Life in an Infinite Universe..

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/272895a7b76b.jpg[/atsimg]

Liftoff

of the Delta II rocket carrying NASA's Kepler spacecraft.

(PhysOrg.com) -- NASA's Kepler mission successfully launched into space from Cape Canaveral Air Force Station, Fla., aboard a United Launch Alliance Delta II at 10:49 p.m. EST, Friday. Kepler is designed to find the first Earth-size planets orbiting stars at distances where water could pool on the planet's surface. Liquid water is believed to be essential for the formation of life.



Life in an Infinite Universe

OK now, let's assume, for a moment, that life in the universe, is ubiquitous, and that not only rockey, earth-like planets (those presently being discovered by the Kepler Telescope) but ACTUAL EARTH LIKE PLANETS, are, if not the norm, then the GOAL of any solar system, to bring about life, in all of it's multifaceted splendor and glory... ??? What if this is true?

What are the implications of that, as a reality, wherein there are more stars (suns) in the universe, than there are gains of sand, on every beach, and in every desert, on the entire face of the Earth, for all due purposes, infinite suns, and therefore even 'more' infinite planets.

Surely this means, no matter how breathtaking are the implications, throughout all the "spheres", so to speak, that life could very well BE the norm if not the exception, and at the very least rather ABUNDANT, that is, if only a portion, even a small tiny fractional percentage of a portion, of those suns were to "house" actual Earth Like Planets.

And, even though that largest sphere of a dynamic, LIVING universe, which is surely ALIVE, as the earth itself is alive, remains to us, in the realm of an "unknown unknown", I do think that it's fair to say we are entirely free to speculate, especially now, from our unique perspective in human history, and in history itself, as to what is actually out there, and how would the many forms of life, and even civilizations, which would and surely DO arise "out there" manifest THEMselves in the grand scheme of cosmic evolution?

That's how we're made as human beings, to be curious, about everything and anything, and this is the most curious question of them all.

Furtherfore, however close or far, this life and these beings are, the share with us, intimately, even in a non-local holographic manner (see Bell's Theorem), an eternally present moment in time, regardless of the time for light propogation across the breadth of the universe, that is irrelevant, where what matters is only what's going on, at this moment, everywhere and all at once.

In other words - what do you think is actually happening out there..., right now?

Think about it...it's actually happening right now, as you read this screen here "on" ATS on the "Internet", a cloud of information sharing data communications exchange, on a planet, called earth, as it circles OUR sun, an intracate (if not small) part of the barred spiral galaxy we like to call 'The Milky Way Galaxy', one in turn, of 100's of BILLIONS, if not TRILLIANS of Galaxies, and our WHOLE UNIVERSE itself but a child universe of a potentially infinite series of universes... and yet here we still sit, on ATS, pondering this..

It's all here now, and from every position, it's here, now, but my GOD - can you IMAGINE?, the realm of possibilities we're talking about here?!!! There would be room and possibility for just about any type of life, and in some places, social spheres, imaginable! And probably many very Earth like things, maybe the odd Elephant, or Giraff, no Platapusses though.. and societies, families, "hives"..!

So in a way, what I'm talking about is "science fiction", but at the same time, not at all.

SOMETHING is out there, and it's everywhere, and that something is called life. We're part of it, most likely only a small part of a vast ocean just teeming with it.

So what forms will or might it have taken, and may be TAKING NOW, even while we speak?

What, on earth or in heaven above.. - do you think, might REALLY be going on, right now, in the Universe, where life itself appears and presents itself as a type of magnet or 'strange attractor', producing even sentient life, as on earth, in US of ALL things.. (and what are the possibilities of THAT, that you are even here as a human being to begin with??!)



The implications are absolutely astonishing, and the probability for a universe just TEEMING with life, like God's own giant personal fishtank, is astronomically high.


With that set as the framework ie: everything everywhere, how can we refrain from imagining, what it actually IS, in reality, and what the universal implications of that might be, even as it might impinge upon us and our responsibilities here on earth, and TO the earth, the universe, and to one another.. or even, to the other sentient beings in the universe at large... ?

And from the perspective of these other living planets and evoloved social spheres and technological civilizations, spiritual understandings.. provided the universe IS indeed non-local and holographic in nature (which it is), then what signal or message might we, from this sphere of influence, be sending out, everywhere..?

