As a reuslt they discovered that elements of the CIA and KGB were working together to maintain hostilities between the US and USSR.

You can imagine the response when this was made clear to those persons who legitimately were dealing with the problem Its very the same problem more than exist between left wing and right wing paramilitary organizations in Columbia and Venezuela. Just as it was probably discovered in relation to Israeli/ Arab relations. It is something, which will surprise many fighting between each other in those countries. The right-wing organizations are really not that much different than the left wing in response to cruelty.


And that applies to the whole world.

In the end, both the contractors and the rebels will be killed.

I do not feel I am underestimating the FARC or its affiliates. My post included the awareness that they exist. I am also very familiar with the extent to which this problem has affected lives even in this country.

The Colombian Cartels made a deal with the US during the hostilities engaged in, during George Bush Senior's Presidency. That deal included the Colombian Drug Cartel investing in legitimate US interests (ever heard of the Columbia Hospital Chain it is owned and operated by the Colombian Drug Cartel, all jokes aside). The Colombian Drug Cartel is a group of families; these families have been in operation since Columbia became a country. Which by the way TC was sometime after the Spanish/ American War.

Also TC in the Philippines we have forces dealing with basically the same problem.





[Edited on 28-2-2003 by Toltec]

Abraham Virtue you seemed interested in a debate, one which I as well am interested in :pain: Where are you :beam:?



[Edited on 1-3-2003 by Toltec]

What does any of that have to do with anything?

Furthermore, who said anything about right wing v. left wing? Colombia is a democracy. It is neither a fascist state or a communistic experiment. It is under attack by those who want to destroy its government and make it a communist state. And yes, you make it sound as if FARC is no big deal.

And, as I said, the hostages will be killed, but then so will the insurgents.

Every U.S. civilian in Colombia isn't CIA. DynCorp alone has a boatload of aircraft technicians down there. We have people down there ourselves, and people that make short roadtrips to repair or evaluate particular parts of Blackhawks. They aren't spooks.
At least, I don't think so.

What does what have to do with anything?

I was the one who brought up the matter of left wing vs. right wing. You did not say insurgents you said rebels. What I said was that the FARC should not expect assistance from legitimate communist countries because of their behavior. Take for instance the recent speech by the Venezuelan President, who stated that Columbia�s problems were the problems of Columbia. That Columbia should not offer opinions in relation to Venezuela, as Venezuela has Nothing to do with them. This being specific enough to portend to the fact that the Venezuelan government will not assist the FARC.

www-stu.calvin.edu...

www.foreignpolicy-infocus.org...

news.bbc.co.uk...


www.terrorismanswers.com...


library.nps.navy.mil...

The attached links provide information on the Colombian Civil war as well as data on the right wing group known as the AUC. TC the FARC has no navy and no air force, they have no tanks and no major artillery. What they have to there advantage are what are known as EMP bombs/missiles, automatic weapons and grenades.

Its apparent that after landing one of these men shot and killed a rebel soldier that is why he is dead. The FARC has because of this, reasons to believe that they are CIA. Otherwise why would one of them kill a person dressed as a soldier?

Columbia is a country, which has had a civil war for more than 35 years. This civil war is one of the issues that are left of the cold war era. History is clear, a reason for why the cold war between the superpowers ended. Is because there were people on both sides working together to maintain hostilities. It is extremely likely this is applicable to the situation in Columbia and that the issue is internal as in not related to another country.


What are your thoughts?