The "up-to-the-minute Market Data" thread

reply to post by RetinoidReceptor


I'm sorry I disagree.....

You described fascism not socialism.

[edit on 8/6/2009 by Rockpuck]

RR wrote:

Goldman Sachs expects commodity spike next year to mimic 2008 when oil rose to 150 dollars a barrel NEXT YEAR.

That must mean GS is expecting heavy inflation by next year. Its consistent with the inflation that has come at the end of most recessions.

[edit on 6-8-2009 by fromunclexcommunicate]

reply to post by fromunclexcommunicate


They are not just expecting inflation .. They are expecting by sometime next year to be heavy in oil speculation.

What better way to get a profit right?

You start buying up the oil, then tell the World "Oil prices are gunna rise!" then the World speculates oil will go to the moon while they sell there's...

Classic pump and dump. As of right now they are the most respected investment bank in the World. And the Largest. And .. oh that's right, the Gov killed their competition never mind... what I am meaning, what GS says, is usually going to happen.. basically.. because if it doesn't, they can make it happen anyways.

I give up .. I am just going to buy a bicycle.

reply to post by pause4thought

Comments that most bad news was now out and that future results would improve had heartened investors, said analysts

Lol.. what the hell does that even mean.

I swear, some of these news articles don't make any sense what so ever. "Well another bad earnings.. looks like that's all the bad news lads, buy buy buy!"

It reminds me of when I learned French .. the hardest part about it was the use of double negatives.. didn't make sense or seem logical to my Anglo Saxon mind.. perhaps I need to just sit down and re-learn economics "bad is good, two bads is better, sell on good, buy on bad... go it.."

reply to post by Rockpuck


I've heard of the Austrian school. That must be the French school.

BTW, did anyone catch this article earlier in the week? -

This depression is just beginning

Describes the gathering storm quite nicely.

reply to post by Rockpuck


Well JPM is leasing a supertanker to store heating oil off the market so GS will probably have a dozen supertankers as well. I don't know if we can have $150 barrel oil without kindling inflation but if everyone uses bicycles for transportation maybe.

reply to post by pause4thought

It means the consumer is down-for-the-count. His credit lines have been cut, his home equity eviscerated, and his checking account swimming in red ink. That spells trouble for an economy that’s 70% dependent on consumer spending for growth….which brings us to another interesting point. The uptick in GDP last quarter was almost entirely the result of the surge in government spending; ie “fiscal and monetary stimulus”. How long can that go on? How long will China keep slurping up US Treasuries rather than let their currency rise? Here’s a clip from the Wall Street Journal on Friday:

I think everyone here has said essentially the exact same thing.

Zero Hedge: “Most interesting is the correlation between Money Market totals and the listed stock value since the March lows: a $2.7 trillion move in equities was accompanied by a less than $400 billion reduction in Money Market accounts!

Where, may we ask, did the balance of $2.3 trillion in purchasing power come from? Why the Federal Reserve of course, which directly and indirectly subsidized U.S. banks (and foreign ones through liquidity swaps) for roughly that amount. Apparently these banks promptly went on a buying spree to raise the all important equity market, so that the U.S. consumer who net equity was almost negative on March 31, could have some semblance of confidence back and would go ahead and max out his credit card. Alas, as one can see in the money multiplier and velocity of money metrics, U.S. consumers couldn’t care less about leveraging themselves any more.”

Hmmm... essentially every one of us has also pretty much said this as well...

I am telling you.. Christmas is going to be an interesting time.. the Gov cannot "stimulate" us into running to stores and buying Chinese crap .. it could be ugly.

reply to post by fromunclexcommunicate


It would kindle inflation of the commodity market, but as for the actually economy, it would trigger a steep deflationary period .. or .. rather.. extend the one we are in. Every dollar that goes to Exxon is a dollar that won't get spent at a store or on a car or on a house or ............. paying their bills. Deflation. It's how we got into this mess to begin with.

reply to post by Rockpuck


You know what, Rockpuck - I've been to a country where people give their kids a piece of fruit for Christmas. And the kids beam.

They make a meal that's slightly better than usual, then the relatives get together and have a good chat. That's Christmas.

And you know what? It beats the shop-till-you-drop consumer fest.

We've just been programmed to think an ever-increasing standard of living = life itself.

reply to post by Rockpuck

Every dollar that goes to Exxon is a dollar that won't get spent

That is a good point, since getting the American public to change their driving habits is harder than you would think. Over in Japan I have been reading about electric car development and they are starting to build charging stations to get ready for the transition. Here in the US the best way I can describe it is "MAD MAX" it almost seems that this country would rather become destitute then make changes like using public transportation.

reply to post by fromunclexcommunicate


Which is great for the environment.