Is there such a thing as "isolate consciousness"..? I don't know, not if scientists David Bohm and Carl Pibram are to be believed.

And therefore, regardless of how solipsistic this may sound, could this be the one place, from among the boundless infinitude, whereby "the last shall be first, and the first, last" - given our unique position, in a seemingly infinite chain of causation and of cosmic evolution, as in fact "the last", or the least (evolved) who could be the first, because, here may be the place of all places, from which arises the greatest suffering and evil (the greatest problem in need of a solution) - something probably malignant, and outside the realm of what other civilizations surely attain to, as an ideal expression of their true nature within the largest universal framework (who have recognized their responsibilities to themselves, perhaps even to us..?). And we're talking civilizations in evolutionary development, not just over millenium, but over the course of millions of years (or longer). And could it be, maybe, that "they" are all WAITING for US, here on earth, of all places, in order to redeem creation from corruption?


I want this to be a really trippy thread about this almost unfathonable realm of possibility that is Life in an Infinite Universe, where anything goes, and where the sky is quite literally, the limit.

Cheers,

OmegaPoint

[edit on 9-10-2009 by OmegaPoint]

Yes but what is the rule (the power) that holds it all together? There has to be a source of power that gives order out of chaos. The ever elusive "god particle" wont be found because we are in a controlled environment with limits regardless of what the scientists say.

Molecules upon molecules, atom upon atom, but still the power must be ordered and controlled from a central thinking all powerful point of origin.

This is the "GOD" a real sentient being and creator of all we know.

nice thread

and yes, I can imagine

Though history we witnessed "science fiction" become reality in various ways, we saw discoveries that we thought weren't possible, we are STILL discovering every minute!
And yet, we, as this tiny little dot in the univers, we STILL know knothing on the grand scale. I'd say that leaves a whole lot of space for possibilities we can't even comprehent at this time.

life is beautiful, the universe is beautiful, how can it not be the norm? But maybe that's just my wishful thinking... either way it helps me imagine and think outside the box.

My husband is a hugh star trek fan. He's also the biggest sceptic I have ever met (on almost all topics you can find on ATS). But when it comes to space and other life in the Universe, he's convinced that we are not alone. In his words: "the universe is to big and we know to little about it to asume there is no one else out there.

S&F

reply to post by skepticantiseptic


This isn't a thread about God, but the creation itself, and the sheer magnitude of it all.

Then again I did say anything goes..

But I'm not thinking of a hiearchy in any sort of traditional human sense, but yes, there would surely be governing principals, maybe the corresponding moral equivalency to the societal implications of quantum gravity, or something like that. Maybe they've all evolved to the point of being part of God, or part of an eternal "kingdom of heaven" and are all praying like crazy for us here on earth, for THEIR sake as well as for ours..?

Anything's possible.

But I don't really want to see this thread devolve into a battle between the believers and the atheists, that's not really what it's about, although the implication could end up pointing in any direction, that is up to the reader to decide and evaluate for themselves.

reply to post by GypsK

Contemplating it fills me with energy and gives me warm fuzzies and makes me all exicted!

Too bad you can't just have sex with the universe..or maybe we do already and we just don't realize it?

Yes, things outside the box, whole other ways of looking at the world, other points of view NOT OF THIS WORLD, is what this thread is about, and you can't help but smile at the prospect, of what we're really looking at here. It's not freightening at all. Loving, if anything.

I like to imagine that they are all praying for us here on earth, having detected us spiritually. To be honest, that's my belief.

While I'm certainly amenable to the idea that there's abundant life throughout the universe, I don't like when people bandy about the word "infinite" as though it was a single number. The universe is absolutely mind-blowingly huge, but at current count there are ~1x10^80 atoms in the known universe. Now if you want to summon in the concept of the multiverse, numerous dimensions, et cetera, obviously we can speculate that things become infinite, but as we currently know it things aren't infinite just really big.

reply to post by Xtraeme


"Life in the almost unimaginably large universe" doesn't make as good a title and given the magnitude involved, it is, for all due purposes infinite, and many modern scientists are beginning to suspect that it is in fact a child universe whereby dark mattere may form the foundation of, or 'embillical chord' to, a parent universe, the implication of which, we could very well be part of an almost or infinite, multiverse.

But let's imagine, for a moment, that SOMETHING is definitely going ON "out there" and that it's very very vast ALMOST infinitely so, for our purposes.

