Don't let them tell you that "The Theory of Evolution" is a fact.

Absolute positivism is outdated as a scientific principle to base one's theories on.

Not everything has to be fact. If absolute truth is a goal that you feel is worthy to pursue, then you are totally and utterly deluded. There is no truth. You should only commit yourself to any belief if you can clearly understand its implications for society, for science and for the expansion of knowledge in general. If it expands knowledge in a consistent and logical manner, then it is worthy science. Evolution is tenable, it is logical and consistent, and it has myriad applications in so many fields that one just could not possibly imagine alone.

I encourage you to purchase and read this book, the latest breakthrough in the philosophy of science regarding the evolutionary nature of the natural and social sciences.

Mapping Reality: An Evolutionary Realist Methodology for the Natural and Social Sciences

That said, the Theory of the Evolution is not fact, but that doesn't really matter. If the point of this thread was a lesson in semantics, you have clearly succeeded in educating. Thank you. No one understood what you were saying for many pages.

Evolution is highly tenable. A world of absolute truths is a delusional world. The principles of evolution are applicable; they will cure once thought incurable diseases, they will predict economic behavior, they will help create strategic military paradigms, they help us better understand electricity... the list goes on.

[edit on 7-3-2009 by cognoscente]

I was having a lot of fun reading this thread...

A theory is not a fact because its a theory therefore its not a fact or better yet a factual fact, if was a fact or a factual fact, then it wouldn't be a theory. So a theory is not a fact and the fact that the fact is a fact, proves it is not a theory... so if it cant be proved, then its a theory not a fact because a fact has factual proof.

very interesting for 12 or something pages... now tell me..

How long are you planing to further discuss semantics?

I lol'ed IRL believe me...

I've taken the time to read both the Evolution is a Fact thread and this one. What I can tell you is to discard your dictionary and ignorance. The claim that evolution is false because it is only a theory is absolutely outrageous. The definition that your dictionary gives for "Theory" pales in comparison to the observable naturally occurring event that is evolution.

I don't know where anyone can come off saying that evolution is a lie, it is very much the truth. I'm not saying that God doesn't exist In fact, the Roman Catholic Church is down with Darwin. Such claims are for the philosophers to debate. The scientists have no debate over evolution, friend. Evolution is not steered, directed, or orderly; it is completely random.

Viruses are perhaps the easiest and fastest evolving forms on the planet, I'm sure you can understand this. Take, for example, the HIV. Virus cells infect the host, penetrating into white blood cells and directing them to produce more HIV. This virus does not think, it is not conscious in any respect, it is simply DNA coated in protein. The fact of the matter is, humanity has 18 different drugs that can eliminate this virus. The problem we're presented with is that randomly amongst the millions of viruses produced, random mutations in their genetic code will change. A DNA strand section of the eliminated HIV could be [TGGCAAGATT], but do to a minor shift in genetic code, that strand becomes [TGGCAAGATA]. This one change in DNA can be the difference between a virus population being wiped out or having a number of survivors that you can count on one hand. If the ladder is true, a new, evolved version of the HIV will surface in the host by the same process the original did, but be immune to the drug treatment.

Through random mutations, the genetic code is changed, and thus the lifeform. Evolution is a theory, yes, but not a wild conjecture. To deny evolution is to accept ignorance.

The only actual "proof" of evolution is micorevolution or small changes within a species. There is absolutely no proof of macroevolution, whereby a fish eventually became a lizard.

Even Darwin in his latter years doubted the theory of macroevolution.

Gosh this debate is so old. Belief belongs to religion; knowledge to Science. End of story. Christians can no more prove their claims that Scientist can make a drug work because they believe in it.

Hermeticus hermetica.

Originally posted by seabisquit
The only actual "proof" of evolution is micorevolution or small changes within a species. There is absolutely no proof of macroevolution, whereby a fish eventually became a lizard.

Even Darwin in his latter years doubted the theory of macroevolution.

There is no proof because macroevolution would take more time than recorded human history. One of the main principles of evolution is that the Earth is old. Much older than the four-thousand some years as some fanatics believe, we're talking in the billions of years. Human history dates back maybe 0.0000075% of the time the earth has been around, giving humanity the benefit of the doubt.

