ATS: 9/11 threads under close staff scrutiny

I have not seen any explanation for this (but I might be wrong) and that is why I make this thread.

From my observation ATS has a different policy to the 9/11 issues as to all others. first of all I can not understand why we have following warning on ALL 9/11 threads: "Due to member demand, this forum is now under close staff scrutiny. Any inappropriate comments, insults, topic derailment, or trolling will result in immediate posting ban or account termination".

such a warning does not encourage the members to post on the 9/11 threads.

and I found it strange that such a demand concerns this particular topic and on all others comes only as a result of actual insult posts. from all the 9/11 threads I post on I can not point one with any kind of breaking of the ATS terms or conditions except one thread I made by myself.

the thread I am talking about was about the present action in NYC to support the effort for new independent investigation. the thread was removed to the trash bin for "Activist" Recruiting". I have to admit that I did ask the NYC members to sign the petition but it was not any different from the other thread I made on the "tea parties issue" in which I gave as well the adresses of the local gatherings.

so I would like to ask members in know, but more the MODs or the owners to give us a little more light on the policy on 9/11 issues.

are the 9/11 threads not really welcome on ATS? or is it only a precaution taken cause of unknown to members pressure from some kind of official institution? or is it really just some crazy fanatic of official version who does demend the staff scrutiny on all 9/11 posts?

I hope that the ATS owners/ users won't find the present thread offensive. I was only thinkig about this for some time already and wanted to find out finally.

peace

reply to post by czacza1


Well I'm obviously not a mod so this isn't "official". But I was under the impression that the forum was under heavy observation because all the flaming and arguments going on in there. It is a pretty intense forum with believers of both sides at each others throats a lot. Members were abusing other members for their beliefs and such. I don't go in there and that is one of the main reasons. But this is just my opinion though, like I said, I am not a mod.

There was a time that the 9/11 forum experienced some "9/11 madness" and it was decided (after several pleas from members) to take some action and ask members to tone it down a bit.

Offical Announcement and explanation 1
Offical Announcement and explanation 2
The above two threads should answer your question(s).

Our members have learned how to discuss the issue without having to resort to immature name-calling and insults, therefore the forum is no longer as strictly moderated as it was with the time of "the 9/11 madness".

The short answer is - be civil about it.

By all means, 9/11 threads are absolutely welcome here on ATS. The forum even has a top spot on the forum home page.

The thing is, the 9/11 topic in general is an extremely heated issue and often split between 'truthers' and 'debunkers.' This carries over into the forum. Both sides of the debate are extremely passionate, sometimes carrying over into the level of personal attacks.

So that is why it is under closer scrutiny. It's in an effort to discuss a very important and controversial issue but to keep it respectful.

HERE is a thread about it. It's really no big deal. I believe the Secret Society is another closely watched forum. The Conspiracies in Religion forum is another hot spot.

But absolutely- 9/11 discussion is appreciated and welcome. If anything else, think of it this way: It's such an important issue that the management holds it to a higher standard in an effort to maintain civility so intelligent discourse and research can come out of it.

I want to thank you all for all above informations and explanations. I am not such an old member and I did not witnessed any kind of inproper posts on the 9/11 forums yet. but I do belive that this has happened before.

anyway, I would like to ask the owners/MODs to consider taking the warning off the 9/11 threads to encourage ATS members to post on that important issue.

thanks for your replies again.

Originally posted by czacza1

such a warning does not encourage the members to post on the 9/11 threads.

Exactly.

It's also much easier to get yourself permanently banned by posting in the 9/11 forum than in any other forum.

Perhaps you might like to google "gatekeeper site" conspiracy to see what other forums are doing.

[edit on 17/5/09 by Kailassa]

reply to post by Kailassa


thanks for that link. I will check it out.
cheers

Originally posted by Kailassa
It's also much easier to get yourself permanently banned by posting in the 9/11 forum than in any other forum.
[edit on 17/5/09 by Kailassa]

I cannot disagree more. I cannot imagine how you can come to this conclusion. For a start only staff knows who gets banned - we rarely, if ever do "public bannings".

Perhaps you've noticed one or two people be banned from ATS ? Perhaps people you regularly spoke to in the 9/11 forum? That doesn't mean they were banned for posting in the 9/11 forum... I cannot underline this enough: You will NEVER be banned from ATS for posting a theory - be it in the 9/11 forum or elsewhere. People are banned because they repeatedly ignore or disregard the Terms and Conditions.

reply to post by Gemwolf


Really?

Under what circumstances can a post in any other forum, made by a poster with a totally clean record, get you a warning that one more such post in the 9/11 forum will mean being banned from ATS?

I have made 2 posts on ATS that were deleted. One was a very mild one in the 9/11 forum which drew such a warning. The next was a much stronger and slightly vulgar post, (which I didn't blame the mods for deleting,) in another forum, and that drew a warning that if I made 5 more such posts I would be banned.

The disciplinary measures for the 9/11 forum are indisputably different to those in other forums.

reply to post by Kailassa


No they aren't.

Had you posted such material on any of the other boards, you would have been handed the same slap on the wrist.

There are boards that must be handled by mods more than others, simply for the reason that we sometimes forget our manners when speaking about such debated topics like 9/11 for example.

If you don't believe, post something vulgar in the break news board and see how long it takes for a mod to take it off, I promise it will be dealt with the same way .

~Keeper

People were getting very rude and offensive and offended and hurt a few years ago in that forum. I don't think it would change very much from that if they took the warning off. Although some of the chaos has died down, I do remember people being called liars and all sorts of nastiness.

It was worse than any of the other boards.

