Why are they tracking every American household by GPS?

I am sure that in some areas they do not need face to face confirmation and other areas they do.

If not, then why in the OP's video does the census guy need to knock at the door?

but then again, I went through all that on page 2

Originally posted by suzque66
I am sure that in some areas they do not need face to face confirmation and other areas they do.

If not, then why in the OP's video does the census guy need to knock at the door?

but then again, I went through all that on page 2

Who knows, maybe the list the Census worker had showed the house as empty but it appeared occupied and the worker just wanted to be sure, maybe it isn't occupied just being renovated, maybe the worker's first day and taking extra steps. It is no different from any other census for hundreds of years except now not everything has to be handwritten over and over and over. We have technology to make the job easier.

There comes a time when you have to step back from all the paranoia and realize not every aspect or every move is someone out to get us. ATS can give you a plethora of info. you might not get elsewhere but you definitely need to know what to toss out.

Bombeni

maybe you should read the entire thread from the beginning and see comments from others that are or are not census workers and see the video that the OP posted for this thread.

If you don't think it (this paranoid topic) is real and we (I) are/am paranoid then why are you here? You may (no clue didn't check) have ideas or comments on another topic that I find outrageously paranoid.

I guess for some people their mamas didn't tell them 'if you have nothing nice to say, say nothing at all'.

what I decide to toss out of my brain, I DECIDE, not you.



[edit on 6-5-2009 by suzque66]

reply to post by suzque66



I read the OP's opening statement, that is what I was replying to, since I know people working for the Census and I know they are not NWO drones marching to orders. I stated my opinion as you have, and you have a choice to use it or toss it, just as I said earlier. It is in fact, other people who have made comments once in awhile that everything is not a plot against us, that has helped me keep a perspective.

As I said, don't let yourself become too paranoid. I am not the enemy.

P.S. If you see me on any topic and you have reason to believe unfound paranoia is occurring, please feel free to make a comment about it.



[edit on 6-5-2009 by Bombeni]

i had a lady show up at my door the other day as well.

i live 30 acres and she couldnt figure out of the office, barn, trailer, or house was the "front door". seeing as how they are about 4 acres from each other she had to wait to get ahold of me first.

she was nice, but i thought it was weird that they didnt say anything to her about WHY they wanted to track the doors within 40feet specifically.

seems weird for a census to me...

Originally posted by mahtoosacks
i had a lady show up at my door the other day as well.

i live 30 acres and she couldnt figure out of the office, barn, trailer, or house was the "front door". seeing as how they are about 4 acres from each other she had to wait to get ahold of me first.

she was nice, but i thought it was weird that they didnt say anything to her about WHY they wanted to track the doors within 40feet specifically.

seems weird for a census to me...

nothing said so far in this thread explains why they need this particular information. questionnaires will be sent out by mail. you collect your mail from whatever receptacle you had arranged with the post office. If you don't respond, someone comes to find you. what conceivable use is gps data done a year ahead of time if it's only going to be used to find humans? you might have moved in a year or be using your buildings differently. gps data or not, the census followup person has to tramp around looking for you. just because you were in your shop this time, you might be in your barn when the census taker comes.

Census workers: what are your instructions on multiple buildings on a property? Do you take coordinates for each building? Do you determine which is living space and which is office or business space?

for newcomers, this is really not about paranoia (except maybe the time traveling robot possibility) it's about wondering why the census is taking this data rather than usgs or somebody who maps things, and if it will be used to identify personal data in a seemingly impersonal way so that we don't have the privacy guaranteed by the laws governing the census. (personally I'm not keen on being visited by ACORN workers, with them having a government excuse for wandering around my property asking personal questions; some might call this paranoia)

I just want to say first off, I'm a normal guy. I never worked for the government before, I had a friend who started before me and referred me to this job. I had to take a test which pretty much made sure I'm not an idiot or something, with basic math skills, map reading skills, and business type skills. I can say that if there are malicious intents, I certainly don't see any and don't know of any way that there could be. We're not to ask personal info other than if you live in a single living quarter or if you have other rooms that you rent out etc and we're supposed to have you confirm your address (so even if your house says 123 Main Street, we're supposed to ask you what your address is just in case or something). Other areas might do it differently. It seems like the regional offices make up their own ways to do these things from what I've been told. So the office in Cleveland might have their field workers doing it differently than the office in Philadelphia and etc... I know my office has us knock on each door, confirm the address, and just be courteous and let the owner know that we're there to simply confirm house numbers and street names. We're NOT to ask any personal info whatsoever other than the living quarter and address info. If you have someone come asking how many kids and stuff, I wouldn't answer myself, and you should probably call the Census and let them know that this person was asking these types of questions.

