To all of you that think that Iran is the big bad wolf.

The point should not be to support or not support Iran, Isreal or the USA, for that matter. The point is, why is it that the USA must be the war monger of the world? Folks, we are falling apart here in the USA, financially, morally, educationally and in every other way. We need to focus on our own sins.

I have known some dear people from Iran here in the US. They are polite and highly intelligent people with diverse religions. The couple I'm closest to practice Zoroastrianism, as do many there. There is also a sizable Christian community. No one should deny that the majority religion there (Islam) has exercised more control than most of us here in the west would like to see. But, does that constitute a reason to nuke them?

War is unending here in the USA. It is making us all blood crazy. Our corrupt leaders are doing the will of the banksters (an elite shadow government) who's main goal is reducing the planet's population by 80%, and extablishing a NWO. Bottom line is, we don't need another war.

We need to clean house here at home and as long as TPTB keep us distracted waring with everyone, they accomplish their goals and destroy our nation and further corrupt our citizens. We are witnessing The Decline and Fall of the USA. Wake up!!

reply to post by ElectricUniverse

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse


Wow...pay no attention to the paid HAMAS bloggers...

How about the thousands of innocent Israelis, and even americans who just went to visit and were blown to pieces by the palestinian suicide bombers?.....



[edit on 11-10-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

1559 killed by suicide bombings since 1993-2009.
Doesn't thousands imply more than 2000?

Between 1166 and 1417 Palestinians killed during "operation cast lead" december 27. 2008 - January 18. 2009

16 years....

22 days....


You were saying?

Originally posted by Ridhya
reply to post by john124

 

He never mentioned Iran being perfect or even better than everyone else. He is saying the propaganda of 'they hate Jews' is ridiculous, which it is.

Their treatment of homosexuals is disgusting. Two side to any story though. They get beaten up here too. Converting? In Israel if you try to convert a Jew youll go to prison... not as harsh but still criminal!

utmerket!

You are getting my point exactly Don't believe the hype

Tusen takk!

I don't claim to be well educated about the whole Israel and Palestinian situation...but this is what I believe. If "someone" forced both sides to stop fighting "or else". Which side would be the first to break the peace? My opinion is the Palestinians. That to me, makes them the bad guys. While the people may not want to continue fighting, their leadership appears to be willing to fight to the last man, woman and child...as long as it isn't them or theirs.

Originally posted by SkurkNilsen

Originally posted by Foppezao
Hey look at this! Saddam shaking hands with Rumsfeld.. what a good friends they were!... and remained so happily ever after! [atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/9862625402a0.jpg[/atsimg]

As i mentioned before Judaism doesnt force its religion to the world[submit], Islam does.Thats whats worries me. Not a country defendings its right for existence in history.
And couldn't you find any pictures of the mullahs shaking hands with some Jews? But hey Ahmedinejad, who doesnt want to hug this man?
Ever thought why Iran doesnt harm its Jewish citizins? Cause they would have ate Iran and spat them out...





[edit on 11-10-2009 by Foppezao]

If we were discussing the hipocrisy of feeding Iraq weapons and then attacking them I would comment on your completely unrelated picture

I would like you to give me a source on Islam forcing its religion on someone please.

The rest of your comment is blahblahblah and so on....

No the picture is not unrelated, it shows how unreal such pictures are through time..

"When your Lord revealed to the angels: I am with you, therefore make firm those who believe. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them". !!! -Quote 8.12, Surah 8-65.

