It seems, The Obama bashers are bitter, ex bush supporters

Originally posted by AKINOFTHEFIRSSTARS
Is that all you got out of those 2000 or so characters? I think I am going to vote for him because of half of what he represents and what the rest of the world thinks of him.

What half would that be? The part that is exactly like McCain or the other half that is exactly like McCain. They have taken no solid perspective on any sort of tangible issue. It's "Well, he said!" "Yeah, but what he said!" in the debates. Obama has stated he should "know more" about the economy, and hasn't taken a solid position, or put any forethought into the economy when he was passing $300,000,000,000.00 for the Iraq war alongside McCain.

And how the world views a presidential hopeful? Last time I checked, this was our country? Before Ron Paul dropped out, he was who the world would vote for. Did you support him then? Just like Americans, these people are given elephant man, or the jack ass. Seeing as how McCain is totally oblivious to half the things he says and does, and also a white, old, Republican, he is associated with being for war and conservatism (those things don't belong in the same sentence together.). So, naturally, those "against the war will vote for Obama given the choice out of the two. Especially with the way the exposure works for these men, and only these two men. Barack igetting hyped up to be something he is not. "Honest" is one of those things. People give him this perception as if he's a peace candidate or he's going to make things less restrictive because he's a democrat, left wing, liberal, etc..

Less restrictive?

FISA.
PATRIOT ACT.
SWITCHED POSITIONS ON IMMEDIATE WITHDRAWAL FROM IRAQ
FUNDED IT, UNTIL IT BECAME "UNPOPULAR."

I believe that he represents a new 'look' not because of his race, because of his stature and posture. He reminds me of someone who may have grown up like us.

He didn't. When going got tough for his mom, he went to live with his well off grandparents that were supposedly "racist." He never lived on foodstamps and went to an excellent prep school, or in his own words...

"For example, I was going to a fancy prep school, and my mother was on food stamps while she was getting her Ph.D."

I commend his mother, but to try and play that off in your favor and lie about it saying "When I was on foodstamps with my mother" absolutely disgusts me. He's making a mockery out of what is a reality with most people these days and he's using it as a manipulation tool. What a bastard. Some of us actually grew up on Ramen, Mac n' Cheese, and spaghetti day in, day out.. He hasn't lived like me, like us, like the average American. The only adversity this man has faced in his life is only that of which he creates to impress people. Selling out a true struggle for a vote.

Im not this big B.O. supporter, trust and believe that.

You're just voting for him for superficial reasons and because it's popular. I don't believe you or him. The rationale behind voting for either of these men is ridiculous, and gets destroyed under scrutiny, as we've already been over.

I can understand how he would make "change".

And how's that? To expand the government so they're allowed to do anything they want to the American people without repercussion? Bringing home troops right before his chance at re-election, even though the Iraqi government says "be out in 2010?" He says "change." He doesn't make "change."

I think If you add Mccain into the list of presidents, remove a few and they are almost identical.

Obama is identical to McCain on every single important issue with the exception of health care and even then, there are similarities. Understand that regardless, is all talk. Remember Bush's talk about "No Child Left Behind Act." The 90 billion dollar failure. They're just words. These men don't have the know how or the will power to create change for "the little guy," as you've seen in their consistent back and forth.

I think the next few elections are going to be similiar. It depends on the 'lesser' and hopefully we vote on the lesser and lesser until eventually the liars have no place at all.

That's the most absurd thing I've ever heard. Crooks are crooks, and in this election there is no "lesser." They voted and supported the very core things that have been crippling this nation. They did that together.

They supported domestic spying, making enemies out of it's citizens. They support a draft, which led close to 20,000 draftees in body bags in Vietnam with hundreds of thousands of draftees wounded, also known as "the working class war." He's talking about not taxing the middle class so much, but he'll sure as hell send the middle class to go fight a war they don't believe in.

They both also support NAFTA, which is a modern day slave trade and outsourcing program. Enabling slave labor to flourish and taking American jobs away from American workers. He's not going to tax the middle class anymore than they already are, but he'll sure as hell support their unemployment crisis.

When are you going to take a stand against the bull#?

I dont think we live in a perfect world, Ron Paul cant do any better than Mccain, or B.O. its about setting our future on the right course, and not remaining stagnant and that cant be done in 4 years.

Of course he can. Because he holds himself and the people who believe in him to a higher standard. He doesn't pray on their naivety about social events to capitalize on them, as does Obama and McCain. He believes in repercussions for the things he says, as the others just say "Oh, you are misunderstanding what I was saying..." over and over again.