The thing they explained to us was that the last time they did this on a large scale was in the 2000 census. We're doing this now because they are sending the census surveys out in July of '09. So even though it's the 2010 census, its starting in 2009. Why? I don't know, probably because it's such a long process. Then in July if you don't fill out your census form, there will be people being sent out to do it manually. And according to these Title 13 laws (U.S. Code, Title 13) and Title 44(U.S. Code, Title 44, (Section 2108)), you'll be required to answer or they'll send out U.S. Marshalls to collect the info as well.
Anyways, as I said before, the last time they did this was 2000. You probably didn't know they were doing this then because they didn't use the GPS to collect a map spot and did it from their cars on paper. But what we're doing is updating info that has changed in the last 10 years. For instance new housing plans, streets etc being built, and streets being closed down and houses being condemned, all needs to be updated/confirmed for them. The paper that we hand out at each door says, and this is it directly typed, I'll also scan a copy when I can, I'm at home and my scanner doesn't work here, so I'll have to go to the library and do it, but here's what it says:

YOUR ANSWERS ARE CONFIDENTIAL

Your answers are confidential and protected by law. All U.S. Census Bureau employees have taken an oath and are subject to a jail term, a fine, or both if they disclose ANY information that could identify you or your household. Your answers will only be used for statistical purposes, and no other purpose. As allowed by law, your census data becomes public after 72 years. This information can be used for family history and other types of historical research.

You are required by law to provide the information requested. These federal laws are found in the U.S. Code, Title 13 (Sections 9, 141, 193, 214, and 221) and Title 44 (section 2108). Please visit our Web site at and click on "Protecting Your Answers" to learn more about our privacy policy and data protection.

Thank you for your cooperation. The Census Bureau appreciates your help.

Respondents are not required to respond to any information collection unless it displays a valid approval number from the office of Management and Budget.

The approval number for the collection of address information in 2009 is OMB 0607-0809. Send any comments concerning this collection to Paperwork Reduction Project 0607-0809, U.S. Census Burean, AMSD-3k138, 4600 Silver Hill Road, Washington DC 20233. Or email your comments to ; use "Paperwork Project 0607-0809" as the subject.

The approval number for the collection of personal address information in 2010 is OMB 0607-0919-C. Send any comments concerning this collection to Paperwork Reduction Project 0607-0919-C, U.S. Census Bureal AMSD-3k138, 4600 Silver Hill Road, Washington DC 20233. Or email your comments to ; use "Paperwork Project 0607-0919-C" as the subject.

I'm willing to answer more questions, but will not answer anything that has to do with personal info (they count addresses and the living quarters info as personal info, we're not collecting any real personal info though so I don't know why they're being so careful. I mean anyone can find out your address, most have the number posted on their house and anyone can look at your mailbox.) So yeah, that's my two cents. I haven't heard anything about ACORN or anything, i mean hey, they might be in the office down in Washington DC, but they aren't here as far as I know.

Oh and for a property that has more than one building, we're only required to take info/coordinates for the house that is the residence. If there's a garage and it has an office in it but no one lives in it, we don't have to do anything about it. If there is more than one building that people live in then we do an individual collection for each one.

[edit on 5/6/2009 by PennKen2009]

Originally posted by PennKen2009

Then in July if you don't fill out your census form, there will be people being sent out to do it manually. And according to these Title 13 laws (U.S. Code, Title 13) and Title 44(U.S. Code, Title 44, (Section 2108)), you'll be required to answer or they'll send out U.S. Marshalls to collect the info as well.

[edit on 5/6/2009 by PennKen2009]

Ken, first I want to say that I bear you no ill will. I realize you're doing a job, and I'm not accusing you of being a 'drone' for the NWO, TPTB, or any of that tripe. I realize that the orders come from elsewhere.

This is the first I've heard of US Marshal involvement in extracting census information. It certainly puts a new complexion on the problem. How do they plan on getting around the law which, per the links you posted, indicates that the census is to be run by the Secretary of Commerce, and NOT the White house as is the current structure?

They probably better send a platoon of Marshals, because I for one will not comply with the law until those who make it do. If they want to lead, the have to get in front of the pack.