(IsraelNN.com) Addressing a mass rally in memory of the founder of the Hamas terrorist organization, Ahmed Yassin, senior Hamas leader and former Palestinian Authority official Mahmoud A-Zahar reiterated a fundamental position espoused by Hamas and other Islamist groups worldwide: struggle for the complete obliteration of Israel and the worldwide rule of Islam.

www.militantislammonitor.org...

www.israelnationalnews.com...

quess who is sponsoring hamas, and Hezbollah?
Just look around you live in France, what is happening in your country, in Paris, but also in Belgium, Brussels, Antwerpen, Madrid, London, what happened in the Netherlands with theo van Gogh, what happened with free speech...I am really stunned by some people posting here, and you people talk about ignorance, it makes me sick


[edit on 12-10-2009 by Foppezao]

i dont think that you will get that many people agreeing with you here, they all seem to buy into the bull dished out in the media regarding iran, i do not like my government, but i still dont want america to overthrow my country. what a lot of these people dont realise is that iran has a 2 tier governing system, the religious and the elect, thats right ELECT, mahmoud i'madinnerjacket, was democraticaly elected by the people of iran. america gave them nuclear power in the 60's and now for some reason america wants to have a go at them, with the consent of the ignorant masses.
i have always known that iran was ok, its just a shame what people consider grounds for invasion these days, maybe the world should gang up on america and kick some yank arse, after all they are the biggest threat to world peace that we have

Originally posted by john124
I'm sorry, but everything you have said is irrelevant. It doesn't change the fact that this collapsing regime executed a 17 year old a couple of days ago for protesting. Hundreds of protestors have been raped, then executed - not just girls, it's the boys as well!

Did you decide to post this not very thoughtout propaganda based on a few photos alone with your untrue observations? Have you ever met any Iranian's and asked them how they feel about their govt.? In Tehran, around 90% of the people are against the govt. from many I've spoken to. However anyone feels about Israel is irrelevant in comparison to these facts and many more.


[edit on 11-10-2009 by john124]

Wow stuff like that never happens anywhere else. Nothing like that ever happens in America. Im sure there is NO SUCH DOCUMENTARY BY THE DISCOVERY CHANNEL THAT NEVER AIRED TALKING OF OUR LEADERS #ING AND KILLING KIDS. That must be an Iranian thing. Oh wait, it happens a lot of places. Executing their own people, oh wait we do that. Executing kids? Oh we do that too. Get the hell outta here with that BS. Trying to stop people from protesting, jailing, beating harrasing... THAT ALL GOES ON HERE DULLARD. Your either retarded or hoping to make others retarded with your narrow views.

We just need some nice country to come attack us and save us from our own gov. Problem there is the US gov is the only one that seems to be attacking other countries.....

[edit on 12-10-2009 by shug7272]

reply to post by Foppezao

When the LORD your God brings you into the land you are about to enter and occupy, he will clear away many nations ahead of you: the Hittites, Girga#es, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites, and Jebusites. These seven nations are all more powerful than you. When the LORD your God hands these nations over to you and you conquer them, you must completely destroy them. Make no treaties with them and show them no mercy. Do not intermarry with them, and don't let your daughters and sons marry their sons and daughters. They will lead your young people away from me to worship other gods. Then the anger of the LORD will burn against you, and he will destroy you. (Deuteronomy 7:1-4 NLT)

Guess who's sponsoring IDF and IAF?

I do not live in France, it just says I live north of Calais... But out of curiosity, what is happening in Paris?

I don't support the killing of anyone, but you have to see that the Islamic priests are spewing forth the same hatred that the Judaeic ones.

Your ignorance makes me equally sick, you seem to think that I am some kind of fan-boy of Islam like you are of Judaism, but you are so wrong.

Your refferences, www.israelnationalnews.com... are crazy fanatics that think homosexuality should be cured, idiots.

When it comes to www.militantislammonitor.org, the name says it all really, if I was to use israelhaters.com as a source I highly doubt that you would take that seiously...

I wish I coul, however, the computer that most of my intel links are on has crashed, and for that I appologize. I did have all of that saved so that I could go back and follow the trails to where they lead.

Also I appologize if I took your post incorrectly. It sure seemed to me to be way sided.

