Vatican condemns Hallowe'en as anti-Christian

Originally posted by mostlyspoons
Even groundhog's day has pagan origins. Should we ban that as well? Pretty much every "holy day" we celebrate is based on pagan celebrations and rituals. The elite have always been pagans. Even the jewish leaders of jesus' time were practicing occult rituals, not of Godly origin but godly origin.

What is Pagan?

What does Pagan meant?

What does Occult really mean?

How do you figure Pagans were of the elite?

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
Just for the sake of completeness, it isn't only the Catholic Church that condemns the practice of Halloween:

No, it's not.

But as I was brought up in that church, that's where I choose to air my ire.

The pope and church says that even though I want to leave, I'm not allowed to.

I say "sod off" pope.

And reserve the right to take the piss out of my own religion.


[edit on 31/10/2009 by budski]

It is one thing for a religion to ask its own members not to trick or treat, but what I just found in my grandson's trick or treat bag tonight is outrageous.
It is a 4 page leaflet from the First Baptist Church in our town. The front is a picture of a ghost with the words trick or treat on it.
When you open the booklet, on the inside, the first word in Bold, large black is "TRICKS".
This is followed by a headline:
Satan tricks people about sin. It is followed by a paragraph talking about Satan dressing up sin, putting on false faces, and using cunning and crafty devices to fool many.

It is followed by 3 quotes from the bible: Proverbs 14:9, Proverbs 14:34 and Ezechiel 18:4
The next paragraph is titled :"Satan tricks people about salvation.
then Satan tricks people about hell
It concludes with a paragraph asking if Sata has tricked you.
The brochure was printed by Beacon of Truth Ministries, Florence, SC 29502
This was given to my 3-year old grandson.

Now tell me that what the Vatican did by telling its members not to trick or treat is WORSE than what this lunatic Baptist Church did giving these to little children instead of treats.

reply to post by ProfEmeritus


I would do what I always do and say F*** the vatican, and then do whatever I wanted.

I got in trouble as a child with that "attitude"

And I'm allegedly Catholic.




[edit on 31/10/2009 by budski]

reply to post by budski

I would do what I always do and say F*** the vatican, and then do whatever I wanted.

How does that response address the post I just put up before your "response"?
BTW, this thread is supposed to be about Halloween, and the church, NOT your hangups with your childhood.


[edit on 31-10-2009 by ProfEmeritus]

reply to post by ProfEmeritus


true, but my childhood as a catholic with resrictions, enables, nay justify's my experience - and I didn't even bring it up.

In other words, as a catholic, I have the right, or the duty, to take the piss out of my own religion.

I wanted to leave the RCC - but according to them I can never leave once I was baptised or something

So, I reserve the right to take the piss a little.

It's amazing how I haven't been struck down by now.

Really.

Oh, don't tell me, it's a metaphor, right?

blah

reply to post by budski

I don't know who told you that you cannot leave the Catholic Church. If you really wish to, here is how you do it"

To officially leave the roman catholic church you must complete a form referred to as a "Defection by Formal Act". You can write to the archbishop requesting this and tell him under Vatican II, you wish to exercise your right to defect.... or you can print off the one I've linked.

You’ll need to provide some additional information like where you were baptised, your parents names, godparents names, and of course the date you were baptised (and if you don't have this, your date of birth will do)

So to summerise you should be able to print out, sign and send that defection form letter straight to the bishop of the diocese you were baptised in with at least
your name,
date of baptism,
parish church of baptism,
your date of birth,
your parents names,
and the local baptism records will be changed and you will be officially not catholic anymore (if you ever really were).

Reverend Dr Diarmuid Martin
Archbishop of Dublin and Primate of Ireland,
Archbishop's House,
Drumcondra,
Dublin 9.

Within a resonable amount of time you should receive a copy of your amended baptism certificate with defection written all over it.

www.stonerforums.com...
I'm certainly not telling you to leave, but if you want to, I just told you how you can do it.

The Holy See has warned that parents should not allow their children to dress up as ghosts and ghouls on Saturday, calling Hallowe'en a pagan celebration of "TERROR, FEAR and DEATH".

