Vatican's Sense of Justice: Pedophiles Stay in Church - Priests Who Ordain Women Excommunicated

Ms Magazine « Alternet.org:

The Vatican's Perverted Sense of Justice: Pedophiles Stay in the Church, While Priests Who Ordain Women Are Excommunicated

A priest who dared to ordain a woman was told he had 30 days to renounce his actions or face excommunication.

"The church believes that the intent of Jesus' founding of the priesthood is that it was reserved for men," explained Sister Mary Anne Walsh, spokeswoman for the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops. But, speaking for the group Roman Catholic Womenpriests, Bridget Mary Meehan, herself ordained in 2006 and subsequently excommunicated, disputes that teaching. "Jesus never ordained anyone," says Meehan. "And in the tradition, women were ordained deacons, priests and bishops for the first 1,200 years."

The Vatican's strong response to Bourgeois' action stands in stark contrast to its overwhelming failure to punish molesters. Even a homicidal priest, Father Gerald Robinson, who was convicted in 2006 of the satanicritualistic murder of a 71-year-old nun in an Ohio chapel (see "The Nun's Story," Summer 2006), has not been excommunicated. Though Robinson to date has spent more than two and a half years in prison and lost an appeal, he still remains a priest, albeit one quietly retired by his bishop.

Walsh's explanation: As heinous as the crime was, the Church doesn't excommunicate for murder.

The Vatican may soon have further explaining to do, this time in a U.S. courtroom. A federal appeals court ruled in late November that a lawsuit arising in Kentucky over the Vatican's negligence in dealing with sexual abuse could proceed -- the first time a court that high has recognized the Holy See's potential liability in this arena.

One of the key pieces of evidence in the lawsuit? A 1962 memo, approved by Pope John XXIII, directing Catholic bishops to keep silent about sex-abuse claims.

(Click this link to view full article: Alternet.org)

The Roman Empire still exists, and so do false-priests' lust for blood, violence, immorality, and sins in general.

Who Controls The World? Illuminati, Jesuits, Bilderberg ...

Google Video Link

A look in to the groups and secret societies that control the world. Also a look at religion, symbolism, occult and Satanism.

[edit on 14-4-2009 by News And History]

A Catholic Bashing thread. Whod'a thunk it?

Women can't be Catholic priests. Period. If any woman wants to be a priest then she needs to leave and go become an Episcopalian. They allow it. The Catholic Church doesn't. It won't ever. It's one of the rules that CAN NOT change.

There are disciplines (like letting priests marry) that can change. Then there are rules that are based upon scripture and are unchangeable. This is one of them.

As for the pedophiles ... the shuffling around and the denial were sick and wrong and illegal. Period. But that has nothing to do with the church rule of 'no women priests'

And before anyone says that not allowing men to marry somehow causes a priest to be a pedophile ... don't bother saying it. It doesn't work that way. Celebacy doesn't cause pedophilia.

As for your source for this story - Ms. Magazine -
They have no clue when it comes to Catholic theology.
They just want to bash the Catholic Church over women priests.
They should just let it be .. and if any women feels that strongly
then she obviously doesn't agree with the Catholic Church and
she should go over to the Episcopals.

I don't think the OP is "bashing" the Catholic church. I think he is just trying to show how....absurd, I think is the word I am looking for...it is that a woman wanted to preach the word God and everyone who got involved got in trouble, when some of priests are getting away with sexual molestation of young men and boys. Not to mention the case of murder. Doesn't the Bible say not to murder? If you listen to all the people who constantly quote the bible isn't homosexuality a sin? Isn't that what those priests were, in fact, being? Religious doctrine or not, it is still ridiculous. I don't think it matters where the article came from. I find it to be a good thought.

reply to post by FlyersFan


That's the unfortunate thing about many people outside the Church who have little understanding about it. They think that the Church is a democracy for everyone including those that aren't even Catholic to begin with, when in fact the Church follows a more Roman Republic model than anything else.

I know what you mean. Thanks for replying. The Vatican is a criminal-organization (members of the European Union of evil). Who doesn't know they're occultists?

reply to post by HarlieQuinn

I appreciate your comment. Thanks for sharing the truth, as usual.

reply to post by HarlieQuinn


I think that you are joking, but I'm not sure. You don't think that the OP is 'bashing' the Catholic Church?

He claims:

The Vatican is a criminal organization and that they are occultists and that they are false priests who lust for blood, violence, immorality, and sins in general.

Whether or not you agree with him, it's pretty clear that this is Catholic bashing.

Eric

reply to post by FlyersFan

As for the pedophiles ... the shuffling around and the denial were sick and wrong and illegal. Period. But that has nothing to do with the church rule of 'no women priests'

Sounds like they deserve to go to hell. Maybe you will be joining them? Seems like the catholic church is already rotten to the core. Have fun!

Originally posted by Wertdagf
Sounds like they deserve to go to hell. Maybe you will be joining them?

:shk: Case in point. :shk:

So I'm going to hell because I said that pedophiles who were in the church, and those that covered for them, were vile and broke the law?