Recon3

Originally posted by SkurkNilsen

Originally posted by Recon3
You have failed to reconize the fact theat your dearly beloved Iranian leader has from his own mouth said that all Jews should be exterminated, while yet declaring that the Nazi's did nothing to the Jews and it is all false history.

Recent history, shows his regime squashing protestors (non -Jews) in his own coutry because he is evil.

I am not saying that the Jews are guiltless, but for crying out loud, they must be expected to at least defend themselves and their existance.

StagPower

I have no love for Ahmadinejad, never said so. I find his speech to the general assembly interesting and thought provoking.

Can you give me a link so I can hear him say that all Jews should be exterminated?

I know for a fact that he has said that the holocaust did happen, but that not only Jews were the victims.

His regime was "squashing" protestors, and this is something Iran should be confronted with trough the right diplomatic channels. However I think that many of these protests were staged like Sancho mentioned earlier in the thread.

Israel should be able to defend themselves, and has done so. I never even mentioned they shouldn't. However at the time they are not, now they are just torturing the Palestine people on grounds of some stone throwing and a few qassam rockets that has broken some windows.

I wish I coul, however, the computer that most of my intel links are on has crashed, and for that I appologize. I did have all of that saved so that I could go back and follow the trails to where they lead.

Also I appologize if I took your post incorrectly. It sure seemed to me to be way sided.

Recon3

Originally posted by SkurkNilsen

Originally posted by Recon3
You have failed to reconize the fact theat your dearly beloved Iranian leader has from his own mouth said that all Jews should be exterminated, while yet declaring that the Nazi's did nothing to the Jews and it is all false history.

Recent history, shows his regime squashing protestors (non -Jews) in his own coutry because he is evil.

I am not saying that the Jews are guiltless, but for crying out loud, they must be expected to at least defend themselves and their existance.

StagPower

I have no love for Ahmadinejad, never said so. I find his speech to the general assembly interesting and thought provoking.

Can you give me a link so I can hear him say that all Jews should be exterminated?

I know for a fact that he has said that the holocaust did happen, but that not only Jews were the victims.

His regime was "squashing" protestors, and this is something Iran should be confronted with trough the right diplomatic channels. However I think that many of these protests were staged like Sancho mentioned earlier in the thread.

Israel should be able to defend themselves, and has done so. I never even mentioned they shouldn't. However at the time they are not, now they are just torturing the Palestine people on grounds of some stone throwing and a few qassam rockets that has broken some windows.

I don't care how many Jews he shakes hands with, or how many puppies he hugs, it doesn't change his hateful, agitating rhetoric or the fact that the Islamic Revolution has, like all intolerant ideologies before it, turned into a tool of oppression, corruption and absolute power.

When Iran has a free press, free elections, stops the anti-Western propaganda and incitement, stops locking up and torturing political opponents, stops training and funding proxy militias, and actually starts positively engaging the world and helping to find solutions, not more problems, then I'll believe that they're nice people who want the best for the region and the world.

Until then, I consider posts like this to be nothing more than attempts to brainwash and soothe us while they arm themselves against us.

Iranian propaganda is rife on ATS at the moment. It's bad enough having to put up with their mouthpiece TV station on my Sky channels.

Originally posted by SkurkNilsen

1559 killed by suicide bombings since 1993-2009.
Doesn't thousands imply more than 2000?

Between 1166 and 1417 Palestinians killed during "operation cast lead" december 27. 2008 - January 18. 2009

16 years....

22 days....

I would like to know first of all what source you got those numbers from.

According to this. [url=http://www.mfa.gov.il/MFA/Terrorism-+Obstacle+to+Peace/Palestinian+terror+since+2000/Victims+of+Palestinian+Violence+and+Terrorism+sinc.htm]Link[ /url]

Between 2000-2003 there were 884 Israelis murdered by Palestinian terrorists, and 5932 injured. That's in three years. I am unfortunately almost certain the numbers of israelis, and including Americans murdered by Palestinian terrorists is more than 2,000. That includes at least 57 Americans murdered by Palestinian terrorists from 1993-2002.