How Ironic that the Vatican would say that... I thought Terror Fear and Death was what they preach happens if you do not accept their views

When the Vatican can release the truth about Jesus Christ and Christianity, the whole 2 billion Christian faithful will be in awe.

The presentation within churches has been politicized for 2,000 years and the idealogy is motivated by control.

the vatican has been trying to control our lives for two thousand years......its about time they shut the hell-up and get back to that old time religion of being honest and not trying to act like they are GOD....

it is a pagan holiday called samhain celebrated by early irish pagans and shouldnt b celebrated cuz its the devils holiday.

reply to post by x2Strongx


The sad thing is this is one of the holidays with the least pagan roots. It was origanally Hallows eve or holy evening. It was the night before All Saints Day. Back then people believed evil spirits rose up on that night so people wore costumes so the spirits couldn't see them.

One of the worst grillings I've ever had was in one of my sociology classes. I wrote an essay and gave a presentation pertaining to syncretism and various pagan holidays. I covered xmas, easter, halloween, valentines day and a like one or two more. The looks on there faces were sheer delight to my eyes, but I had to deal with an unruly and crazy bunch. One person even made threats, but I could have easily beaten them up. College...fun times indeed.

And just who was it that changed the feast of Lupercalia?

[edit on 4-11-2009 by EMPIRE]

so let me get this straight.. he steals the holiday from pagans then molds it into something that sucks and when we finally start enjoying ourselves he says to not celebrate it anymore. he's suppose to be the holiest man in the world and here i am with my payless and he has prada. well, i guess i have to listen to him because he owns the queen who owns england which owns america where i'm from. hail hitl --oops, sorry wrong name --vatican!

sorry for the double post but one more thing, i wasn't celebrating halloween because it was a christian holiday, heck i'm not even christian, i was celebrating it because it brings people together and gives us happiness and the sense of holiday magic. the vatican wants to take that away? if he denies our right to stop celebrating chirstmas, the vatican better watch out.. better not cry.. 'cause santa clause-- will rough him up.

Pardon me for not reading all of this but isn't that just a little hypocritical of them.. Yes Them = So it's ok for us to believe in Aliens from outer space but something as minuscule as Hallowe'en is a no-no... Get Real….

I think that there is a movement in our culture to throw the baby out with the bathwater when it comes to our churches. The more we get into Rock and Roll screaming "hail Satan!" and dressing kids up in demonic (or worse revealing) costumes the more it leads to personal spiritual complacency.

How is it shock value if nothing is really that shocking anymore? Intsead, the culture glorifies mocking traditional values just for the sake of doing it. Parody can become reality to people, without them even realizing that they took that leap.
The same ethic of "follow the leader" that has hurt the church is now happening in secular culture.
Deep down, most people don't want their kids getting the idea that all religion is evil and deserves to be mocked, any more than they don't want a religion to impose on their lives. This type of counter-culture influences the morals of young minds the same way churches do. I want my children to make up their own minds about those things without overwhelming influences either way.

Family Guy's crude humor, and binge drinking Halloween parties can be a lot of fun; but biblical lessons like honoring your parents and being faithful to your spose are more rewarding than anything that mainstream cultural state of mind can teach.

So many people scoff at the whole system of organized religion, the younger the generation the more criticism, and yet religious war is still at the heart of our problems worldwide - we just no longer call it what it is because in the west we are Quasi-Christian ala carte secularists. "The other side is religous, and that is evil!" This pseudo religion, or self-empowered "too enlightened for religion" state of mind has the same problems as religion itself. An anti-religion seeks to impose that value on others, and believes itself more right than other systems of ethics and beliefs.

The Vatican is bad at explaining itself to the younger generations, so they act like the parents of a rebellious teenager and end up discrediting themselves while trying to teach a valuable lesson. "I forbid you to dress up because I said so!" gets a negative response. Instead, the message should be "use this holiday as a vessel to love thy neighbor, and promote your Christian values above all else you do on this day. Keep very aware that this holiday parodies very harmful things sometimes - so keep it clean!" I get what they are trying to say, but it's pointless to forbid something if they won't explain why.