'Jesus was born in June', astronomers claim

reply to post by The All Seeing I


The All Seeing I:

You know it really doesn't matter to me the exact day. To me everyday should be as if it were Christ's birthday. We should celebrate a love that was so everlasting and filled with such mercy and grace for those such as us.

Happy Birthday to my Lord and Savor Jesus Christ

And a Blessed Christmas to everyone on ATS


Peace,
Grandma

Happy Holidays Grandma, thank you for the warm greetings, you make ATS feel more like home.

I'm not much of a believer but i am a fan of the character jesus represents. As for a date in time, much like age is only a number, we can transcend this place that's riddled with limits and deception... if we could all come to a basic understanding that there is only love and fear.

Some may call this figuratively christ & anti-christ, the only problem with such a narrowing scope in perception is that we stop taking responsibility for our actions, ie "the devil made me do it" and give up our ability to think for ourselves, ie "the lord will show me the way".

My original intent in the OP was to get those who never question, to question ie "deny ignorance"... in this equation we could say "love = truth = god" with no one philosophy or religion excluded or shown favoritism.



[edit on 12-12-2008 by The All Seeing I]

reply to post by Grandma



Grandma,

You are absolutely right. Our Lords birthday was never a scriptural holiday.

Which begs the question of why we have so many holidays that fake their legitimacy.

I suspect it'll continue to be overlooked as well.

Some Historians are leaning more to Jesus being born in the year 4AC, wonder what bright star was present then at what date.

They did their study with the assumption the historical Jesus was born in 0AC.

reply to post by HunkaHunka


Yeah, I'm sure that the Urantia book is so much science fiction. Doesn't it have charactors with super natural powers and such?

On, no, that's the bible.

What is it you believe again?

astrology not my thing but when jesus was born were there 12 m onths in the year or was it still in the time when there was 13 months in the year?

also if it was 12 month and the christ concious nbr is 8 then that would make it august, but then it leaves the question was he born in betheleham or somewhere eles and i guess the reason hes come up here on a t s is the nature of the season mass programming

John the baptist born on Passover, Jesus 6 months later would make it the Feast of Tabernacles. How did I come up with that? Well, if John the Baptist is "Elijah" like Jesus said he was, then if you are familiar with OT prophecy, Elijah comes back on passover. Jesus was said to be born near the end of summer, early autumn so the Feast of Tabernacles makes sense. The star in the sky over Bethlehem is most likely the tailed comet that was seen in 5 bce and was seen for more than 70 days as scripture puts it. Which means my assumption brings Christ being born on Sept. 25 5 bce. But it's just a theory. truth is, Dec. 25 is a pagan holiday and if you are into sacrificing little babies, by all means, who am I to judge?

reply to post by Locoman8


" Which means my assumption brings Christ being born on Sept. 25 5 bce. But it's just a theory. truth is, Dec. 25 is a pagan holiday and if you are into sacrificing little babies, by all means, who am I to judge? "

We pretty much agree, the date I have is Sept 29th, and although Dec 25th has been a commercial ripoff on the one hand and pagan connections, on the other, it is the date when the Word became flesh, as in the date of conception! [ Do the math and see ]

And yes his cousin was 6months ahead of Him.

Ive always found it ironic that the Bible says...do not look to the stars for signs, do not seek astrology for things...but yet, Christ was found by magi seeking a star in the sky.

Then still yet, we dont celebrate the actual birth day...we celebrate his birth when the sun in our sky demonstrates the death and birth of itself, which is what the ancients celebrated. On Dec. 21, the sun sits still in the sky...through the fall time, the sun moves and eventually sets as far west as it will ever go...stands still in this position for 3 days, then rises and sets again moving back to its path that it will follow ever yr. The ancients saw this as a time the sun dies for 3 days and then rises again to let them know, spring will come again, just as it does every year.

Westward leading...still proceeding...guides us to thy perfect light.




[edit on 14-12-2008 by LeoVirgo]

reply to post by LeoVirgo


" Ive always found it ironic that the Bible says...do not look to the stars for signs, do not seek astrology for things...but yet, Christ was found by magi seeking a star in the sky. "

The planets are there for signs, the moon tells us what day it is as well as planting signs and fishing signs etc not to mention the tides, Christians were only forbidden to fortune tell, to use witchcraft to tell the future.

wouldnt Christ comings be just that though...fortune telling in a way. Did the magi have the knowledge of this ancient telling of the prophecies of the stars? Just thoughts, always
LV

reply to post by LeoVirgo


" wouldnt Christ comings be just that though...fortune telling in a way. Did the magi have the knowledge of this ancient telling of the prophecies of the stars? "


I cannot say for sure on either one, as I've not studied that part yet.

I would like to know how that is looked upon by those who genuinely know. And since there are so many acting as if, and those who are deceived, it would not be a simple matter to find out, this could take a while.

Originally posted by Jim Scott
IMO He was born around Sep 29. This is due to the temple duty of the tribe of Zechariah and the star timing. However, a typical star would not have stood over Bethlehem, so I'm going with either a CHIPs helicopter with one of those big gangsta-bustin spotlights or a UFO (heck maybe a special star, since He was God).

BTW, His death would have been during the lunar eclipse at Jerusalem at approx 6pm in 30 AD on Passover.

Just so you know, the same event is coming up around 2030 or so, only this time it's a complete eclipse at exactly midnight on Passover. Get ready for His return then, 2000 years later.

[edit on 10-12-2008 by Jim Scott]

hmmm.....do you know what "like a thief in the night" means??? If you were being fecitious, ignore my post.