As for operation cast lead, it was aimed at attacking HAMAS members, and most of those killed were terrorists.



[edit on 12-10-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

I guess from reading through this thread that is most certainly GAME OVER, as far as any hope of preventing another war is concerned then ?

What I am reading, is almost the exact same crap that has been spilling from the news outlets, so many of you CLAIM to be brainwashing you? I guess they won then huh?

Because if you are repeating it, that means you have fallen for it, how very sad.

News broadcast into your home tells you one thing, yet in reality, some people go out of their way to show you the truth in pictures no less, and it's deemed mostly BS, what a World we live in.

Telling us they are so wonderful, that they execute a 17 yr old for protesting, sure that's true, but who instigated these protests? was there a representative from the instigators fighting to save his or their lives? NO let them rot cos we don't care.

What a load of rubbish, what Iran does it their Business, just like what the US does is theirs, when in Rome so to speak, so we know there is corruption there, you mean to tell me there isn't in any of your countries? let he is without sin cast the first stone I think was the way the preaching went, how hypocritical.

Why don't you just come out and tell the truth, you want a War, a good ole blowing people to bits War, never mind the World consequences, or the truth.

Some of you have shown yourselves to be ignorant self righteous and damn right nasty, I hope you don't really believe what you preach, because from where I sit, and what I have read previously, then you believe what you sow your going to reap, I hope you can live with yourselves.

As for the rest of you, keep up the good fight, we are not beaten yet, not by that bunch anyhow.

reply to post by azzllin


I think you're misrepresenting a lot of people. I for one don't want war, but don't want Ahmadi to have nukes either.

I don't think you have to worry, the West has no appetite for another war with another Muslim country - too much trouble at home. Iran will probably get their nukes, and we'll have to put up with living under the perpetual threat of another nuclear holocaust for the rest of our lives.

I think we'll look back on the days when the Great Satan ruled the world with a certain nostalgia.

Originally posted by john124
I'm sorry, but everything you have said is irrelevant. It doesn't change the fact that this collapsing regime executed a 17 year old a couple of days ago for protesting. Hundreds of protestors have been raped, then executed - not just girls, it's the boys as well!

Did you decide to post this not very thoughtout propaganda based on a few photos alone with your untrue observations? Have you ever met any Iranian's and asked them how they feel about their govt.? In Tehran, around 90% of the people are against the govt. from many I've spoken to. However anyone feels about Israel is irrelevant in comparison to these facts and many more.
[edit on 11-10-2009 by john124]

Allow me to debunk your "lie" and "fabrication" and the so called "facts".
A 17yr old was not executed for protesting. Actually a 37 yr old with 5 other people (none of them under 18 yr old) are sentenced for being part of an extremist group and are charged for inciting violence in guise of protest which is mentioned below in Amnesty International article.

Zamani, 37, was sentenced to death by a Tehran Revolutionary Court on Thursday after he was convicted of "enmity against God for membership of and activities to further the aims of the terrorist grouplet Anjoman-e Padeshahi-e Iran (API)".

The API is an exiled opposition group which advocates the ending of the Islamic Republic and the establishment of an Iranian monarchy.

He was also convicted of "propaganda against the system", "insulting the holy sanctities", "gathering and colluding with intent to harm national internal security " as well as of leaving the country illegally to visit Iraq where he was alleged to have met US military officials.

Zamani is one of more than 100 people currently standing trial before a Tehran Revolutionary Court for fomenting protests against the disputed official result of Iran's 12 June presidential election. Amnesty International has condemned such "show trials" as a "mockery of justice"

Amnesty International fears that Zamani’s death sentence will pave the way for more death sentences against those being tried on similar offences. At least 13 other people are also currently at risk of being executed in Iran.