Originally posted by inkbottle
Gosh this debate is so old. Belief belongs to religion; knowledge to Science. End of story. Christians can no more prove their claims that Scientist can make a drug work because they believe in it.

Hermeticus hermetica.

I agree with this post perfectly!!!

We'll never get anywhere with the debate until there are some rules either.

Rule # 1: Don't say "The Theory of Evolution is a fact".

Let's try to not blatantly lie, then maybe we'll get somewhere!



[edit on 7-3-2009 by B.A.C.]

Originally posted by B.A.C.


Like don't say "The Theory of Evolution is a fact".

I suggest you submit your demand to every university and research institution, as well as submit to every publisher and author of articles spanning several decades. You might actually get somewhere with this.

Originally posted by B.A.C.

Cheers!

Still copying other's post exit. Hardly original, hardly creative. Highly plagaristic.



btw...people can say "Theory of Evolution is a FACT" all they want to. Who are you to demand we dont?


Cheers!!!!

Originally posted by RFBurns

Originally posted by B.A.C.


Like don't say "The Theory of Evolution is a fact".

Originally posted by RFBurns
I suggest you submit your demand to every univarsity and research institution, as well as submit to every publisher and author of articles spanning several decades. You might actually get somewhere with this.

Exactly, this is proof that Science purposely uses the incorrect terminology just to deceive.

Originally posted by RFBurns
btw...people can say "Theory of Evolution is a FACT" all they want to. Who are you to demand we dont?

Say whatever you want. If you want to think that "Theory" means "Fact" all the more power to you. LMAO Science Sheeple.

Science 101:
Theory = Theory of Evolution (Theory explains Evolution)
Fact = Evolution (Verifiable Observation)




I've been using that exit post for years. Do you think it is original? Sorry you can have it back.



[edit on 7-3-2009 by B.A.C.]

Originally posted by cognoscente
Absolute positivism is outdated as a scientific principle to base one's theories on.

Not everything has to be fact. If absolute truth is a goal that you feel is worthy to pursue, then you are totally and utterly deluded. There is no truth. You should only commit yourself to any belief if you can clearly understand its implications for society, for science and for the expansion of knowledge in general. If it expands knowledge in a consistent and logical manner, then it is worthy science. Evolution is tenable, it is logical and consistent, and it has myriad applications in so many fields that one just could not possibly imagine alone.

I encourage you to purchase and read this book, the latest breakthrough in the philosophy of science regarding the evolutionary nature of the natural and social sciences.

Mapping Reality: An Evolutionary Realist Methodology for the Natural and Social Sciences

That said, the Theory of the Evolution is not fact, but that doesn't really matter. If the point of this thread was a lesson in semantics, you have clearly succeeded in educating. Thank you. No one understood what you were saying for many pages.

Evolution is highly tenable. A world of absolute truths is a delusional world. The principles of evolution are applicable; they will cure once thought incurable diseases, they will predict economic behavior, they will help create strategic military paradigms, they help us better understand electricity... the list goes on.

[edit on 7-3-2009 by cognoscente]

Excellent Post.

Yup it was ALL about the semantics. It displays ignorance to call a Theory a Fact. Ignorance that Science is teaching. The amount of pages before someone got it proves this.

Thanks!

Originally posted by Arkahn
What I can tell you is to discard your dictionary and ignorance. The claim that evolution is false because it is only a theory is absolutely outrageous.

Where did I say Evolution is not a fact? Nowhere.

Go read my OP. It's all over the page. Evolution is a Fact. Over and over again I say it.

The point of my OP is to clear up the meaning of "Fact" and "Theory". Some people seem to have a hard time with these 2 words.

reply to post by Arkahn


So then you are saying there is no way to prove evolution occurs.

Thanks for finally ending this enduring debate.

[edit on 7-3-2009 by seabisquit]

Originally posted by B.A.C.