He has convictions and has been saying the same thing over and over again. With the exception of some federal aid after a natural disaster, he has stuck to his guns time and time again, through popularity and criticism, but after all is said and done, the man has served the people of the 14th district of Texas for 20 years with landslide margins of defeat, or has run unchallenged. I have my issues with some of his policies as well, but for someone to have that much strength and fortitude through rough times without bending over backwards for votes or for special interest groups, says all I need to know about the man's character.

He has also put some of the most daring bills into play time and time again, trying to rescue the American people from the clutches of the federal reserve and IRS. He speaks not for votes, but for the interest of the American people. He speaks not for special interests, but for the interests of AMERICAN PEOPLE. He knows damn well that going against the bastards in the FED have led to the death of multiple presidents, but what does he do? Just last week he put for the same "Abolition Act" calling for the end of the Federal Reserve. He's a brave man, that unlike McCain didn't stop after serving in the military.

This one man, with the right power could create drastic difference, unlike McCain and Obama who turn a blind eye if paid well enough.

Fisa, and all of the other things are not the right course, but his outlook and foundation of change is something we havent heard in a very long time. Can you agree? or will that disappoint the great ron god.

Their change is face value, Ron Paul's is intrinsic change.

The difference is they say it, he would die for it.

reply to post by AKINOFTHEFIRSSTARS


I'm issuing a write in ballot for Ron Paul. More of a statement than a vote, but I will not waiver and refuse to pander to some dumb ideological two party voting system.

And it is a sad state of affairs when people are debating about who lies the least in election, but not who is telling the most truth. McCain and Obama are just the new pollutants to what used to be the strongest nation in the world.

You should wake up, because its been like this since this country has started. The outside view looking will still proclaim we are the greatest, they have know idea about these minute details that we as americans must pay attention too. They are just new pollutants? No lets stick with that analogy and say that we have been contributing to this pollution for some time now. You think we can do this overnight? You have to get out of your comfort zone and realize, scandals, business, and illegal trade and operations are what keep some countries in business. Those things keep some countries known for being the "strongest nation". You need balance. Its always been about deciding who lies the least, it can be someone explaining the abolishment of slaves and they might have owned slaves, you talk about innocent lives lost to "acts of terror" and the only solution people can think of is "raid their cities, kill the innocent, and spread the fasle faith of liberty". The greatest pollutant was the person I bet you voted for twice.
What I am defending is the big picture. If it was honestly about honesty I can guarantee you we would be in a stale mate because we would not ever vote anyone in.

I'm deeply saddened to look at my country being knocked to it's knees by corruption and people stand back and defend these people

Thats exactly what the problem is. People sit back and put their faith into ron paul, Mccain, B.O. and whoever else. Some of the issues can be solved by the people alone. But yet, we wait for Gods like ron paul to save the day. What happens if he doesnt get elected, are you going to continue to bicker? Or will you still talk about how ron paul could have done it?
I am deeply saddened, people have surrendered thier logic, and reasoning in the belief that a representative or leader can really make a huge impact within the 'great plan'. These people are polluting the americas with a different element, change, it is up to us to make the next critcal step.
sorry for the typos

Originally posted by AKINOFTHEFIRSSTARS

because its been like this since this country has started. The outside view looking will still proclaim we are the greatest, they have know idea about these minute details that we as americans must pay attention too. They are just new pollutants?

I know it's been going on for awhile, hence "new."

Its always been about deciding who lies the least, it can be someone explaining the abolishment of slaves and they might have owned slaves, you talk about innocent lives lost to "acts of terror" and the only solution people can think of is "raid their cities, kill the innocent, and spread the fasle faith of liberty". The greatest pollutant was the person I bet you voted for twice.

It's because people like you settle. You settle and are content with lies and who tells them the least. You don't demand that another person be upfront and respect your humanity by telling you the truth. You demand that, and you're fine with that, where as I am not. I will not tolerate anybody lying to me, regardless of who it is, and especially if it's a person who may be leading my country, which includes, my family, my friends, and my country into a very dark era. You have found complacency in their bed of lies, where I have found my spirit and drive for pursing that of which I know is right and just!

What I am defending is the big picture. If it was honestly about honesty I can guarantee you we would be in a stale mate because we would not ever vote anyone in.

What your defending is your own apathetic outlook of how America is and why it is the way it is. You've completely justified indifference because you don't have the gumption or courage to stand for what is not just semi-right, but what is absolute! We have let these people get away with being mediocre because we have lowered our own standards and expected less. Where as you're fine with mediocrity for those that lead you, I see good coming from representatives like Mike Gravel, Marcy Kaptur, Mike Burgess, Ron Paul, Ralph Nader, Chuck Baldwin and the others fighting for the good of the people who they represent and people across the nation. Instead of being part of the solution, either helping these people, exposing the bastards, or making a change yourself, you're going to criticize every single person trying to do well and give your vote to a guy who is a proven fraud? Be the change you want to see, but don't write these people off as not giving a # after they risk their lives to save yours.

