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I'm less concerned about the Georgai/SO passport/ethnic identification issue than I am about such activities if they turn up in parts of the Ukraine and Baltics. The Georgia/SO issue seems to have been let fester by all parties for whatever motives. If the issuing of passports to other regions comences it is no longer an isolated dispute and becomes a pattern of aggression.
Certainly Putin expected some type of reaction from the West over this. The question is, was he expecting some type of Chamberlainesque response or something closer to what we are seeing.
Russia is blessed to be so mineraly rich, but when you see the lack of respect for private property and rule of law, one has to wonder if its worth it to do business with them.
So, you think the Russians plan to retake all the breakaway republics? I don't know...
First and foremost, he's a nationalist, I think, not a capitalist. His actions always, to me at least, appear to be in the interest of Russia's place in the world and their bottom line. If you can do business with Putin/Russia that is mutually beneficial, I don't think there are any roadblocks to that.
I still can't understand why Russia didn't shut off the gas to Ukraine. I just don't get it. Have you got any ideas?
Originally posted by Turiddu
reply to post by WyrdeOne
It isn't really an act of aggression but the concern is that Russia will use the excuse of protecting "passport holders" as a guise to take control of the Crimea (home of a very important port for the Russian Black Sea Fleet, Sevastopol). When Russia occupied the two breakaway regions of Georgia it did so under the pretense of protecting "Russian passport holders".
The Crimea and other parts of the eastern Ukraine have many Pro-Russian allegiances so this scenario is not total fantasy I guess.
[edit on 19-8-2008 by Turiddu]
Well, the region in question has always identified with Russia more than Georgia, to the tune of 80-90% of the population I think. If they want to be Russians, and Russia will accept them, I don't see what's wrong with it.
Originally posted by jefwane
As one who grew up at the end of the Cold War, I had high hopes for the people of Russia's future. If there is any people that deserve the chance to live in peace and freedom for a little while it's them.
Originally posted by damagemouse
i know this is nuts but i hope we attack russia.
Surely the issue is that if the Ukrainian government decided to organize a referendum and Eastern Ukraine voted to secede, that would be one thing, but if Russia is deliberately taking steps that could lead to civil unrest that is another.
Is splitting along ethnic lines always progressive?
Would respective minority populations be treated as second-class citizens?
Would this perhaps open the door to other border disputes and civil unrest?
The point is it took that long for them to fully realise how being tied to the Russian economy and political system was not only an issue of them not possessing self-determination, it was a dead-end in terms of development. And in case of global war they would be expendable!
Originally posted by WyrdeOne
reply to post by Justice11
My argument is so weak that you won't address it directly, but you have to pull out a straw man?
You think Russians are so stupid they don't know whether or not they like Putin? Have you actually seen the press coverage of the man in his home country? It's not all glowing.
If you just think Americans are genetically superior or something, there's no arguing with you - you will never see reason.
Russia holds the key to economic prosperity for the region, and indeed they hold the key to comfort and survival when it comes to the pipelines.
Originally posted by Justice11
Pro-russian alligences sure but to say your being persecuted come save us ,and an Army coming to occupy a democratic country?No.This has to do with Russia wanting to absorb these democratic states.If these russians want to live in Russia they can move there.Its like me saying im canadian living in the US but i want the Canadian army to annex this territory from the US because of "ethnic cleansing by US forces".Its a ploy used in the past by dictators not democratic societies.HItler did it before world war 2 with austria ,czechslovakia and the Danzig corridor.
[edit on 19-8-2008 by Justice11]