You said interchangeable. I have proof of that too. Period.,

sorry what now? have i denied i said interchangable or interswitchable? no

so what did i say could be switched in a sentance and it still have exatly the same meaning

evolution/ToE/theory of evolution

....hmmmm..... so i havnt said the theory of evolution is a fact ...and i havnt said fact and theory are switchable .....


so yes you have a point if your dishonest enough to copy paste speific words from my post you could construct the sentances your make believeing have been said ...but are you that dishonest? ...... baby jesus doesnt like dishonesty ..bearing false witness dont cha know me ole bean


now youve gone off semantics an into out right lies ... and as said above lying for jesus i still lying and he wont be your special friend unless your honest


so time to pull out where i have said what you are accusing me of

stating .. very specifically ..not finding the words spread throughout 1 or more posts where exactly i did say

'theory and fact are interchangable in a sentance and it still carries the same meaning'

and where did i specifically say

'they theory of evolution is a fact'

and yes we will be checking for context so quote mining will just show your even more dishonest

Now you're making words up?

your making up entire posts that no one has said to argue against ....

i think hat entitles me to make up a few words becasue ...it still isnt lying

Give it up. Troll.

please its to early for psychology ... leave the projection at home and bring some honesty with you this time sweetpea

Originally posted by B.A.C.

Let's try to not blatantly lie, then maybe we'll get somewhere!

... try it



[edit on 7/3/09 by noobfun]

Originally posted by noobfun

Originally posted by B.A.C.

You said interchangeable. I have proof of that too. Period.,

sorry what now? have i denied i ai interchangable or interswitchable? no

so what did i say could be switched in a entance and it till have exatly the ame meaning

evolution/ToE/theory of evolution

....hmmmm..... so i havnt ai the theory of evolution is a fact ...and i havnt said fact and theroy are switchable .....


so yes you have a point if your dihgonet enough to copy pate peific words form my post you could construct the sentances your make believeing have been said ...but are you that dishonest? ...... baby jeus doesnt like dishonesty ..bearing false witnes dont cha know me ole bean


now youve gone of semantics an into out right lies ... and as said above lying for jesu i still lying and he wont be your pecial friend unles your honest


so time to pull out where i have said what you are accusing me of

stating .. very specifically ..not fining the words sprea throughout 1 or more posts where exactly id i say

'theory and fact are interchangable in a sentance and it still carries the same meaning'

and where did i specifically say

'they theory of evolution is a fact'

and yes we will be checking for context so quote mining will just show your even more dishonest

Now you're making words up?

your making up entire posts that no one has said to argue against ....

i think hat entitles me to make up a few words becasue ...it still isnt lying

Give it up. Troll.

please its to early for psychology ... leave the projection at home and bring some honesty with you this time sweetpea

No see, you still haven't learned.

Evolution is not The Theory of Evolution.

Evolutionary Theory or The Theory of Evolution EXPLAINS Evolution.

They are not interchangeable.

That's why this whole argument started.

Why the religious comments?

Now quit it.


[edit on 7-3-2009 by B.A.C.]

Originally posted by B.A.C.

No see, you still haven't learned.

Evolution is not The Theory of Evolution.

Evolutionary Theory or The Theory of Evolution EXPLAINS Evolution.

They are not interchangeable.

the words are yes i know its magic

its like saying jesus instead of his full name and title christ jesus

or saying 'origins' intead of saying 'the origins of species by natural selection'

That's why this whole argument started.

Now quit it.

i beg to differ, the whole argument starte when you were asked for ANY evience of your claim that 90% of anyone state that 'the theory of evolutiuon is a fact'

and when you dint have any you began accusing us of saying it when we are saying somthing entirely different,

then you began accusing me of stating theory and fact were interchagable ...

so lets see the evience of these 90%, lets see where i or Mel tsted 'the theory of evolution is a fact' and lest see where i said'fact and theory are interchangable'

when you get caught in your own lies .... calling troll just wont help your case ... so a little honest and an admission of bieng wrong? or evidence for your claims please ....

p.s. the religeous comments are to remind you honesty should be your major concern here ... so try it id i make those 2 statement i have been accuse of or not? and can you copy paste them in an link the replies to show evidence for those quotes integrity?


[edit on 7/3/09 by noobfun]

Originally posted by noobfun

Originally posted by B.A.C.

No see, you still haven't learned.

Evolution is not The Theory of Evolution.

Evolutionary Theory or The Theory of Evolution EXPLAINS Evolution.

They are not interchangeable.

the words are yes i know its magic

its like saying jesus instead of his full name and title christ jesus

or saying 'origins' intead of saying 'the origins of species by natural selection'

That's why this whole argument started.