How could something go on forever and become new all of a sudden? I dont settle, I encourage people to think freely. I demand people tell me respect me and tell me the truth, but there lies the difference between you and I, I am in touch with reality. I know the difference from what I expect out of people and what I am really going to get. You speak of this peaceful election, where everything is so peachy. I thought everything could be fair at one point or another, but this is not the case, this is not reality. At least not the grand reality, you can get comfortable in your own imaginary bubble.

I will not tolerate anybody lying to me, regardless of who it is, and especially if it's a person who may be leading my country, which includes, my family, my friends, and my country into a very dark era.

take that same quote and replay it, before you voted for bush, and you would have been the same concrete dead flag that exist now.

I stand up what is right and absolute every single hour of the day. Believe that! But I have come to the understanding there is nothing absolute about politics or judging a humans life to meet everyones standards. You list all of these well known people who you believe can bring change. Nader even ran. Do you think you and me are the only individuals who want change? Think of this on a more grandscale. For some reason they never make it. Why is that? Is it because the people dont believe that they can make a difference. Those people you speak cannot create a change. Do you see how this very own discussion has divided two people,who wish the same outcome for their people? That is the true system of divide and conquer. I dont believe that any change will come from the system. When we ressurect our indenpendent minds we will see that the Laws were never intended to protect the 'people'. A wise man once told me the more laws you create the more criminals you have. Do you believe that system can honestly evolve from a wicked beast into a perfect angel? No way. The whole system must be broken down and rebuilt. Archaic idealogies cannot evolve the modern way of thinking.
So with that being said

Be the change you want to see, but don't write these people off as not giving a # after they risk their lives to save yours.

stepping in that seat or that light can be a tough role, look at every previous president(including those assassinated)even H.C. boiled under pressure. Change is from the ground up, no nader, god-paul, or any other 'party' for that matter.
When will we learn this, as Americans the citizens, 'the people' really make the decisions. We submit our freedom unto the false security of 'Liberty'. No kind of 'congress' will ever help us 'progress'.
sorry for typos
peace and love to all

reply to post by AKINOFTHEFIRSSTARS


How many times do I have to tell you that I didn't vote for Bush? I thought once, blatantly would be enough for anybody. The first time he was elected, I was too young. The second time, I didn't vote because of the choices given.

Originally posted by DeadFlagBlues


How many times do I have to tell you that I didn't vote for Bush? I thought once, blatantly would be enough for anybody. The first time he was elected, I was too young. The second time, I didn't vote because of the choices given.

Then you're only responsible for the second time, when you didn't vote against him.

Thanks for President Bush's second term.

reply to post by ZuzusPetals


It would have been the same with Kerry. We don't "elect" presidents, special interest groups hire them. This has nothing to do with wasted votes or stolen elections. This game is all about who will play ball best, and they're looking for the player with the best attributes. Bush is the perfect guy for the job. The idiot savant. If you think not voting/voting independent had anything to do with Bush' win, you're kidding yourself.

the guy is simply an asshole...you cant see that? are you 'blinded' by his parlour tricks, sleight of hand and bull#? THis guy never did anything for anyone......whats he riding on? hope? the change everything?

please use your head and answer that question.

I must disagree with your firearm comment. I'm just not sure banning assault weapons is the answer for anything. I am a firm believer that it is not the gun but rather the person behind the trigger. In addition most crimes are not performed with assault weapons. The crimes that are performed are not usually done with legally purchased weapons. The expense of purchasing an assault rifle is costly. Most criminals do not have the means to purchase, hence they obtain them despite the laws that are meant to protect. I have many "assault weapons" and the only crime I've ever committed is shooting paper. When you have figured out how to actually remove assault weapons from illegal operation I will stop legally using mine since you seem to have such a problem with it. By the way have you ever actually fired an assault rifle? I tend to see that most people that form an opinion such as yours seems to the misinformed. I would encourage enlightenment rather than opinion.

You are absolutely wrong.

I hate Bush, just as much as I hate Obama.

I along with everyone I know can give good legit reasons as to why they don't like him. He labeled McCain as erratic, yet he has changed his stances and plans several times.

Any loser will be bitter, its part of being human. It happened with everyone, even greats like Regan and Clinton being re-elected.