Akram Mahdavi, 35, who was sentenced to death in 2003 for murdering her 74-year old husband is reported to be scheduled to be executed in the coming days, even though her lawyer has not been informed, as is required by Iranian law.

A judicial official in Tehran told her husband's family to come to Evin Prison in the capital at 3 am on 11 October 2009 to witness her execution. Their presence is required by law.

Other people on death row include seven male members of Iran’s Ahwazi Arab minority who are at risk of imminent execution in Karoun Prison in Ahvaz city, the capital of Khuzestan province.

Source:http://www.amnesty.org/en/news-and-updates/news/iranian-protesters-death-sentence-must-be-reviewed-20091009

I think you yourself got confused from the actual facts and your propoganda. This article from Amnesty International says a person committed a crime when he was 17yr old but he has not yet been executed.

Abbas Hosseini’s was sentenced to death in June 2004 for the murder of a man who had tried to rape him in July 2003. He has since been re-tried but his death sentence has been upheld in spite of his age at the time of the alleged offence.

“Not only has Abbas Hosseini been sentenced to death for a crime he is accused of having committed as a child, but the protracted judicial uncertainty surrounding the review and retrial of his case, and the halting at the last minute of his scheduled execution, has also compounded his suffering,” said Hassiba Hadj Sahraoui.

The victim's family are refusing to pardon him in exchange for monetary compensation in the form of diyeh.

The number of stars above your 'fabricated lie' certainly is frightening. Just shows how masses choose to eat up the propoganda fed to them without researching or knowing the truth behind it at all.

[edit on 12-10-2009 by December_Rain]

[edit on 12-10-2009 by December_Rain]

reply to post by December_Rain


With all due respect you are in no position to lecture people about propaganda with that signature.

reply to post by mattpryor


I would like to explain and reply to your post if it was a "fact". However, it is not and secondly not related to this topic.

Israel has a huge stock of atomic weapons, thanks to assistance from the USA. Israel also has major supplies of anthrax and other biological and chemical weapons, again, thanks to the assistance of the US government who at one time feared Arab attacks on Israel.

These are the reasons that Israel will not allow atomic inspectors into Israel and will not sign the vaunted, American pushed, Nuclear non-Proliferation Treaty that America wants everyone else to sign, and uses pressure to achieve this, but never on Israel.

As to the poison weapons, neither America nor Israel will sign this accord banning poison weapons because they have so many in their security vaults. Thus, to many experts in the world, the US attack on Iraq for WMD and poison weapons, was very much a bald faced farce, without merit, when two of the biggest abusers of atomic proliferation and Chem & Bio WMD's were the ones calling for the war in the first place.

The US led invasion of Iraq on the pretext of toppling a dictator who possessed both Chemical and Biological weapons was both unlawful and hypocritical. Since in 1983, it was the US Dept of Commerce who licensed the supply the Anthrax and later Butlolin for their manufacture.

www.unobserver.com...

December 1988. US Giant Dow chemical sells $1.5 million in pesticides to Iraq despite knowledge that these would be used in chemical weapons.

www.historycommons.org...

July 1991. The Financial Times of London reveals that a Florida chemical company had produced and shipped cyanide to Iraq during the 80's using a special CIA courier. Cyanide was used extensively against the Iranians.

www.iwilltryit.com...

PEACE,
RK





[edit on 12-10-2009 by Rigel Kent]

My wife is a Baha'i and a refugee from Iran. Not all religions are treated equally and this is just pure propoganda by the Iranian leadership structure. He is a monster and still treats these people with much distaste.

www.youtube.com...

They executed many of these folks during the revolution and they are still treated like dogs today. I am so glad he likes the Jewish People, but the way he treates religous minorities is less to be desired.

If you research this further, you will see that the Baha'i are peaceful and have had and still do have horrible treatment under this regeim.

reply to post by romanmel


right on,

couldnt have put it better myself

PEACE,
RK