So I'm going to hell because I said that the Catholic Church doesn't allow women priests for scriptural interpretation reasons, but the women who think they want to be priests are free to go to the Episcopalian church where it is allowed?

Wertdaft ... your post is senseless.

Originally posted by HarlieQuinn
Religious doctrine or not, it is still ridiculous.

You are free to feel that way and so you are free not to be Catholic.
No one is holding a gun to the heads of the women who mistakenly
think they are called to be priests. They are free to leave to the
Episcopal Church where they can fulfill their alleged calling to be
priests.

Everyone can interpret scripture however they wish.

If people don't like it .. they know where the door is.

There are plenty of other churches that these women can go to
who will welcome them and make them priests.

Then the women will be happy and the Catholic Church will be happy.
No problem.

Take the vatican to trial? Whos pipe dream is that?

The Vatican exists above the United States, its like a state court taking the UN to trial. It just doesn't happen, cause it cant.

I think they should change the rule that doesn't permit women to become priests. And let their priests to marry if they want to.
But that will obviously never happen, and chatolic church will forever be fanatic and outdated institution we all know and (don't) like.
Or maybe they change something, but it will be too late. It already is. They're so doomed.

i'm all for catholic bashing...the priests and all who participate should be arrested and thrown in jail...why does any country coddle these people who have sex with children. just because they wear funny hats and say they speak on behalf of the lord, does not give them the right to commit criminal acts...how many good catholics want their little boys to risk being molested in the name of having faith?

Originally posted by MrMot
I think they should change the rule that doesn't permit women to become priests. And let their priests to marry if they want to.

You didn't read my post.

- The DISCIPLINE that priests can't marry is something that can change.

- The RULE that women can't be priests is something that can NEVER change.

Disciplines and rules are two different things.
One is allowed to change. The other is not. Ever.

Originally posted by jimmyx
i'm all for catholic bashing..

Lovely. Less than 1% of all priests have ever participated in pedophilia .. but that is enough for you to decide that catholic bashing is just fine? Well .. by your standards it's just fine to bash all blacks because such a very high percentage of them (thirty percent) end up in jail and don't have jobs. How's that sit with you? :shk:

.the priests and all who participate should be arrested and thrown in jail...

Sure. The very few pedophiles who saw the church as a good hunting ground and came in inorder to stalk victims should have a trial and, if guilty, go to jail. Same with those who covered it up. ALL CATHOLIC LAYITY AGREES. So why are you insisting on bashing Catholics when such a very small percentage of priests are involved in this .. and in fact it is more dangerous to send your child to public school then to a Catholic Church? Children in public school have a higher risk of being molested then children in a Catholic church.

I don't see you bashing the entire public school system and insisting that everyone in it go to jail.

Edited to add - the protestant churches have much the same problem. Will you be calling for protestant-bashing and for everyone in them to go to jail as well?

[edit on 4/15/2009 by FlyersFan]

The catholic church is gonna go into abscurity because it insists on preserving outdated mandates and ideologies.

Just like many other ideas in the bible are far outdated, so is the perception that women cannot be priests.

Once it used to be only rich people could become priests, and that changed as well.

It wasn't until later that priests couldnt' marry becaus then the church would inherit the estate, instead of the wife.

Same reason women couldn't becom priests, because they didn't own land, so there was no benefit.

Which is why only affluent men could become priests, because they have a lot to offer.

Women are a powerful economic and educational source these days. And the catholic church is setting its own experiation date by continuuing to ignore it.

reply to post by FlyersFan


Only one of them is going to be right in the ignorant religious mindset. If you are to ignorant to undersatnd that wemon deserve the same positions as men, do you belong in heaven? The church refuses to change because they are afraid of going to hell.... sooo that means they believe all others will be punished by god in blazing hellfire for their sinfull acts of allowing a woman to become a priest.

They are fools... and never has the use of that word matched the definition so well. Im talking biblical meaning of foolish here.

reply to post by Wertdagf


Religious beliefs are just that.....beliefs. They do not necessarily have to be defined within the boundaries of logic, reason, or conventional and modern opinion.

I commend FlyersFan for at least stating her opinion and beliefs, and attempting to discuss the subject in a logical and fact-based approach, with as little spin or opinion as possible.

I'd be curious to hear what religious beliefs you subscribe to, and see how you would handle the same level of criticism and derision. Do you have the courage to do so?

And for all you posters who are insinuating that the Catholic Church is somehow in a decline or is becoming irrelevant, just remember: 50% of all Christians worldwide are Catholic, as is 1 out of every 6 persons worldwide. The sheer numbers make your positions laughable.

As for the OP: well, if you don't like the church, GTHO. Nobody's making you be Catholic. The church won't necessarily miss a few radical feminists here and there. Go be a Moonie or something.

Since this is supposed to be a conspiricy based website, and the OP's information and links are basically an opinion piece, let's call a spade a spade: this is a Catholic bashing thread.

