Currently there are 2795 UN-IDENTIFIED aircraft in flight

Originally posted by Udontknowme
I have shown that there are hundreds, if not thousands, of aircraft flying around that are unmarked, untracked.

And people have patiently explained to you how and why that can happen, and you have dismissed them.

I have shown that when a plane is making a chemtrail above me, it is not shown on flight aware, therefore it is a specific purpose military aircraft, spraying chemicals in our atmosphere.

You have shown nothing of the sort. You have assumed. You have dismissed any and all other possible explanation in favour of the one you yourself have chosen, for no other reason than the fact that you can chose it as it suits your argument.

I can go outside right now and assume that the strong winds I'm currently experiencing are the blast waves from a nuclear detonation 15 miles away. Its not the case. I can assume it rains because someone turns on a very large sprinkler system somewhere. Thats not the case either.

Originally posted by Udontknowme
Does this sound like they are "making it up"?

Yeah, frankly, it does.

It's from a less than authoritative source, with this disclaimer....I'll highlight the best parts....

Alien Astronomer (AA) is not to be held accountable for the factual accuracy of any article found within. Nor shall AA be held accountable for any inaccuracies of information found within the web sites to which we link. It is for you alone to determine through further research whether the information found within AA is authentic or deceptive in anyway.

Information provided within AA is provided strictly for your entertainment, as well as, a convenient aid for your ongoing research into the topics of Astronomy, Hi-Tech/Top Secret Projects, the Paranormal and Ufology. The intentions of AA is to provide you with an extensive, yet impartial view of these subjects.Source

**throws another brick against the wall**

Originally posted by Udontknowme
reply to post by neformore

 

Retired Oklahoma state judge Bill Ed Rogers now runs out of breath after walking 20 feet to the bathroom. Climbing stairs, he says, "is directly out of the question."

Rogers, does not attribute his strange malady to the mystery jets. But neither he nor his doctors can explain his breathing difficulty, which began shortly after spraying began in November, 1997, and is getting worse. The 57 year old former judge says he thought he was experiencing congenital heart failure when he was admitted into the Mayo clinic last January. But after being diagnosed with severe inflamation in his right lung, a team of top surgeons were unable to pump an unidentified "jello-like" fluid from his lung.

Edgar, Wallace, Hanford and other eye-witnesses are uneasy over the ongoing aerial "experiments and the secrecy surrounding them. "They're gettin' ready, practicing," Edgar believes, for some kind of mass population cull.

www.geocities.com...

Does this sound like they are "making it up"?

you do realize you just used a quote from some guys geocities web site about chem trails to promote your agenda. What qualifications does this guy have where we should take his opinion seriously. It could very well be you site. I don't know. Facts are a funny thing. what you have presented are pretty far from facts.


edit to add: cranberrydork, you were a bit faster. but on the same page.


[edit on 1-9-2009 by network dude]

reply to post by Udontknowme


It sounds like the guy has health issues. It sounds very dramatic. I'm sure that if his lungs were full of stuff that no one could remove he'd be in front of every major specialist in the country trying to figure out what it is.

I'm sure that whatever is in his lungs has been extracted and tested, or he's had some kind of biopsy done, and tests have been run on it.

I'm damned sure, given the recent worldwide panic over a new form of flu, that a mystery substance in someones lungs that no one could identify or remove would be a major cause for concern to world medicine. Oddly, I'm not seeing it on the national news, or international news.

I'm also sure that

"Passenger jets don't make contrails that stay and become clouds," Wallace observes.

Is a load of bunk.

I'd say it's good to know what planes are out in the skies possibly
putting out invisible pollution as the automobile but becomes the white
ice crystals that we see like for days on end.

Take Congress or your city or Country of choice and walk outside
and see the pollution and take an air swab tests.

And report back later the results.
At least get more oversight.

Originally posted by Udontknowme
I wonder how the Chemtrail Debunkers are going to explain this one.

It can't be differences in the atmosphere. Any aircraft with a tail number,
should be on that second flight tracker link.

That means there are 2795 aircraft flying around in our atmosphere that don't have tail numbers.

They have to be military, or government aircraft.

Or crop dusters and other personal planes that they dont bother with radioing towers. Not saying its legal but it happens alot.

[edit on 1-9-2009 by born-indigo]

Lots going on in the air we are unaware of thanks for bringing this to our attention. Good Find!