Originally posted by Kailassa
reply to post by Gemwolf

 

Really?
Under what circumstances can a post in any other forum, made by a poster with a totally clean record, get you a warning that one more such post in the 9/11 forum will mean being banned from ATS?

It depends on the offense. However it's unlikely that it had anything to do with the fact that the post was in the 9/11 forum. It's likely that if he made the same post in the "General Chit Chat forum" (for example) that it would have resulted in the same action(s). As I said, it depends on the actual post, and the way the thread was going.

Originally posted by Kailassa
I have made 2 posts on ATS that were deleted. One was a very mild one in the 9/11 forum which drew such a warning. The next was a much stronger and slightly vulgar post, (which I didn't blame the mods for deleting,) in another forum, and that drew a warning that if I made 5 more such posts I would be banned.

Again, it has nothing to do with the fact that the post was in the 9/11 forum. You received a warning. Any warning U2U will point out that if you receive 5 warnings you are automatically post banned (no matter in which forum the post was warned). When you are post banned it simply means that you cannot make a post for a minimum of 3 days. Your account is then also reviewed by the staff. If the member has a relatively "clean history" he will receive his posting privileges back after 3 days.

A post ban is different from a permanent ban. With a permanent ban you are (obviously) permanently banned from the site. This usually happens after said member has been post banned several times, and refuses to honour the terms and conditions he agreed to.

Originally posted by Kailassa
The disciplinary measures for the 9/11 forum are indisputably different to those in other forums.

We were at the time of the "9/11 madness" more strict. But generally speaking you are NOT more likely to be banned from ATS because you frequent the 9/11 forum. There is simply no truth in that.

reply to post by tothetenthpower

Did you bother to actually read more than the first line of my post?

I made a worse post on another forum and got a much milder penalty.
Different rules apply in the 9/11 forum.

However you really shouldn't take my word for the fact.
Read what Skeptic Overlord has to say on the subject instead.
He does seem to have a fair idea what's going on in ATS.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by Kailassa
However you really shouldn't take my word for the fact.
Read what Skeptic Overlord has to say on the subject instead.
He does seem to have a fair idea what's going on in ATS.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

That link was indeed provided earlier in the thread. That was the announcement about the "9/11 madness". You'll notice the date of the thread is well over a year ago, and the "crack-down" did in fact work. The fact remains that you are not more likely to be banned from ATS because you post in the 9/11 forum.

Originally posted by Gemwolf

Again, it has nothing to do with the fact that the post was in the 9/11 forum. You received a warning. Any warning U2U will point out that if you receive 5 warnings you are automatically post banned (no matter in which forum the post was warned). When you are post banned it simply means that you cannot make a post for a minimum of 3 days. Your account is then also reviewed by the staff. If the member has a relatively "clean history" he will receive his posting privileges back after 3 days.

I must be very bad at explaining myself if you still don't understand.

The warning I received was specific to the 9/11 forum.
I received it late last year.
It was my first warning ever.
It said I would lose posting privileges for ONE more offence.
- Not five more, one more.

New 9/11 Forum Warning Beginning at the time of this announcement, if your post contains a personality attack against anyone, no matter if your target is an ATS member or not, within the 9/11 Forum, it will be removed and replaced with this graphic:

You will also receive a warning and points penalty. IMPORTANT! If a second infraction is encountered, even if we're applying the warns within seconds of each other and you have not seen the first warning yet, your posting privileges will be removed.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

I'd like to make it clear that I'm not complaining about the system, I'm simply trying to convey a fact.

The people who run a site have the right to make whatever rules they see fit. I simply refrain from posting again in the 9/11 section as a second mistake there could remove my posting privileges for an unspecified time.

Originally posted by Gemwolf

That link was indeed provided earlier in the thread. That was the announcement about the "9/11 madness". You'll notice the date of the thread is well over a year ago, and the "crack-down" did in fact work. The fact remains that you are not more likely to be banned from ATS because you post in the 9/11 forum.

That system is still the most recent one publicly stated, and as I was disciplined under it only 6 months back I see no reason to believe I could not be again.

I'd happily take your word for it that you would not apply this, but I have seen no official statement that this policy is no longer enforced.

Originally posted by Kailassa
The warning I received was specific to the 9/11 forum.
I received it late last year.
It was my first warning ever.
It said I would lose posting privileges for ONE more offence.
- Not five more, one more.

Ah. That would be my mistake because I assumed. When you said you received a "warning" I assumed you received the "red tag warning". Staff refers to the warning you received as a "9/11 madness" warning thus the reason for our miscommunication. I understand your concerns better now.

Originally posted by Kailassa
The people who run a site have the right to make whatever rules they see fit. I simply refrain from posting again in the 9/11 section as a second mistake there could remove my posting privileges for an unspecified time.

As was mentioned earlier, this announcement was made when ATS seemed to be the home of many "9/11 truthers and debunkers". The stricter policies was introduced to deter the "9/11 trolls". The "stricter rules" was effective and the 9/11 forum did in fact take a more civil atmosphere. I can assure you that you can freely post in the 9/11 forum without the fear of being banned. As long as you keep it civil and within the Terms and Conditions you can argue, debate and theorise to your heart's content.

Staff members are not Nazis. We consider a person's history before we ultimately decide to permanently ban him. Should you for whatever reason be warned again (with a 9/11 madness warning) the likelihood of you being banned is very small. If you don't have a history of being a "9/11 troll" it would only make sense that you aren't treated (banned) like one.

I hope you feel a bit more at ease now. You really shouldn't "post in fear". Not in the 9/11 forum. Not in any other forum on ATS.

reply to post by Gemwolf

Thank you for you understanding replies.
I do appreciate the trouble you have gone to.