As far as the GPS collection of data goes, by itself, I have no problem with it. Census has been running their own mapping section for years, as can be seen in the links I posted above. I'm not at all against accurizing it. My problem with it starts next year, when they begin to associate those accurate co-ordinates with individuals, rather than just buildings.

nenothtu out

reply to post by PennKen2009



I know a couple of people who are working the Census, and they tell me if a form is not turned in that regular Census workers, working in pairs or more, will go to the houses and knock on the doors, with at least two attempts made, to make a face-to-face interview. Neither one I talked to today have heard of Marshalls being called in. That may be the last straw they use for households that refuse to be documented.

Maybe we are overlooking the obvious.

They say it is a cow. But if is looks like a pig, sounds like a pig and smells like a pig then it is a pig.

They already can zoom into your front door with a few key strokes. Heck, you can do it yourself. You can take you laptop to you front or back yard and wave to yourself. So it can't be about GPS mapping.

Take out your cell phone. Use you navigator or mapquest. Type in you address. It will give you door to door directions and map out every 1/10th of a mile. So this can't be about GPS mapping.

Now you have to ask yourself what are these people really doing. I don't have a clue but I am willing to bet that it is ugly really ugly and if you listen closely you will recognize that sound as the death knell of America.

Look, for the last time, the coodinates that we take are not at all accurate (20-50ft). Those coordinates are not connected to people just locations of dwelling structures. As a matter of fact if you were to live in a cave I would have to mark the entrance as your front door. I can not find you specifically by looking up these coordinates. We are not bugging your property, or persons. We are simply establishing a location where we could find your residence in the event the Census Bureau should need to contact you face to face. THe only info we are taking from the residence is house number, street name, and zip code. I am a Quality Control Lister (2nd wave checker) we are not collecting the structure material or any of that we simply classify the structure as single family (house) or multi-unit (apartment complexes) and then as habitable or non-inhabitable. Also as in the abandoned home with homeless people in it, I wrote in a comment that the house had no formal address but described it has a white single story farm house with a tin roof, no window glass, with red shutters. This is the only information we are obtaining. I hope that this will clear the air and any confusion or drama.

reply to post by LastPatriot


I apologize for my confusion. I was under the impression that the data was to improve current mapping data the Census Bureau uses. Someone above, claiming to work for the Census Bureau, stated as much. They said it was to be used to "provide the public" with more accurate roadmaps and such.

I was also under the impression that this data was to be used, by the Census Bureau next year to located holdouts that refused to return the Census forms, in which case it would be necessarily associated with individuals.

Again, I apologize for my confusion. If neither of the above are the reasons for collecting the information, why do it at all? Please straighten me out, I do so hate being confused.

nenothtu out

I don't know if anyone has mentioned this, but I'm not going to look through four pages of paranoid sweat dripping fear to find it.

The reason they do a census is for monetary reasons. They use the data for assigning how many congressmen/women are to be hired to 'represent' any given population, and the amount of taxes they can expect to get in the money bull# game, and how many soldiers they can hope to enlist from any given area to kill in foreign wars, and how much money they can get by selling the data to advertisers who use the demographics to target areas for sales pitches and... and so on... and so on... and so on...

As for them using it in some grand plan to make you all slaves, hell, you are already slaves, so why bother! You are chained by your fear, in your minds, in your wallets, and in your beliefs, whatever they are. With such a grip on your mind, and knowing what you will do before you think of it, they have no fear of you, even while keeping your fear at a fever pitch. The more fearful and mind bound you are, the easier to control you are, and the harder you will work for your Masters.

Which illusion you going to take, the red pill or the blue pill? LOL!!!!

Well, like I said, the reason I've been told, and the rest of my crew has been told we're doing the mapping is to update the Census's mapping information since the last census. Think about it, they only do this every ten years. It's just strange looking this year because this is the first time they're using HHCs to do it. I know I heard something about U.S. Marshalls being involved, but as stated above, I think it's only if someone refuses at the last straw to answer the census. Who knows what else they're using this information for, I'm just letting you all know what I and my fellow workers were told. In the handbook for Address Canvassing, the following is what we were told about why we're doing the gps/front door info stuff:

In order to conduct the decennial census, the Census Bureau needs the address and physical location of each living quarter. Address Canvassing is an operation to improve and refine the Census Bureau's Address List of living quarters before enumeration activities occur in 2010. Address Canvassing ensures the Census Bureau's Address List and maps are as accurate as possible, which will in turn, ensure the enumeration counts are as accurate as possible.