Now quit it.

i beg to differ, the whole argument starte when you were asked for ANY evience of your claim that 90% of anyone state that 'the theory of evolutiuon is a fact'

and when you dint have any you began accusing us of saying it when we are saying somthing entirely different,

then you began accusing me of stating theory and fact were interchagable ...

so lets see the evience of these 90%, lets see where i or Mel tsted 'the theory of evolution is a fact' and lest see where i said'fact and theory are interchangable'

when you get caught in your own lies .... calling troll just wont help your case ... so a little honest and an admission of bieng wrong? or evidence for your claims please ....

The words "Theory" and "Fact" are interchangeable is what you're claiming.

Are you even listening to yourself?

Have you went back and read your posts? You've contradicted yourself many times. Go read them in their complete context. That way I don't have to quote them and have you accuse me of editing them or something.

Your like the energizer bunny.

I don't care to argue with you. I prefer to argue science than crap.

LMAO Troll.

I don't need to prove that the Easter bunny isn't real, nor father Christmas - the burden of proof of the existence of god as a divine creator is on Christians and until they can prove he exists he does not exist.

That simple really, until you prove that god exists he does not.

Originally posted by noobfun
like i said before im willing to bet thoe instances are either slip of the tounge poor wording or someone who could use a better eductaion on the terminology and what they mean and in some(a small moinority) case probably ye someone trying to appear like they know more then they really do .. which is a way of boltering thier argument

Yes, I’m not saying that isn’t the case. Regardless of the many possible sources, the indirect affect is the increased ambiguity of terms which serve some peoples beliefs. Whether intentional or otherwise, the main problem have is that it is tolerated by people whom no better.

..the belief system hmm im not convince on .. if they think they have to believe evolution not just understand it and accept the evidence then they need better education

as does most of the planet

i dont think theres a real conciouse effort involved or secret agreement (conspiracy) to state emfatically as the op stated that 'the theory of evolution is a fact'

I believe there is one, but it operates passively on a near unconscious level for most.

so evolution is fact, evolution is thoery but as the op stated 90% of all sceintists are saying the theory is a fact ..and so far we havnt seen ANY evidence for that claim

no real scientist would ever say such a thing. The naturalist zealots are the ones responsible for the blasphemy of true science.

as i say i can imagine someone with very little scientific knowlege making that slip and not knowing it wrong, and people with sceintific understanding occasionally making it as a slip of the tounge.. i cant see any evidence of a concerted concious effort by any group let alone the scientific community to misrepresent and confuse the two statements

You can’t see it being a conscious effort; I could, but like you, I don’t think it is the case . . . I’m suggesting, for the most part, that it is happening on an unconscious level.

if youve got any to hand that are not differenciating between evolution the fact and evolution the theory for the love of god man pull em out quick so this thread actually has some substance to discuss .. pwetty please

Working on it.

Originally posted by B.A.C.



I've been using that exit post for years. Do you think it is original? Sorry you can have it back.

Sure you have....

B.A.C.
Registered: 28-2-2009
Location: Ontario Canada

Years eh...ya ok.

That avitar looks like Waitsolong's avitar. Do you think its original?

Waitsolong's recent post


btw, I used "Cheers" in forums since 1996...how about you?



CHEERS!!!!



[edit on 7-3-2009 by RFBurns]

Originally posted by B.A.C.

The words "Theory" and "Fact" are interchangeable is what you're claiming.

present evidence for that claim

stating that selection of words is interchagable evolution/thoery of evolution/ToE and the sentance still retain its correct meaning is far different to aying fact/thoery are interchangable

Are you even listening to yourself?

no its text on a screen it works better if you read it ..maybe thats the problem your having there

Have you went back and read your posts? You've contradicted yourself many times. Go read them in their complete context.

you made the calims you present the evidence its how it works

if the quotes are accurate an within context if i accuse you of anything then others wil jump on me for my dishonesty in that situation ..o fear not go find them

I don't care to argue with you. I prefer to argue science than crap.

so try doing that

fact over fiction .... so rop the fiction and present that facts ...

car/automobile they can be switche too and not alter the meaning of the statement they are found in ... language it truley is special

try again planto puto Hunnam