Israel and Hamas, We Should All Shut the Hell Up, Mods Thoughts?

I would like to start by saying that I absolutely do not condone the innocent killing of civilians on both sides, due to to arrogant political ideologies that are both as bad as one another. I also cant understand why people are taking sides on this. Thousands of people on both sides are being killed, on one side, by aircraft and missile attacks, on the other side, through rocket attacks and suicide bombings. How can you have sympathy for one lot of civilians, and not for the rest? Its absolutely pathetic, and frankly bordering on racist or hate for another culture!!!!!

Does anyone actually know the reason why the latest ceasefire collapsed? Well here it is:

On November 5, 2008 the ceasefire began to break down after Hamas militants digging infiltration tunnels into Israel were discovered by Israeli Defense Forces and fired upon. Hamas responded with a barrage of rockets which led to Defense Minister Ehud Barak giving approval for Operation Cast Lead, a series of airstrikes across Gaza, Prime Minister Ehud Olmert after discussion with Barak decided to put the operation on hold

Now in my opinion they are both to blame and the reality is, that innocent people are caught in the crossfire and deaths will occur.

Hamas shouldnt have been "digging" where they were, and Israel shouldnt have played the shoot first ask questions later card (as they do so often). So with this knowledge, why do people post anti-semitic remarks and derogatory comments towards Israel, and while others crticise Hamas for ending the ceasefire (or is it due to their religious beliefs or culture). Both sides have repeatedly said that the war is not of a religious nature but of a political nature, so there is no need for those comments.

I know we should all have freedom of speech, but the amount of hate and some of the comments out of people are just unbelievable. In fact I would even go so far as to say to the mods, and the head honchos of the site to ban talking about this, not that this is realistic. All it is doing is damaging friendhsips, bringing out the worst in people and cluttering the boards, and all because none of us no the real ideas behind the entire conflict. So should we get rid of the Israel/ Hamas threads mods?

I hope for ATS's sake, that visitors dont take a look at this site and sterotype it based on the disgusting comments being spewed out by us, it does nothing for the reputation and credibility of this site.

Peace to all of you, and please try and look from both sides

so you think

both people are at fault

got it.

Originally posted by ConservativeJack
so you think

both people are at fault

got it.

Yep that is correct, both sides are equally to blame.

I was just looking down the recent posts thread, and I couldnt see one neutral thread on the conflict, its all Israel does this, Hamas does that...

I'm just ignoring all the ATS threads about it all. While difficult as they are "cluttering the board", it is not impossible.

It's called debate. Debate is very healthy. It's good to talk in my opinion. We don't all share the same opinion. We can all learn from each other. Both sides can educate one another. As long as we're all open minded then I don't have a problem with any thread discussing the Gaza conflict.


Anyway, if you don't like what you read on these particular threads, don't participate in them. It's that simple really. I've seen a few threads over the last few days criticizing other members for the views they share. I don't understand this logic. We are all different with different views and opinions.

This site is after all a forum for discussion.

Originally posted by OzWeatherman

In fact I would even go so far as to say to the mods, and the head honchos of the site to ban talking about this,

I hate to point out the obvious but this is a discussion board. Discussion is the bread and butter for a site like this, it pays the bills.

Just because the conversation is unpleasant is no reason to ban it. Hell, that may be the very reason to keep it going.

These horrible situations will never end if everyone sticks their heads in the sand. By discussing them we may very well find a solution.

wupy

reply to post by OzWeatherman



It is difficult....It's usually something i don't get involved in, but earlier i was getting quite annoyed and heated in a thread.
I just seem to go wherever the ignorance is most rife... and at the moment it's the Israel/Palestine conflict threads.

But i agree with you, We should all just be quiet or mods just pull the threads.
I did take exception to a mod starting a particularly stupid and biased Thread though... whatever next?


[edit on 6/1/09 by blupblup]

Originally posted by paul76
This site is after all a forum for discussion.

True, but nobody is learning anything from each other , all we are doing is criticising and promoting ignorance, and mrwupy, yes it was an unrealistic option to ban it....I did say that

Like above poster said. It is a discussion board and this is a hot topic that absolutely needs to be discussed!

