Federal Government Paves Way for Carbon Taxes while MSM portrays Tax Protesters as Extremists

EPA takes first step toward climate change regs

WASHINGTON (AP) - The Environmental Protection Agency concluded Friday that greenhouse gases linked to climate change "endanger public health and welfare," setting the stage for regulating them under federal clean air laws.

Congress is considering imposing an economy-wide cap on greenhouse gas emissions along with giving industry the ability to trade emission allowances to mitigate costs. Legislation could be considered by the House before the August congressional recess.

SOURCE

Here we go, this is the first step in implementing a National Carbon Tax. It will be reported as "Controlling Pollution" but in fact will be another way for the top 2% to further extract any wealth left over in the lower classes after the economic catastrophe.

Now that CO2 has been labeled a pollutant, the Government can then create "caps" and force companies and business to buy "permits" for emissions. But the price for these extra taxes and fees are always passed on to the consumer.

Look forward to paying a higher price on everything from groceries to plane tickets with the added "Carbon Footprint Offset Fee" Funny how instead of reporting on this the main focus of the MSM has been on the right-wing extremists protesting taxes.

But don't worry, congress isn't going to let the EPA have all the fun, not if House Energy and Commerce Committee Chairman Henry Waxman gets his way:

Waxman Won’t Compromise on 20% Carbon Cap in Climate Measure

“I don’t think the EPA ought to be regulating carbon emissions,” [Waxman] said. Instead, pollution should be controlled by his climate-change bill, which proposes a cap on the amount a company can pollute along with the ability of companies to buy and sell pollution permits.

And who will it effect?

Critics of the bill, including House Minority Leader John Boehner, an Ohio Republican, say the climate-change bill will dramatically raise energy costs, effectively levying a tax on consumers and industries.

SOURCE

More taxes on consumers and industries, that will surely get us out of this economic slump.


But if you think that Global Warming is a scam in order to implement these new taxes and would like to protest, then you must be a right-wing extremist . . . probably breathing out CO2 all the time . . . polluter.

[edit on 17-4-2009 by DrZERO]

Cap and trade will be the DEATH of small business.
Only the MEGA RICH companies will have the finances necessary to buy the limited permits available.

The Gov. decides how many permits there are thus the Gov. controls demand and supply!!!!!

Interesting how this is turning out.
Big government and big business working hand in hand.
Sounds like Fascism to me.


.

[edit on 17-4-2009 by GuyverUnit I]

Perhaps the people of this country should call those people calling us extremists extremists themselves. They are going at this in the most extreme way. Therefore, they are the extremists. Bring in the lawyers and lets sue the government for being extremists and see how they would like that. Afterall, are not the people of this country the government and they are just our representatives. So lets investigate all of them and send them to their right places like jail. If no one stands up for their rights then we surely will lose them. Lets all do it legally and challenge them.

Its too bad this topic has been twisted to where
we think its a personal tax and we are going to get raped again!
It figures though, as skeptical as we are and since al gore is the devil
and all, the one chance we have of making polluters pay
for the cleanup they caused, HAS been polluted itself!
May even qualify for superfund cleanup money.
Apparently the economy needs a superfund cleanup also.
Whats the difference, everything is about money anyway!

No its just another tax to deride and rail against! Enjoy the air!
In other words, whatever, knock yourselfs out.
If you really give a hoot, study the way it really works.
I wont do it for you. We're done progressing, now we'll just choke........
science.howstuffworks.com...
If done right, carbon taxes on the major polluters will be a good thing.
Or, are you siding with the polluters?
I am sure we will end up screwing it up anyway.
So.....nevermind I guess. Oh and thanks!

This carbon tax talk really makes me want to go in my back yard and burn a couple truck tires for a BBQ

Humans love destroying all environments . When they mandate we have to pay in order to destroy it, it takes all of the fun out of it all.

No, I'm a tree hugger.
Definitely not in favor of pollutors.

But I do not see how cap and trade will solve the problem.
It just muscles out the little guy.

If they were truly in it to save the environment then they would mandate things like recycling plastics. Require there be a recycle station for EVERY type of plastic rather than one or two types. Right now every plastic container has a recycle code. How many codes are actually accepted at YOUR local recycler. My state takes soda bottles..... yup, just soda bottles.

And how about the ban on plastic shopping bags? You know, those flimsy bio-degradable bags at your grocer's. Use paper bags instead right? Reduces the need for plastic right? Except plastic bags were introduced back in the eighties because making paper bags required cutting down too many trees. You know, the part of the ecosystem that rids the air of CO2...

This is why I don't buy it. The tree hugging save the Earth movement has been hijacked by the PTB for their benefit.

Cap and trade is just a big government version of the stock market where they hold the golden ticket to a company's success or failure. And make a killing in the process. Basically the end of the free market.

But they would need to kill off Wall Street in order for this to succeed....
.




[edit on 18-4-2009 by GuyverUnit I]

reply to post by dodadoom


Don't get me wrong, I'm all about companies, businesses, and individuals paying to clean up their messes. Two thumbs up for personal responsibility.

The problem I have is labeling Carbon Dioxide a "Pollutant" and thereby lumping it with all sorts of toxic crap, man-made or otherwise.