Originally posted by TeslaandLyne
I'd say it's good to know what planes are out in the skies possibly
putting out invisible pollution as the automobile but becomes the white
ice crystals that we see like for days on end.

Take Congress or your city or Country of choice and walk outside
and see the pollution and take an air swab tests.

And report back later the results.
At least get more oversight.

You mean like the chemmies on here who claims that an air sample, I mean a bowl from the front yard with water, proved chemtrails because of a lab report that showed 6.8 ppm of Barium, oops I mean 68.8 parts per billion.

That was a massive fail on that one. Its like you can plainly see the lab report says 68.8 per billion, but that doesnt stop chemtrail promoters on here from claiming it is 6.8 per million.

I even linked to a video that plainly shows a pic of the lab report too, but looks like the chemmies are going to just let that thread fall off without admitting to either intentionallly misleading, or just getting it plain wrong as usual.

Just because it has no information doesn't mean that it is some secret aircraft...


1. Notice the "secret" aircraft landing into KEWR, just before UPS1076?




2. UPS1076 is scheduled to land at 5:41AM. NO other aircraft are scheduled to land at the airport according to flight aware during this time frame.



3. Just as the "secret" aircraft disappears at KEWR, this pops up. It was a Federal Express Md-11 from France.


4. Now the flight history of FDX39.



CONCLUSION: Just because there is no data on it, doesn't mean it is secret.

I have shown that there are hundreds, if not thousands, of aircraft flying around that are unmarked, untracked.

No, you proved that Flight Aware does not track all flights.

another one, I added date stamp to my photographs.

Your pictures and the flight aware pictures match up perfectly.


I overlaid the entire flight path of SKW6011, over your FlightAware image. It flew right over you at about 500mph. All your images show known Airliners flying above you. They were a few minutes off, yes, but that's expected. FDX39 in the example above disappeared from the map about 5 minutes after it landed, as did UPS1076.

I just want to point out that almost every aircraft going from Denver to Tucson will fly directly above you, and you live in an area where there are very large amounts of air traffic.
flightaware.com...
8 flights a day, mostly the same type of aircraft, and that's just one route, in one direction. All but one airline on that route flies aircraft that are mostly painted white. A CRJ-200 at 32,000 feet might not produce persistent contrails, while a 737NG at 40,000 feet might.... different conditions.

[edit on 2/9/2009 by C0bzz]

reply to post by Udontknowme


Firstly I do not know anything about flying or how the USA tracks flights.

I'll admit I do find it interesting thats theres a large number of unidentified planes flying in the sky.

Knowing nothing about the subject I have read the posts from the more knowledgable members about how planes are tracked, flight paths etc

Numerous amounts of people have proved you wrong over and over again.

They have presented fact and talked from experience yet you still fail to listen and accept what your being told.

I'll chip in with what I do know; the plane tracking software will not be running real time. Others in this thread have also already mentioned that the flights are tracked by the manual passing of data that is then fed into software to give a graphical representation of where a plane is in the sky.

I suggest to read what people have been telling you because you, even though you won't admit it, have been proved wrong unfortunately.

Your logic is flawed.

reply to post by C0bzz


great job on the research. It's people like you who make ATS what it is. You could have just went away, but instead you spent a bit of time and proved your case very well. thanks.

On an average day, air traffic controllers handle 28,537 commercial flights (major and regional airlines), 27,178 general aviation flights (private planes), 24,548 air taxi flights (planes for hire), 5,260 military flights and 2,148 air cargo flights (Federal Express, UPS, etc.).

www.natca.org...

Originally posted by Udontknowme

On an average day, air traffic controllers handle 28,537 commercial flights (major and regional airlines), 27,178 general aviation flights (private planes), 24,548 air taxi flights (planes for hire), 5,260 military flights and 2,148 air cargo flights (Federal Express, UPS, etc.).

www.natca.org...

I'll admit thats a large amount of military flights in one given day but so is 28,537 commercial flights or 24,548 air taxi flights.

Do you really think if these military flights were up to no good then figures and statistics about the number of them would be freely available on the internet?

Take the commercial flights for example and imagine each one contained at least 100 passengers:

100 passengers * 28,537 flights = 2,853,700

So on an average day nearly 3 millions people are flying on commercial flights?

That sounds excessive in its self.

From the numbers quoted lets add up all flights that aren't miltary:

28,537 + 27,178 + 24,548 + 2,148 = 82,411

So out of 82,411 flights in one day only 5260 of them are military?