I cant believe you are suggesting we just ignore it and pretend as its not happening.

You've changed your tune, Ozweathersir! Moments ago you said this in another thread:

I dont condone the killing of civilians from both sides, but correct me if Im wrong, but Hamas was the side that broke the ceasefire by threatening to shoot rockets into Israeli territory...

And you should also check the history of how Hamas treats their own citizens

Until I posted the CNN video... I take it you decided?

Discussion discovers, so why tell us to "shut the hell up?"

Originally posted by OzWeatherman
True, but nobody is learning anything from each other , all we are doing is criticising and promoting ignorance, and mrwupy, yes it was an unrealistic option to ban it....I did say that

You learned yourself something today, did you not?

Originally posted by Cadbury

Originally posted by OzWeatherman
True, but nobody is learning anything from each other , all we are doing is criticising and promoting ignorance, and mrwupy, yes it was an unrealistic option to ban it....I did say that

You learned yourself something today, did you not?

That I did, you are correct

Did I learn it from here? No, I didnt....I went to a few different external sites to figure that out, hence the external quote

Originally posted by OzWeatherman

Originally posted by paul76
This site is after all a forum for discussion.

True, but nobody is learning anything from each other , all we are doing is criticising and promoting ignorance, and mrwupy, yes it was an unrealistic option to ban it....I did say that

I don't know about not learning. Maybe, in the heat of the discussion, we don't take on board on what we've been discussing. We're quite stubborn at times on ATS. Maybe, after a period of reflection, we do take on board information that's been provided by our opposites. Well, I do anyway. I don't like to admit it though.





[edit on 6uTuesday09/27/08 by paul76]

Originally posted by OzWeatherman


That I did, you are correct

Did I learn it from here? No, I didnt....I went to a few different external sites to figure that out, hence the external quote

You liar! You thought that Hamas started it and asked somebody to prove you wrong. Somebody did, and you saw. Yet we are supposed to believe that you coincidentally went off at the exact same time and found that out for yourself? Then you went and created a thread with a different viewpoint to the one you had just earlier?

Haha!


[edit on 6-1-2009 by Cadbury]

Originally posted by paul76
I don't know about not learning. Maybe in the heat of the discussion, we don't take on board on what we've been discussing. We're quite stubborn at times on ATS. Maybe after a period of reflection, we do take on board information that's been provided by our opposites. Well, I do anyway. I don't like to admit though.

Lol, yeah you would hope to think we did that hey, but I think thats rare when ones opinions are solidly concreted on one side. If anyone is to change, its the fence sitters, usually.

I would much rather listen/read a bunch of people argue with each other no matter how ugly it gets than be kept in the dark.

Debating and reading debates is a wonderful way to expand your knowledge. A heated debate is an even better motivator.

reply to post by OzWeatherman


Simple answer? It's disproportionate and a WAR CRIME.

It has nothing to do with race or religion, at least for me.

Israel is killing innocent people, Hamas does too, but not to this degree.

And what will this action achieve? Nothing!
They are creating an entirely new generation of terrorists. That's all this will do. Even a moron can see that.

As for ending discussion here about it. If you don't like the discussion, don't open the threads. No one is forced to read them.

This needs discussion, it needs debate and exposure.
Yes it's a divisive issue (although I don't see why, it seems pretty simple to me; stop committing war crimes!) but without debate extreme opinions and views only fester and grow.

Originally posted by detachedindividual

Israel is killing innocent people, Hamas does too, but not to this degree.

We now have degrees to killing the innocent? Please do tell, how many are acceptable and how many are over the line?

Does the nationality figure into this?

Is it OK to kill 10 innocent Jews with 60 rockets but not OK to kill 10 innocent Palestinians with one?

That was a seriously messed up statement my friend.

Don't worry, I've made many just like it in my time here.

I just thought it's absurdity should be pointed out.

Originally posted by Cadbury

You liar! You thought that Hamas started it and asked somebody to prove you wrong. Somebody did, and you saw.

I didnt see that in fact.....becuase I was on external site finding out for myself....its called denying ignorance...give it a go sometime