To refine the Address List, field staff, or Listers in the Address Canvassing operation, travel around assigned census blocks in a geographic Assignment Area and look for ever place where people could live, stay, or could live/stay. Listers (the address canvassers) compare what they discover on the ground to what is already in the Census's Address List. Based on the findings, the Lister will verify, update, or delete addresses already on the list, and add addresses missing from the list. At the same time, the Lister will also update maps so they reflect what's on the ground.

All completed Address Canvassing work is reviewed for accuracy in a process called Address Canvassing Quality Control or QC. A separate team of Listers, called QC Listers, conducts the Quality Control Operation.

So we're basically making the Census's maps all as accurate as possible. Whenever we look at our lists, there is no personal information whatsoever other than your address. No names or phone numbers or anything like that are available to us. No one from the census (right now) should be asking you your names or phone numbers or anything like that.

DHS , GPS and those yellow forms you filed at the sporting goods store are now being mated with the constitutional mandate for a U.S. census.

Smells like Project Bluebeam xD

The first thing that comes to my mind reading this thread is HAARP
tagging your house so they can beam their haarp beam straight to your house for the fake 'rapture'. They wouldn't need to go door to door just for GPS numbers you can get that surfing the net, mabey lazer marking? or something of the sort for haarp?

Oh and are these people just 'GPS marking' as they call it or are they also marking letter boxes with small colored dots?

[edit on 7-5-2009 by Bachfin]

reply to post by Bachfin


Nice one.

Cellphone towers can be used to read a persons brainwaves and identify them from a distance - perhaps more.

Get Ready for a Device That Reads Your Mind

*The technology is here now and it is in place everywhere... You cannot escae the cellphone towers and as they can now identify individuals via their brainwave pattern - you cannot disguise yourself.

Perhaps they are getting the GPS coordinates so that they can begin taking readings of those individuals brainwaves over a longer period of time - so as to be better able to locate and identify them when the time comes...

I ran the Census operations for an area in the Northeast back in the 1990 Census. I had over 1,200 employees in my operations: computer people, clerical people, recruiters, trainers and mostly field people. In 1990 we were introducing the TIGER mapping system for the very first time. That data collection 'map-spotted' every residential structure against all roads and geographic features. It was done by hand in the field. The collected data was then entered into a GIS database.

The maps produced were later used for the actual 'Census-taking'. In the end, there would be extensive demographic data associated with GIS data. This provides the means to do sophisticated demographic analysis. Numerous aganecies --- public and private --- use this information to determine population, cultural, educational, transportation, etc trends. This provides the basis fro planning roads, schools, hospitals planning in the public sector and stores, daycare, service businesses in the private sector.

A major problem we had in 1990 was map-spotting errors in the field. This created issues on the GIS data entry process and was difficult and time-intensive to resolve. Also, the GIS entry had to be done by manually digitizing the field-collected, hand-drawn maps. An error-prone and time-intensive process.

Using GPS field-spotting is --- for me at least --- a no-brainer. It's the same technology surveyors use nowadays. The front door is an arbitrary decision to standardize field data collection. This process drastically reduces field errors and almost entirely eliminates the manual GIS digitizing --- the field collection can just be uploaded to the GIS database. This simplifies the process, eliminates errors and dramatically speeds-up this critical pre-Census process.

The individual census data collected from your home is protected for 72 years. That means, no one has access to your answers to the Census questionaire for that period of time. The data is aggregated to the 'census block' level --- although the published data is only available at the next highest level: census block groups. The number of households in a census block varies by locale. In a city, for example, it correlates to a city block. In a rural area it will be geographically much larger and likely have a smaller number of households. There are over 250,000 block groups so you do the math to see how 'specific' the data is.

I don't believe --- having actually run the Census --- that there is anything nefarious to this at all. It is simply a continuation of the TIGER system that was started in 1990 but done more efficiently with modern technology. How I wish we had had GPS in 1990.

Why not just use Google earth or one of the other commercially available systems to get this same information? First, those systems are updated at significantly long intervals. The Census data has got to be current in order to be useful for planning and projection purposes. Also, we only collect data on residential structures. That cannot be accuratekly discerned from the commercial systems.

Seriously, nothing remnarkable with all this. This is nothing new at all. Just done more effectively.

reply to post by jtma508


Thank you for that very informative comment. That pretty much answers any questions.

I am just into this.. but if they "cloud" this behind the Census2010, anybody remembers the census 2000 "count"?, did they GPS -tagged your houses then as well?