Does anyone believe any new outlook is going to come out of finding the correct birthday of Jesus? I'm just trying to figure out why it matters. Everyone knows Christmas is a pagan holiday, but they accept it. So I guess now we all gotta look back and figure out what else is pagan don't we?? Right guys???? Hey where'd ya go??????..........

reply to post by heyo


When one comes into the knowledge that the holiday is a fraud, it naturally raises questions and when one finds the answer it serves as a beacon for truth and repellent of lies. It's nice to win small battles , because they'll help later on in the larger wars.

" Everyone knows Christmas is a pagan holiday, but they accept it. "

I believe that crummy attitude is responsible for much of why people don't know important things, because they'd rather know some frivolous nonsense like the lyrics to a song or all about some moviestar than why things are the way they are. The system was setup like that on purpose and it is quite effective.

reply to post by heyo


As far as modern holidays with pagan traditions it would be Christmas, New Years, Valentines Day, St. Patty's Day, and Easter. The rest are man-made but not pagan in tradition. The only commanded HOLY DAYS in the bible are the 7 Holy Day Feasts and weekly Sabbath. Everything else considered a christian holiday is simply a Romanized former pagan holiday.

As far as the stars in christianity goes, it doesn't say anything of the sort. The Jews and early christians used the lunar calendar for their harvest seasons and holy days. The only thing the bible speaks against is the worship of the sun and stars. Anything considered prophecy in the sky is considered signs in heaven and that's what the star of Bethlehem was... a comet in the right place at the right time. The magi were not seers or prophets but stargazers and astronomers who knew about the prophecies of the birth of the Messiah. They put 2 and 2 together when Jupiter, Saturn, and Venus were all put together 2 years earlier than the star/comet of bethlehem. All of this occured in the constellation of Pisces which is the one that represents Israel.

There are so many times when Jesus is suspected to have actually been born that I really doubt a single month or season hasn't been speculated about.

Just on a side note, it would be thrilling to find out for absolute certain when Jesus was really born. That way Christians could get Christmas back, the world and us would still have the secular holiday of December 25th, the 'Christian Christmas tradition was stolen from paganism' argument would go away, and we could get back to the celebration of Christ's birth and not commercialism or secular imaginary symbols.

reply to post by AshleyD


Would the pagan "christmas trees" go away? Would Santa Clause go away? Would wreaths go away? Would candles and bells go away? Would mistletoe go away? Would the christmas lights go away? Would the star or angel on top of the tree go away? Would the gold and silver balls go away?

I ask these questions because they all associate with christmas and all have a "christian" meaning yet they originated in paganism. What would a summer birthday of Christ be like? Why do we exchange gifts on His birthday? The answer is the pagan holiday of Saturnalia where people exchanged gifts and children got toy dolls which represented the sacrificed children to Saturn. Truth is, Christ never celebrated His birthday and never emphasized doing so. His death was commanded by Him to remain holy and to be remembered. Why is this? Because Jews and early Christians never celebrated annual birthdays, only the actual date of birth just like the birth of Jesus in Bethlehem... a one time event and only meant for that one time.

Also, think about this for a while.... If He was born on Dec. 25 5bce, give or take a year, He'd have a different b-date every year because He used the Hebrew calendar. The Julian calendar didn't exist until after the death of Christ. His birth is not specified by date in scripture, yet His death is easily determined (Passover or Nisan 14). His birth is meaningless by now since His death marked the freedom of sin for mankind. His birth only invited the Word of God to be flesh for our sacrifice. Now that the passover lamb has been sacrificed, the birth means nothing, just a history lesson, not a time of celebration. I don't mean to sound mean about it, but it's true. Follow the ways of Jesus, right? Well, Jesus never celebrated His birthday or any other birthday for that matter. Think about that for a while.

Humans have a shallow mind. We hold on to tradition just because it's what has always been done through the families and society. This year is my first year not celebrating christmas and my family couldn't be more hateful of that fact. That opened my eyes to the fact that christmas has a tight grip on society and there's nothing special about it... at least religiously. My own mother called me a Jehova's Witness just because of my family's decision to not celebrate xmas.

If you need scripture for the mixing of pagan tradition with christian worship just read Deuteronomy 12:29-32. For the pagan customs of tree decorating read Jeremiah 10:1-5. Scripture is too strongly against pagan tradition for me to want to associate with former pagan holidays.

Have a happy december.

reply to post by AshleyD



" it would be thrilling to find out for absolute certain when Jesus was really born. "

Sept 29th is the correct day, but He didn't want His birthday celebrated, and I think most of us know that.

The 25th was the day The Word became flesh.

But we're really not supposed to be celebrating it either way.

And isn't this typical of Israel, to ignore The Law and do as our "leaders" tell us, but WHY do our leaders insist on not following the scriptures?

How many times had Israel ignored the Law and Gods commandments and gotten into trouble? Then turn around and beg forgiveness? They /we could not get our act together back then and continue into today!

And for those of you who are confused as to my use of Israel, you should know, that Israel is not just the jews! There were 12 tribes and a huge division between the north and the south, the tribe of judah was in the south.
Many tribes passed through the Caucasus mountains, where we get the term Caucasians!Many of Gods tribes of Israel, don't even know who they are, which is just what the scriptures said would happen.

[edit on 17-12-2008 by toasted]

Originally posted by The All Seeing I

The "star" was a comet seen by Emperor Agustus, that allowed him to proclaim his recently murdered daddy (Julius Ceasar) as God and himself the Son of God, even on the currency of the day (complete with Star).

The two yahoo's that never met Jesus but wrote the only letters moving his Nazarene birth to Bethlehem (to fit the Jewish model) were making stuff up at least 60 years after the criminal known as Jesus was executed by the state.

Get a life.

This is actually quite common knowledge.