Or is it?

We won't put gas in our cars.... but ... where will the electricity come from?

It will come from coal plants, natural gas plants, oil plants, bio fuel plants, nuclear plants etc...

What we will no longer pay at the pump, we will pay through our electric bill. Which will effect EVERYONE .. even if you don't drive, rates will go up.

Environmentalist imo make absolutely no sense. Oxymoron's all through their policies and beliefs.

reply to post by pause4thought


oh man you sound like my Dad.. "All I got for Christmas was an orange!" .. which I guess back in the day, in rural Pennsylvania during winter was a rare thing. But couldn't have cost more than 10 cents lol..

Christmas dinner and a new book, that's all it would take for me to have a good Christmas. Maybe some snow.

reply to post by Rockpuck


lol

Good on you.

(Truth is they get an orange, but I knew that would just sound corny!)

I'm certainly not saying economic disaster is something to wish on ourselves. But if it does come, well there might just be a silver lining.

Meantime we need to keep abreast of developments. If people really might lose all their savings and even their pension funds, the clearer the forewarnings, the better.

This post is a warning to all people who invest in ETF's (like USO, UNG, etc.) that roll over into a next month futures contract.

Date............NYMEX...UNG
3/30/2009.......3.739...15.20
4/6/2009........3.732...15.07
4/17/2009.......3.729...15.05
5/4/2009........3.725...14.51
6/3/2009........3.766...14.30
6/8/2009........3.731...14.13
6/9/2009........3.731...14.17
6/24/2009.......3.761...14.07
7/30/2009.......3.743...13.06
8/6/2009........3.743...13.20


This is the NYMEX quote for natural gas and the price of UNG. The price of natural gas is rougly the same but from 3/30/2009 to 8/6/2009, UNG is down 13% while Natural gas is actually almost 1% higher from those two dates. What a mess.

reply to post by pause4thought


Estimates place total net worth reductions for Americans at around 40+% .. taking into account lost savings in securities, equity from you're home, and savings deteriorated from rising costs of living.

The most concerning thing to me is going to be how many of them are dumb enough to jump into the rally this late in the game, just to loose everything when it tanks again..

US HOT STOCKS: Chiquita, CBS, Crox Active In Late Trading

online.wsj.com...

Chiquita's second-quarter earnings rose 46% as the food company's cost-cutting efforts offset a small drop in revenue. Shares soared 21% to $22.71 in after-hours trading as results easily topped Wall Street estimates.

reply to post by fromunclexcommunicate


Nice information. Unfortunately we strive to stay clear away from "stock picking" of any kind, or any form of direct investment advice.. Your information holds no relevance to the market as a whole..

so rock puck what do you say

are the banks using the excess reserves to highly leverage their trading desks at JPM ,GS, MS with UNLIMITED LIQUIDITY and then using there super duper trading computers to reap profits as well as buy just prior to consumers orders.....they could do this LIKE A Plunge Protection Team on steroids.

I don't see why they wouldn't be doing this ..WHAT is a more productive use of capital.....lending to consumers and small businesses when default rates are soaring and they already have to hold more and more of heir capital away for future loan losses............................................there is NO COP on wallstreet....they are all fox's in the henhouse.....and those that mean well get stone walled or sent to work as toothless regulators at regulatory agency's that are co-incidentely underfuned

strander didn't really answer the question.......

do you have an opinion on this........i mean it could be done under the guise of national security.......hell i would not even be that ticked off should the market be manipulated up......so long as they don't try and Short sell the hell out of it later in the year. I think many american's would be happy to recover some of their 401k money wether or not bankers make money in the process and manipulate the market.....so long as i said (they don't have the ability to get away with shorting it to helll

Sorry to interrupt the flow.

Hot breaking news: Blatent monetization unconvered

I haven't yet read the full article - just wanted to flag the discussion.

Originally posted by fromunclexcommunicate

US HOT STOCKS: Chiquita, CBS, Crox Active In Late Trading

online.wsj.com...

Chiquita's second-quarter earnings rose 46% as the food company's cost-cutting efforts offset a small drop in revenue. Shares soared 21% to $22.71 in after-hours trading as results easily topped Wall Street estimates.

Wow and LEAP is down almost 17%. Chiquita also had a high short interest if I am not mistaken (I read it somewhere a few weeks ago). So this could be a lot of short covering.