Let's not shrink away, from the possibilities, or even the actuality of it, however hard it may be to fathom.

reply to post by OmegaPoint


I think you misunderstand my point. Personally I believe there's something bigger than a multiverse. I'm willing to go so far as to say there's very likely something called an omniverse that exists as a probability machine creating all possibilities.

However in the known observable universe we have a quantifiable and limited set of atoms. I like to keep my facts separate from my speculation. That's all.

reply to post by Xtraeme


first, I really like your avatar, I guess it shows your line of thinking a bit (not that there is anything wrong with that)

I recently learned about the amount of 'data' we humans learn over time.
It seems so that, in the 6000 years prior to 1900 we learned as much as we did between 1900 and 1950. We learned just as much between 1950 and 1970, and again that much between 1970 and 1980.
Nowdays, we learn as much in ONE month. That's an awful lot of knowledge in an awful small time range.

So that means that what you call 'fact' now, may be changing really soon

Originally posted by GypsK
reply to post by Xtraeme

 

first, I really like your avatar, I guess it shows your line of thinking a bit (not that there is anything wrong with that)

The funny thing about my avatar is I mean it two ways. First I'm pedantic as all get-out. I like my science without hand-waving.

Second, I think certain things in reality behave more or less as miracles (just look at the cosmological constant it's weird but works and we have no idea why nature would form that way), but I think these miracles can be understood in language that doesn't require superstition or soft-thinking. Put another way I think that even qualitative terms can be quantified, but to do so very likely involves a degree of math that would cause most peoples brains to go to mush.

It may have something to do with the fact that I'm a synesthete, but I've come to firmly understand that numbers aren't simply abstractions they actually represent real things. Put another way I think all things are simply numbers. Sounds weird I know, but I have some surprisingly sound logic to demonstrate why this might be true.

I recently learned about the amount of 'data' we humans learn over time.
It seems so that, in the 6000 years prior to 1900 we learned as much as we did between 1900 and 1950. We learned just as much between 1950 and 1970, and again that much between 1970 and 1980.
Nowdays, we learn as much in ONE month. That's an awful lot of knowledge in an awful small time range.

So that means that what you call 'fact' now, may be changing really soon

I welcome change! As a matter of fact I wouldn't be surprised if we eventually overturn our most cherished notions of physical reality - the laws of thermodynamics. I suspect the universe is much more dynamic than we currently understand it to be, but again facts & observation before supposition.

[edit on 9-10-2009 by Xtraeme]

A universe filled with infinite suffering. An uncountable amount of lifeforms writhing in pain. Infinite death and infinite horror without a single speck of justice or love.

no one in the universe seems to have any part in giving life to those who deserve it, only dealing death indiscriminitly leaving the helpless to bleed. There are no rewards only punishments. We are offered only a mirage of god and of love... one that fades away once touched.

maybe its a game where the winners are unable to be remebered by the dead?

Ny hope was that this thread might serve to engage the imagination, and invite it to roam freely from what is known (a very thin slice of reality) to the realm of the unknown unknown, which would require yes, speculation, and there's nothing wrong with that, when we're talking about the vastness of the universe, and the probability of life being ubiquitous.

There are things happening up there, in various places, which would cook our noodles, and it's fun to imagine what some of those things could entail, and given the numbers involved, probably do in some cases, somewhere.

But it's a type of speculation which needn't be considered a waste of time, and of course we'll never know what's happening in the universe, in totality, so what else are we left with BUT to speculate about it.

What suprises me actually is how the OP didn't spark the imagination of my fellow ATS'ers.

I think for some, attempting to even begin to imagine the unfathonable possibilities available in a living universe, I suppose is overwhelming, maybe even a fearful proposition I don't know, but it seems to me that the point of the thread was missed, and that nobody's imagination was really sparked by the possibility outlined in the OP. Oh well..

The Hubble Deep Field

Originally posted by OmegaPoint
The Hubble Deep Field

Gives new meaning to the phrase from the Lord's prayer "Thy will be done on Earth as it is in Heaven."

As above, so below. Whoa!

If the Universe is Infinite then that means that there are an infinite amount of planets EXACTLY like earth, and there are nearly EXACT copies of you on those Earths living life exactly the same or slightly differently. It is the parallel universe theory except for the fact that those infinite realities and possibilities all exist in the same universe, just at immensely impossibly far distances...