The other problem I have is Congress and the Fed passing legislation, levying taxes and operating under guidelines based on the following:

The EPA concluded that the science pointing to man-made pollution as a cause of global warming is "compelling and overwhelming."

source

There has been no conclusive evidence of this, and recently many scientists have observed that the natural warming trend is coming to an end and that a cooling trend is the next possible phase in the cycle.

Yet our Federal Government and Congress are going to act and pass tariff based on "it's man made?"


Passing Laws to protect the environment, from Big Business or anyone else, good.
Passing Laws and Taxing the Public based on "Carbon Dioxide is a Pollutant", bad.

reply to post by dodadoom


I found your post IMMENSELY amusing. Thank you! I went to the link you provided, on "how stuff works". I mean, with a word like SCIENCE right there in the url, it should concern itself with the nuts and bolts of scientific appraisal of how this alleged 'global warming' works, right? WRONG. It was nothing more than a political ad on how good a 'carbon tax' would be for us, and how the TAX SYSTEM is supposed to work. I must dispute that. Since when are scientists supposed to concern themselves with political issues, and try to MASQUERADE the fluff they produce as 'science'? Politics has its own proper arena, and science has its own. The two are like apples and oranges, to coin a phrase.

This is what science looks like:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/3df475118f81.gif[/atsimg]

and this:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/b8e505a1b7d1.jpg[/atsimg]

This is what non-science (propoganda) looks like:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/fbffa19d8332.jpg[/atsimg]

Any questions?

It should be noted that only during the late Carboniferous to the early Permian, a span of about 45 million years, has atmospheric CO2 ever been a LOW as it is presently, in all of the last 600 MILLION years. During all those high CO2 'episodes', life managed to somehow hold on, diversify, and increase. Pesky dinosaurs and trilobites, with their SUVs and coal fired power plants! Serves 'em right to have had the astronomical CO2 levels they had!

If I have to pick sides, as was suggested, then I suppose I DO stand on the side of the polluters. Better them than folks who try to instill unfounded fear in me in order to pick my pockets. Isn't that how highwaymen work?

Besides, during episodes of high CO2, plant life absolutely FLOURISHES. My plants LOVE CO2. They breath it in, strip out the carbon, and give me back pure oxygen. Now, if you want to outlaw a harmful gas, I think you ought to go after oxygen. The stuff is corrosive and highly flammable. Thouroughly dangerous stuff.

Oxygen credits, cap and trade, anyone?

nenothtu out

Originally posted by dodadoom

Or, are you siding with the polluters?

Just because the idea sounds ideal does not mean so.

This is how this tax will work. Whenever the big companies have to pay more, so does the consumer.

So, while the consumers are paying more, we are making the same amount of money as before. But, the big guys will be raising their prices, while at the same time the government is getting the benefits from these taxes.

Simplified version following...
Government - GAINING MONEY
Big Business - NEUTRAL
Consumers - LOSING MONEY

Money does not pop out from the air (at least not in reality, even though our government thinks it does.

You see, the current taxes are being wasted. We do not need MORE taxes to fix the problem. We need to use the CURRENT SYSTEM WISELY, and put THAT money in the areas that ACTUALLY NEED IT...not failing car companies and banks that will just get more bailouts in the near future.

If I give you 100 dollars to buy me food for a day, and you fail to do so - is the solution to just give you more money in hopes that you will FINALLY do the right thing?




[edit on 18-4-2009 by FritosBBQTwist]

There is only one way that this would work and that would be that all the revenue from the carbon taxes goes into creating renewable energy and the discounts past onto consumers. But we all know that the money is going into E3 and Rothschild's pockets, it sickens me yet again that they are pushing this as a solution to a problem that exists only in a limited aspect. They've made everyone feel guilty about and now it's time to reap the rewards of the that they've sewed over the last few decades. Hand in hand with the government the mega corps and super rich are taking what they want, yet again.

When I've lost all those I love, I will kill them all.

reply to post by FritosBBQTwist

If I give you 100 dollars to buy me food for a day, and you fail to do so - is the solution to just give you more money in hopes that you will FINALLY do the right thing?

man that has got to be one of the best simplified examples i have ever come across!! you get a star!

now how come someone on MSN doesn't make this valid point?

Each and every living organism since the dawn of time has emitted CO2 gases from the biological waste that they create 'naturally', even a simple anal emmision produces CO2 gases...am I correct?

Not one thing on this planet has the god given right to put tax on any form of emitted gases as they do not OWN it.

With the rate at which taxes are concerned, we'll end up being taxed for sneezing/burping or coughing etc etc, its just insane.

They say that excessive CO2 emmisions made a hole in the ozone, when the hole was discovered, couldnt it have already been their to begin with?

I agree that the small companies, middle and poor classes will be the ones that struggle and become poorer and poorer.

reply to post by slowboy51


They're blaming the Ozone hole on CO2 now? When first discovered, it was "due to CFC emissions". Once they got THAT under control, why, THEN it was due to freon use. Now that they have THAT under control, oops! It ACTUALLY is due to CO2. What will they go after once they have the CO2 money-making apparatus in place? Oh, and I forgot to mention how bad nuclear war was for the ozone layer back in the '80s. Glad they got THAT under control too. Remember, it's not ALWAYS for the children. Sometimes it's for the ozone layer. Hey, can anybody tell me what gunpowder gas emissions do to the ozone layer? Maybe they can use that as an excuse to ban those evil black rifles, too.

Does anyone mention the fact that the ozone layer repairs itself anymore?

nenothtu out