Originally posted by Wertdagf
If you are to ignorant to undersatnd that wemon deserve the same positions as men, do you belong in heaven?

:shk: It's a matter of scripture interpretation.

If some woman thinks she's supposed to be a priest then she doesn't agree with Catholic Church teaching anyways. She should leave and go be an Episcopalian priest. She and that church agree on scripture interpretation. Why the hell would a woman stick around in a church that she disagrees with ... simply to cause trouble? She could leave and be happy with the Episcopals ... the Catholic church would be happy that she's not causing trouble ... and the Episcopals would be happy to get a new member. Everyone wins.

The church refuses to change because they are afraid of going to hell....

Oy! The Church refuses to change because it believes it has correctly interpreted scripture. It isn't going to change it's interpretaton based upon what some people think. It's not a democracy. It's not run by public sentiment. It's run from the top down .. not the bottom up.

If that keeps the Church the way it is ... so be it.
If that causes the Church to fall ... so be it.
If that causes the Church to grow ... so be it.

Whatever.

If you listen to Art Bell's very first interview of Malachi Martin (a former priest), Mr. Martin says he left the Catholic church because they were covering up child molestation. He said that it was HUGE. And this was in 1994 or 1996 (something close to that, anyway), WAY before it became common knowledge.

Man-made religions are simple traditions. The occultists, who are posing as priests & public-servants, would rather damn the general population, rather than bless them.

SpirituallySmart.com « Sex Crimes And The Vatican

Google Video Link

A secret document which sets out a procedure for dealing with child sex abuse scandals within the Catholic Church is examined by Panorama. Crimen Sollicitationis was enforced for 20 years by Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger before he became the Pope. It instructs bishops on how to deal with allegations of child abuse against priests and has been seen by few outsiders.

Critics say the document has been used to evade prosecution for sex crimes. It instructs them how to deal with priests who solicit sex from the confessional. It also deals with "any obscene external act ... with youths of either sex." It imposes an oath of secrecy on the child victim, the priest dealing with the allegation and any witnesses. Breaking that oath means excommunication from the Catholic Church.

Reporting for Panorama, Colm O'Gorman finds seven priests with child abuse allegations made against them living in and around the Vatican City. One of the priests, Father Joseph Henn, has been indicted on 13 molestation charges brought by a grand jury in the United States.

During filming for Sex Crimes and the Vatican, Colm finds Father Henn is fighting extradition orders from inside the headquarters of this religious order in the Vatican.

The Vatican has not compelled him to return to America to face the charges against him. After filming, Father Henn lost his fight against extradition but fled the headquarters and is believed to be hiding in Italy while there is an international warrant for his arrest.

Colm O'Gorman was raped by a Catholic priest in the diocese of Ferns in County Wexford in Ireland when he was 14 years old. Father Fortune was charged with 66 counts of sexual, indecent assault and another serious sexual offence relating to eight boys but he committed suicide on the eve of his trial.

Colm started an investigation with the BBC in March 2002 which led to the resignation of Dr Brendan Comiskey, the bishop leading the Ferns Diocese. Colm then pushed for a government inquiry which led to the Ferns Report. It was published in October 2005 and found: "A culture of secrecy and fear of scandal that led bishops to place the interests of the Catholic Church ahead of the safety of children."

news.bbc.co.uk...

reply to post by jimmyx


I guess it is not so much catholic bashing but the reality of catholism and of many churches which is a truth-obvious to some and as clear as mud to others. Just as my point of the possibility of the bible telling the story of two Gods, one of Love (Gen 1) the other called Lord- orchestrating war, sexual discrimination, crimes against humanity and the like.

Gen 6:13-22, God said to Noah "..two of every sort...male and female.."Gen:7 the Lord said to Noah You will take "...seven of every clean animal...a male and his female..." Note the Lords identifies male and his female meaning authority of male over female whereas Gods command shows equality within the sexes. I Corinthians 14:34-35; "Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church."...now girls know your place...lol, buts its ok to be sunday school teachers.

Check this one out when discussing God vs the Lord...
1Corinthians 14:33 "For God is not the author of confusion but of peace as in all the churches of the saints."
Genesis 11: 1-9 Now read what the Lord says in Gen 11:7-8 "Come let us go down and there confuse their language that they may not understand one anothers speech. So the Lord scattered them..."

Exodus 15:3-11 "The Lord is a man of war; Exodus 34:14"...the Lord, whose name is Jealous..".

Some Churches follow the dark Lord, and they certainly get up to some horrid stuff using the dark Lords name as their god and so they can because the dark Lord gives them vivid descriptions on how to war with humanity" Judges 8:7 "Gideon said, For this cause when the Lord has delivered Zebah and Zalmunna into my hand, then I will tear your flesh with the thorns of the wilderness and with briers!". Numbers 31:16-18; Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that has known a man intimately. But keep alive for yourseves all the young girls who have not known a man intimately." This is a dark Lord not the God of my life the God of Love (Gen 9:6)




[edit on 20-4-2009 by flashesofblue]