It isn't a lot is it when its put into perspective.

You want to think about what the numbers indicate what making those trails...

[edit on 2/9/09 by Death_Kron]

Udontknowme, I only don't know you, I aswell don't understand you.

How can you post a reply and just pretend like Cobbz post doesn't exist? It kinda debunks some of your statements.

And you said that you have proven that there are secret military aircraft that sprays chemicals into the air, just because they aren't visible on Flightaware?

Geebus! Just because they don't show up doesn't mean that the contrail isn't just a contrail, does it?

And weren't you the one who lauged at brain cancer, like it didn't exist?

Google this: Glioma, Meningioma.

Military Training Aircraft are NEVER listed on these websites. Mainly because they're civilian run - as everyone on this thread has been pointing out. I know first hand that during my pilot training we would launch anywhere from 150-250 flights per day. So factor in that there are around 10-15 training bases publicly known throughout the U.S. for all branches of service. There you go... that accounts for most of these apparent UFO's.

Then of course you have crop dusters who pretty much follow as little rules as possible. You have experimental aircraft, which would never be listed. You have military training areas, restricted areas, warning areas, etc. All of these would have extreme limitations on tracking that can be publicly viewed... for obvious reasons. I don't see the relevance of this post or how it is shocking to anyone who knows the basics of aviation. For those of you who don't know... trust me this isn't out of the ordinary... I suggest focusing elsewhere for information relating to "chemtrails".

Originally posted by Zyril
Udontknowme, I only don't know you, I aswell don't understand you.

How can you post a reply and just pretend like Cobbz post doesn't exist? It kinda debunks some of your statements.

And you said that you have proven that there are secret military aircraft that sprays chemicals into the air, just because they aren't visible on Flightaware?

Geebus! Just because they don't show up doesn't mean that the contrail isn't just a contrail, does it?

And weren't you the one who lauged at brain cancer, like it didn't exist?

Google this: Glioma, Meningioma.

I just showed that the Air Traffic Controllers association said there were 5260 Military flights per day. And weedwhacker says they don't track military ac.

I would say that it's not a stretch to say that a good majority of those 2795 unidentified aircraft, could be military flight being picked up on radar, but not shown on the list of carriers...

CObbz's first image is of a plane over San Jose airport.

Take and unfiltered look at the traffic in the area.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/5b779b16008b.jpg[/atsimg]

There's a bunch without the tail number listed. But all commercial flights will be listed under the carrier list.

That's why, if your friend is flying from point a to point b, one can look up the flight times on flight aware. Most say they are pretty accurate.

reply to post by Udontknowme


what he should've said was military TRAINING aircraft - and there are a lot of them..

Udontknowme, thank you for the reply!

Unfortunately, I don't have access to a jet aircraft at the moment so I can't do this little experiment. I would very much like to take off as VFR and then fly to a level of ~FL250 or greater (25000ft+) just to prove that I would leave contrails. I would have my friend on ground to snap some photos of me!

Does it prove anything no? But this shows the possibility that someone on ground may think that I am a secret aircraft leaving a chemtrail, and this shows the possibility that someone would look up and just realise that I'm leaving a normal contrail. This actually proves the possibility that 100% of all the trails you see in the sky can be normal contrails. I am not saying they are, even if I believe so, so you chemtrail-believers should at least be open for the possibility that you are wrong. I certainly am, but mainly because the whole theory is like taken from someones a**.

Cheers!

Originally posted by Udontknowme

I just showed that the Air Traffic Controllers association said there were 5260 Military flights per day. And weedwhacker says they don't track military ac.

ATC tracks military flights. They track all flights in controlled airspace.

FlightAware does not track military flights. FlightAware is not ATC. FlightAware does not have radar.

FlightAware does not track military aircraft and presidential movement flights (e.g., Air Force One, Marine One, etc.) are operated by the US military.

flightaware.com...

You are wrong. You have no idea what you are talking about.

[edit on 9/2/2009 by Phage]

Great Thread and very informative.
I was starting to research this very same idea of tracking flightpaths over my area a few days ago, and of course with the explicit notion of trying to understand the obvious strange aerosol clouds flying above us.

For my money, vapour trails do not `hang` around and float on the wind for hours on end, some of them showing differing shades that appear not to mix,
some with striking boundaries at the point of failure to mix.

Keep going with your research Udontknowme, I`m sure there will be many more revelations.